[hotrod2448]

Originally Posted by HPIA4v2

Don't want to read too much into this but...
If it's always the turbo on cylinder 4,5.6 that fails then Steve Dinan might be right that N54 TT engine has cylinder 6 being too hot. I like their S/W to adjust water pump speed to take care the extra heat (not too crazy about the price though)

That's kind of what I was getting at. Although it could just as easily be a packaging issue or something along those lines.

Originally Posted by HPIA4v2

The rattling sound is from the slop that develops on this wastegate; It's like a piece of circular thin metal that attatch to actuator rod covering the vane toward the turbine. I suppose if you extent the rod just a little you can minimize the slop but that just delaying the obvious since this thing gets hot.

I know what a wastegate is and how it works. I was more curious if we knew exact failure mode, what part of the system was the issue. (the actuator, flapper, linkage, sensor/ software issue making it react oddly, etc...)

Originally Posted by HPIA4v2

I can't believe BMW put in a rebuild turbo, I think the labor is probably more than the turbo itself. Unless this Mits turbo is like $1500 a piece.

Did somebody get a rebuild as a replacement? I find that hard to believe.

[fast_lap28]

Originally Posted by BigPum

Picked my car up yesterday, everything seems much better, no noise and car pulls strong through the RPMs. The notes on my paperwork indicate that the dealership referred to SIB 11-13-07 and 11-14-07. The vacuum hoses and connections were fine, then they filed a Puma case, BMW instructed them to go ahead and replace turbo on cyclinders 4,5,6 due to faulty wastegate and sticking actuator. It was replaced with a remanufactured turbo, but I kinda expected that. At least BMW was good enough to resolve the issue and not leave me hanging. The dealership was great too. Hope this info helps others that are having this problem. If I can be of any help, PM me. Good luck!

Originally Posted by hotrod2448

That's kind of what I was getting at. Although it could just as easily be a packaging issue or something along those lines.


I know what a wastegate is and how it works. I was more curious if we knew exact failure mode, what part of the system was the issue. (the actuator, flapper, linkage, sensor/ software issue making it react oddly, etc...)



Did somebody get a rebuild as a replacement? I find that hard to believe.

that's what BigPum said....unbelieveable!

[hotrod2448]

Originally Posted by fast_lap28

that's what BigPum said....unbelieveable!

I missed that.
Interesting.

[adc]

My impression is that cylinders 5 and 6 get a little hot and it's definitely because of packaging. If you look in the engine compartment, they are wedged under the top of the bulkhead, with practically no air circulation. The fact that the turbo downpipes are right besides/under them cannot help either.

If this is truly the problem, then BMW would have to re-engineer the water channels towards the rear of the engine - I think anything short of that would just be a temporary bandaid.

I'm taking my car in Monday, let's see what turbo gets replaced. And let's see how long it will last.

[pikkashoe]

Wow just saw the video, I have to check mine out, i always have the music playing, and im noticing some lag between shifts which was not present before.

[5soko]

i kno the problem isnt solved yet but, isnt the problem of the wastegate to begin with. BMWNA knows this is the problem as per the TSB.
right?

[radgator1]

Originally Posted by HPIA4v2

Don't want to read too much into this but...
If it's always the turbo on cylinder 4,5.6 that fails then Steve Dinan might be right that N54 TT engine has cylinder 6 being too hot. I like their S/W to adjust water pump speed to take care the extra heat (not too crazy about the price though)

The rattling sound is from the slop that develops on this wastegate; It's like a piece of circular thin metal that attatch to actuator rod covering the vane toward the turbine. I suppose if you extent the rod just a little you can minimize the slop but that just delaying the obvious since this thing gets hot.

I can't believe BMW put in a rebuild turbo, I think the labor is probably more than the turbo itself. Unless this Mits turbo is like $1500 a piece.

Dinan? Federico from RDSport wrote this a year ago on 3/14/07:

I am not an engineer at BMW AG but I do have contacts wth the engineers that work at FIZ. I want to share some information that may be useful, and I apologize in advance if you guys already know most of this. All numbers quoted are DIN at the crank.

