[BrianMN]

Originally Posted by ar design

Part of the issue is the OEM thermostat that does not open till about 250F, which makes it basically impossible for the oil to stay at 250F. Which is why we are working on a 180F thermostat setup, which will be available at a discount for customers that currently have our setup.

Are you suggesting that if there was no thermostat AT ALL, my temps would be lower than what they are? I understand you saying it's hard to keep them at 250, but keeping them at 255? 260? 265? I don't see the issue.

Originally Posted by ar design

It seems you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder, if there is anything me/ar design needs to resolve with you, please give me a call at the shop and I will be more than happy to get anything straightened out! 303-351-3515.

No chip on my shoulder at all....you and AR have all my respect for top-notch customer service and putting out the highest-quality products.

What I don't like to see is a claiming a product will do something it doesn't. As I said in my review; the OC kit I bought is the best quality it could be....just not big enough to make it effective. Quality of parts alone doesn't make a oil cooler work.

If you are going to be selling the same OC kit that I bought, you should make sure that the customers have realistic expectations about it.... that it will not alleviate heat on the track. Not to say that it's all your fault, as I should have known that a core that small wouldn't make a big difference.

OR, you could scrap the Stg 1 OC kit and try it with a much larger core in front of the radiator as I suggested. Plenty of real-estate there, and it'd be worth the incremental cost of the larger core. Simply put- the current core does nothing; therefore shouldn't be sold. Try a bigger core and if it works, sell it and make a bunch of track guys happy

If you would like, I will buy a [large] Setrab core, mount it and test it out at the track to possibly give a good suggestion.

[GetSomeE92]

Is there sufficient air flow out of the oil cooler? I see the air ducts into it but it looks like all the hot air coming out of the other side will have no where to go. Doesn't look like the panel in the wheel well is vented, but I could be wrong.

[Adam Way]

Panel is vented. (poor pic)

[Prince ///M]

Bigger oil cooler are a waste of space and money if you don't upgrade water radiator first.

Install the BMW performance kit unit (you can buy it without the upgraded fan that does little to nothing), add the cheapest OC you can find (probably the cp-e in combo with their IC) and enjoy your track sessions.

[BrianMN]

Originally Posted by Prince ///M

Bigger oil cooler are a waste of space and money if you don't upgrade water radiator first.

Install the BMW performance kit unit (you can buy it without the upgraded fan that does little to nothing), add the cheapest OC you can find (probably the cp-e in combo with their IC) and enjoy your track sessions.

I'd love to see any data of this.

Otherwise you're as wrong as my grandma's thong

[Adam Way]

Prince, although I have an upgraded radiator now, I didn't a year ago. The stage 1 oil cooler was a HUGE necessity (especially since my vehicle didn't come with an oil cooler). Without going off topic in this thread, I respectfully disagree.

[MilehighM3]

Also let's not confuse oil pressure with oil volume. The pressure is set by the oil pump and it's internals based on design and engineering by BMW. Replacing the oil cooler will not change this, or by adding an additional cooler. Restrictions create pressure. The thermostat will create more of a restriction than a cooler core would. Doesn't matter what temp the t stat opens at, so replacing it won't change that either. Bottom line is that kit looks great and very functional. I'm sure your car will stay much cooler now, even on short tracks where airflow is limited due to lower speeds. ie PPIR :-)

[cvc 22349a]

[QUOTE=vasillalov;10560415]


I am simply trying to get more concrete understanding of the inner workings of the N54 and how certain mods affect the longevity of the engine.

Here are some examples as to why:
1. Catless dowpipes seem to be the rage for making good power. I own a set of AR catless downpipes because of the quality welds. Yeah, we are all making power with catless downpipes, but as it turns out, our turbos need certain amount of back pressure, or after a while the turbo seals begin to fail.

2. The OCC saga.. Everyone was making and selling all kinds of oil catch cans. Turns out, there is a delicate balance in the crank case system which most occs interrupt. So, it turns out stock is better than most OCCs out there.

3. AR performance radiator saga. Need I say more?...


AMEN

[InsaneDriver]

Originally Posted by ar design

There have been a number of reviews/tests posted on this forum by customers. Part of the issue is the OEM thermostat that does not open till about 250F, which makes it basically impossible for the oil to stay at 250F. Which is why we are working on a 180F thermostat setup, which will be available at a discount for customers that currently have our setup.

Why don't you use an higher thermostat setup, for example 210F and this way keep the operating oil temps closer to the original?

[Aridk]

Nice design AR like the fact that it retains the brake cooling ducts they must be there for a reason

Now let´s hear some more about the teaser turbo shot in the other thread please don´t have it turn out the way your single turbo thread did

[tibra1]

Originally Posted by BrianMN

Cool!

Pretty bummed the 'regular' AR Oil kit did practically nothing to cool temps down.

Hopefully the OP can get some [good] track data on this!

Modding is defintly a progression n just to add I was one of the first last year to state that dual core oil coolers mounted in the wheels n run sequentially was the best design..mounting one radiator in front of another or running a marginally larger core in the stock position was never not optimal and certainly not at the price point they were presented.

ER came to market w a sequential dual core design..and its good to see others followin suit and making the market competitive.

On another note regarding temps n t-stats..I see the most power out of my car at 240-250 range and it makes sense since this engine was designed to run at these temps..there seems to be this push to always run cooler temps than this..which when you strive to do has other implications. as others have pointed out time to reach proper operating temps..especially in the winter time is critical for burn off of condensation..if you are tracking..and have a setup that maintains 240-250..then IMO that is a win all around..

