[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

It's possible... more likely they will just use biological gender or it will just become statistically irrelevant by itself.

Therein lies the rub. Biological gender doesn't matter anymore. It's all on what you 'identify' as. That's the whole point of this thread...the guy didn't have to prove anything.

[Never_Enough]

I identify as non-insurance paying.

Ok so now I can drive without it & be ok, right?

[1MOREMOD]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

Therein lies the rub. Biological gender doesn't matter anymore. It's all on what you 'identify' as. That's the whole point of this thread...the guy didn't have to prove anything.

Right but If they base it on biological gender you can identify as whatever you like but still pay according to your actual gender.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by TheWatchGuy

so since you think Trump does it, that makes it ok?

I mean if the president can do it why not the average Joe right.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

Therein lies the rub. Biological gender doesn't matter anymore. It's all on what you 'identify' as. That's the whole point of this thread...the guy didn't have to prove anything.

Oh it does matter. Some people just like to push the narrative that it doesn't.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

Right but If they base it on biological gender you can identify as whatever you like but still pay according to your actual gender.

You're missing the point....there is no requirement to specify your biological gender. A new driver does not have to disclose their biological gender so there is no historical information.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by Never_Enough

I identify as non-insurance paying.

Ok so now I can drive without it & be ok, right?

Get with the program....

Being a Sovereign Citizen is where it is at....

Driver's licenses and insurance are government mandated constructs and therefore doesn't apply to Soverign Citizens. Because Sovereign Citizens travel and are not driving.

[Never_Enough]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

Get with the program....

Being a Sovereign Citizen is where it is at....

Driver's licenses and insurance are government mandated constructs and therefore doesn't apply to Soverign Citizens. Because Sovereign Citizens travel and are not driving.

I don't identify as a citizen, sir. I'm a non-binary nomad race car.

[1MOREMOD]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

You're missing the point....there is no requirement to specify your biological gender. A new driver does not have to disclose their biological gender so there is no historical information.

Sure they do how else do young Male drivers pay more than female counterparts?

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

Sure they do how else do young Male drivers pay more than female counterparts?

Holy crap man. Why is the so hard to grasp. We all know male drivers pay more...this is the point of this thread.

A male driver legally changed his gender on his birth certificate, drivers license, etc for the sole purpose of lower insurance rates. All he needed was a note from his doctor. The insurance company reduced his rate because on paper he is now female. Nothing to do with genetics, history, etc. Just the 'F' on the paperwork.

My point is...now that you don't have to disclose your gender or can easily change it on paper, how will insurance companies deal with this? My suspicion is that sex will no longer be a factor when it comes to insurance rates.

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

Holy crap man. Why is the so hard to grasp. We all know male drivers pay more...this is the point of this thread.

A male driver legally changed his gender on his birth certificate, drivers license, etc for the sole purpose of lower insurance rates. All he needed was a note from his doctor. The insurance company reduced his rate because on paper he is now female. Nothing to do with genetics, history, etc. Just the 'F' on the paperwork.

My point is...now that you don't have to disclose your gender or can easily change it on paper, how will insurance companies deal with this? My suspicion is that sex will no longer be a factor when it comes to insurance rates.

Actually, male drivers don't always pay more, as I illustrated in my previous post. In the US, that would be considered insurance fraud if he did it for the sole purpose of lower insurance rates. I realize things are different in Canada, just talking about what I know.

Gender will still be relevant, you think insurance companies use only what you disclose to them to rate you? Hell no. They use a lot of data outside of what you tell them to come up with a rate. I am not sure you understand what you are talking about.

[TheWatchGuy]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Actually, male drivers don't always pay more, as I illustrated in my previous post. In the US, that would be considered insurance fraud if he did it for the sole purpose of lower insurance rates. I realize things are different in Canada, just talking about what I know.

Gender will still be relevant, you think insurance companies use only what you disclose to them to rate you? Hell no. They use a lot of data outside of what you tell them to come up with a rate. I am not sure you understand what you are talking about.

2 young drivers with no prior driving record. male pays more a majority of the time.

its gender discrimination, but because anti male, not a big deal. being gender fluid fixes that.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Actually, male drivers don't always pay more, as I illustrated in my previous post. In the US, that would be considered insurance fraud if he did it for the sole purpose of lower insurance rates. I realize things are different in Canada, just talking about what I know.

I get it that some jurisdictions have different rates but in this case the guys changed the gender indicated on his paperwork to receive a lower rate.

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Gender will still be relevant, you think insurance companies use only what you disclose to them to rate you? Hell no. They use a lot of data outside of what you tell them to come up with a rate. I am not sure you understand what you are talking about.

Again, the actual gender of the guy was irrelevant. He legally changed the gender specified on his paperwork without having to offer any proof of gender. We all know that insurance companies use all sorts of stats to determine rates, that's not the question. In Ontario recently a person was issued a birth certificate with the gender specified X. When that person applies for insurance how with they use their gender in part to determine a rate?

[1MOREMOD]

Maybe you are having a hard time grasping. Rates typically are based on number of factors age, sex type car and so on. If it becomes the norm to be able to change your sex at will without proving anything all insurance needs to do is base their rate on what you are born as not what you identify as. You cant say you have a yugo and get insurance for a Lamborghini? Called fraud.

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by TheWatchGuy

2 young drivers with no prior driving record. male pays more a majority of the time.

its gender discrimination, but because anti male, not a big deal. being gender fluid fixes that.

Sure, under 25 likely true because women are more mature and young boys do stupid shit (I know from experience). Post 25, not so much anymore. The trends are changing and along with it are incidence rates and insurance quotes.

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

I get it that some jurisdictions have different rates but in this case the guys changed the gender indicated on his paperwork to receive a lower rate.



Again, the actual gender of the guy was irrelevant. He legally changed the gender specified on his paperwork without having to offer any proof of gender. We all know that insurance companies use all sorts of stats to determine rates, that's not the question. In Ontario recently a person was issued a birth certificate with the gender specified X. When that person applies for insurance how with they use their gender in part to determine a rate?

They will likely treat it like they do when they cannot find the information, either use the higher rate by default or use a weighted value based off an assumption of male vs. female demographics for the area.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

Maybe you are having a hard time grasping. Rates typically are based on number of factors age, sex type car and so on. If it becomes the norm to be able to change your sex at will without proving anything all insurance needs to do is base their rate on what you are born as not what you identify as. You cant say you have a yugo and get insurance for a Lamborghini? Called fraud.

I don't think I'm the one who has the hard time grasping...are you reading the story? I think the story and the points I have made are as clear as can be. Again, the guy legally changed his gender (not what he identifies as) on all the legal documents required by his insurance company. As far as the insurance company is concerned he is female and his insurance rates reflected that.

My point again is that as you stated if people are able to change their gender without proof which is what this guy did, insurance companies are going to have to compensate for it. It's not fraud, it's privacy and discrimination laws we have to blame.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

They will likely treat it like they do when they cannot find the information, either use the higher rate by default or use a weighted value based off an assumption of male vs. female demographics for the area.

I agree with you on that point.