BMW is working at releasing an N54 HP motor by the end of this year. Although the platforms that will be equipped with this version have not yet been decided, it is safe to say that the E90 through E93 platforms will get it as soon as it is available. The expected HP rating is around 355PS, up from the standard 306PS of today's motor. The current HP test engines have exacerbated a problem that already exists on the current 306PS motor, where the temperatures of cylinders 5 and 6 are higher than expected and are a huge cause for concern. BMW is looking at a solution to this problem, and is also anticipating that they may experience some engine failures on the current motor. What is clear, is that they heve to wrestle the cause of the problem, and/or find a solution, before they release the N54 HP version into the market.

In typical BMW fashion, these issues are monitored without being made public, as they do not want to have to answer to any unwanted warranty claim, or even worse, be forced to issue a general recall that may prove to be unecessary, as they will address the isolated cases on a one-by-one basis. This is no different than how they handled the piston ring/oil consumption problem on the early S62 motor. Don't be surprised, if they should decide to keep the standard 306PS version alongside the HP (i.e. in the 135i), to see next year's engine to be a little different than what is offered today.

If any of you have driven your 335i hard, you may have noticed a tendency for the oil temperatures to be a little high. The problem is that the temperature gauge is measuring the average temperature once the oil recirculates, so you can imagine, if cylinders 5 and 6 are the ones generating most of the heat, that this is an area that could be prone to failure.

Recently Alpina introduced their Alpina B3 BiTurbo at the Geneva Auto Salón. The car is rated at 360PS, and this is the level of power that BMW feels safe with at this point. We may sit here and go back and forth on who of the vendors on this board produces the most power and why, but surely nobody will try to argue that Alpina does not have the resources, nor the expertise, to extract every bit of power from the N54 motor. Just keep in mind that they have had experience with turbocharged BMW motors that goes back 30 years, and have been consulting with BMW on the development of the N54 motor itself.

Like Alpina and BMW, Racing Dynamics S.p.A. and its U.S. arm RDSport are approacing this subject with caution, and our current offering is a result of many factors: the main one is the oveheating issue, but most of the others haven't even been mentioned anywhere in this thread.

Good luck to all.

Racing Dynamics S.p.A./RDSport
Federico L. Pavoncelli
President

The funniest part was Shiv's reply that basically Federico was full of sh*t and that he had measured EGT's in both downpipes and they were the same so 5 and 6 couldn't be running hotter

[pikkashoe]

Wow interesting reading radgator. It does seem its always the rear cylinders going (4,5,6). Hmm.

[AU335]

Originally Posted by BigPum

Picked my car up yesterday, everything seems much better, no noise and car pulls strong through the RPMs. The notes on my paperwork indicate that the dealership referred to SIB 11-13-07 and 11-14-07. The vacuum hoses and connections were fine, then they filed a Puma case, BMW instructed them to go ahead and replace turbo on cyclinders 4,5,6 due to faulty wastegate and sticking actuator. It was replaced with a remanufactured turbo, but I kinda expected that. At least BMW was good enough to resolve the issue and not leave me hanging. The dealership was great too. Hope this info helps others that are having this problem. If I can be of any help, PM me. Good luck!

Well at least you got it all fixed! Congrats. I will accept a reman. turbo b/c of my whole situation with the 2nd cat delete. I just had them put back on yesterday and am dropping my car off tomorrow morning at another dealership. Hoepfully they will do the same and get everything fixed. If not....

Also, you said you are completely stock and always have been? I am going to tell them, if they give me any BS about putting my 2nd cat back on, that just recentley a person had the same issue in PA and BMWNA replaced the turbo with a reman. turbo.

[raceyBMW]

As far as the remanufactured turbo/manifold is concerned, I think every single one of the turbos are going to be remans. Just go on realoem and look up the turbo, the only option is a reman turbo. I wouldn't be worried about it.

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by BigPum

PiIt was replaced with a remanufactured turbo, b!

Wow, remanufactured turbos are available? Are these turbos used in other cars, if not, I assume these turbos are failed units from other 335i(s).