A bullet proof track car immune to cooling issues, would compromise an upgraded radiator and this type of oil cooler setup..and I think its very big of Andrew to concede some of the shorting comings with their radiator and original oil cooler design.

Being able to beat the crap outta this car on a track and not even having to stress at monitoring oil/water temps would be nothing short of TOTAL WIN.

[ar design]

Originally Posted by BrianMN

Are you suggesting that if there was no thermostat AT ALL, my temps would be lower than what they are? I understand you saying it's hard to keep them at 250, but keeping them at 255? 260? 265? I don't see the issue.




No chip on my shoulder at all....you and AR have all my respect for top-notch customer service and putting out the highest-quality products.

What I don't like to see is a claiming a product will do something it doesn't. As I said in my review; the OC kit I bought is the best quality it could be....just not big enough to make it effective. Quality of parts alone doesn't make a oil cooler work.

If you are going to be selling the same OC kit that I bought, you should make sure that the customers have realistic expectations about it.... that it will not alleviate heat on the track. Not to say that it's all your fault, as I should have known that a core that small wouldn't make a big difference.

OR, you could scrap the Stg 1 OC kit and try it with a much larger core in front of the radiator as I suggested. Plenty of real-estate there, and it'd be worth the incremental cost of the larger core. Simply put- the current core does nothing; therefore shouldn't be sold. Try a bigger core and if it works, sell it and make a bunch of track guys happy

If you would like, I will buy a [large] Setrab core, mount it and test it out at the track to possibly give a good suggestion.

Yes, I think a lower temp thermostat would help a LOT. Shoot me a PM, we are going to need some testers and feedback etc.

Originally Posted by GetSomeE92

Is there sufficient air flow out of the oil cooler? I see the air ducts into it but it looks like all the hot air coming out of the other side will have no where to go. Doesn't look like the panel in the wheel well is vented, but I could be wrong.

Yes, there are massive vents riveted into each fender liner.

Originally Posted by Aridk

Nice design AR like the fact that it retains the brake cooling ducts they must be there for a reason

That was a huge pain LOL......

[335okc]

i'm very intrigued, can i see a pic of the cooler from the wheel arch?
do you guys use some kind of cover or just leave the core exposed?

also, what's the dimension of each of the core ?

[DefactoM6]

The thing is, to have a car that will hold 240-250 on track, I would venture a guess that a 180 degree tstat would be needed to ensure those kind of temps when running stock OC+an auxiliary cooler...so it brings us back to square one...and this is why we need it.

[Turkeybaster115]

Originally Posted by Jeff@topgearsolutions

180 is not really a big deal. Take your average sports or exotic and they are right in that area as well. All of them shooting for under 195 Oil temps. I'd gladly take a 180 thermostat if I could simply retrofit that.

180F degrees is fine. The issue is having oil at that temperature flow out into the oil cooler at that temp. The fear is that moisture won't be burned off before hitting the engine again. Those with STETT for example have reported some sort of noise during engine warm up, and I suspect this is the reason why. The perfect thing for everyone, including those living in cold climates is a 210F thermostat, or at least a choice between the two.

[Turkeybaster115]

Originally Posted by ar design

There have been a number of reviews/tests posted on this forum by customers. Part of the issue is the OEM thermostat that does not open till about 250F, which makes it basically impossible for the oil to stay at 250F. Which is why we are working on a 180F thermostat setup, which will be available at a discount for customers that currently have our setup.

The OEM thermostat opens at 230F, and is fully opened at 260F.

[Turkeybaster115]

Originally Posted by vasillalov

AR Design,

Have you guys measured the oil pressure drop through those oil cooler kits? What is the BMW spec for min and max values for oil pressure for the N54?

I see a lot of companies releasing oil cooler kits and also a lot of people rigging their own, but I've never seen anyone post actual technical data of how the oil pressure is getting affected.

When my old non-stainless steel oil lines burst, the low oil pressure light came on almost immediately. The system is very sensitive to oil pressure drops so, even if there is a little drop in pressure with this dual setup, it would get pick up right away.

[Alpina_B3_Lux]

Originally Posted by Turkeybaster115

When my old non-stainless steel oil lines burst, the low oil pressure light came on almost immediately. The system is very sensitive to oil pressure drops so, even if there is a little drop in pressure with this dual setup, it would get pick up right away.

Same for me. The oil lines of my AR Design oil cooler burst a few weeks ago, and the red engine light came on immediately.

Alpina_B3_Lux

[enrita]

Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux

Same for me. The oil lines of my AR Design oil cooler burst a few weeks ago, and the red engine light came on immediately.

Alpina_B3_Lux

[TurboBimmer]

AR sent me stainless steel lines, as the ones supplied with the stage 2 oilcooler are starting to tear. Great customer service

OT: This new setup looks solid!

Don't the Euro cars have a different thermostat which opens around 210F?

[Turkeybaster115]

Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux

Same for me. The oil lines of my AR Design oil cooler burst a few weeks ago, and the red engine light came on immediately.

Alpina_B3_Lux

Wow! that's unbelievable. AR always tries to blame the install for the break. with this many breaks how can anyone argue otherwise? Just contact AR for 2 new, free stainless steel lines. At this point its only best for them to "recall" all those nylon line kits they sold.

[ruphianh]

Originally Posted by Adam Way

Transcooler for AT. Correct. The radiator that comes stock is weird and had a dual purpose. By upgrading that radiator I needed to find an alternative set-up. I haven't heard of anyone doing this before either. Not sure why. When you are higher than say 450 HP I don't know why more people aren't doing this. I will take some pictures soon and post.

People aren't doing it becuase $$

If I had the money I would love to do it.

How much did you spend for the package installed.