Originally Posted by AU335

Well at least you got it all fixed! Congrats. I will accept a reman. turbo b/c of my whole situation with the 2nd cat delete. I just had them put back on yesterday and am dropping my car off tomorrow morning at another dealership. Hoepfully they will do the same and get everything fixed. If not....

Good luck.

[turbodan]

They're tagged remanufactured for customs reasons. If I put a reman and a turbo off of a brand new 335 on the table in front of you, you will see that they're identical in every way. New castings, new components. They're new parts.

We're not talking about Autozone remans here. Calm down...

[BigPum]

Originally Posted by AU335

Also, you said you are completely stock and always have been? I am going to tell them, if they give me any BS about putting my 2nd cat back on, that just recentley a person had the same issue in PA and BMWNA replaced the turbo with a reman. turbo.

Yeah, bone stock since day one. Let me know if they give you a hard time, I'll fax you my paperwork so they can look up the codes, etc. Thanks again for posting the video and bringing this issue to the forefront. Hope it all works out for you!

[Fraposo]

Just got back my car the other day after dropping it off at the dealer for about 9 days. I was told fairly quickly that my "ticking problem" was caused by a waste gate failure so they ordered all the parts necessary and made the repairs. I've attached the service form with all the parts that were replaced for your own "pleasure" and so that you can use this just in case a dealership tries to tell you that the sound is "normal". I've had the car for about 2 days so far and have driven about 160 miles after the repairs and the annoying rattling/ticking sound that I had before is definitely gone. Hopefully it is gone for good. I hope this service form can be useful to someone here and to increase our knowledge over this wastegate issue some more. Feel free to PM with any questions.

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by Fraposo

Just got back my car the other day after dropping it off at the dealer for about 9 days. I was told fairly quickly that my "ticking problem" was caused by a waste gate failure so they ordered all the parts necessary and made the repairs. I've attached the service form with all the parts that were replaced for your own "pleasure" and so that you can use this just in case a dealership tries to tell you that the sound is "normal". I've had the car for about 2 days so far and have driven about 160 miles after the repairs and the annoying rattling/ticking sound that I had before is definitely gone. Hopefully it is gone for good. I hope this service form can be useful to someone here and to increase our knowledge over this wastegate issue some more. Feel free to PM with any questions.

Thanks for the info, however I would suggest you black out the top information.

[Fraposo]

Good call, updated and edited.

[5soko]

service note seem interesting:

found waste gate rattling warr RNI 1-3/ 4-6 turbos chargers, R & repl. turbo waste gates .adjust turbo waste gate.


looks like they didnt need to change the whole turbo, just the acutuator & seals.

[NightHawk CL9]

ummm...time to take the 335 into service. like everyone said i also thought it was normal, but in the past month its been very loud. Actually yesterday i was thinking what it could be, and while revving the motor you cannot hear it. What i did was gradually accelerate to 3000rpm, no noise. the moment i let off the gas it started ticking. SO driving on the street accelerating there is no noise, but when letting off the gas and the revs fall the ticking occurs. I also park in a closed parking structure where i it echoes, and in first (6MT) when it engine brakes and at about 1500rpm (in gear) it starts the ticking noise again. But i can duplicate the problem anytime revving past 2500rpm and letting off the gas. I hope they lemon the car so i can get a AW E92, but thats not gonna happen. BTW, i am completely stock, minus the E46 ZPH shift knob.

[StrauserED_335i]

There is a little Torlon bushing that controls the motion of the wastgate rod. Torlon is a plastic capable of some pretty high temps (+250degC) but extrudes when things get too hot. It essentially 'pinches' the wastegate rod. Poorly placed w/g cans and insufficient underhood ventilation will cause the problem...

[Aridk]

The other day i noticed a tickering noice (similar to the on e in the video) when startin up (cold)especialy loud with the left door open, it seemed to disapear while the engine was warming up. I have 10000 miles on the clock and is stock and has always been. My question is have any of you have some uncalled for acclerations on steady throttle?

[caesardog217]

Add me to the list of that lovely noise. I had it when I was stock and just added sstt. The noise went away for about a day, but its back.

[N54Love]

Me too. Going in to BMW South County in San Diego tomorrow AM.