[bren335i]

Okay i usually keep my mouth shut but this thread cought my eye

As a professional tuner for Subarus and EVOs, i think this intake is a sad design and has NO data to support its actual gains. There is no boost or air fuel chart with the dyno graph. When you install the high flow air filter you can skew the maf signal (not sure what the 335i uses) and create more boost or a leaner air fuel. Unless you logged before and after datalogs with consistent temps and IATs then i dont beleive those gains one bit. Back in the day everyone who ran out and bought an INJEN or AEM intake read the gains and installed them on their STis to find out that the only gains they were seeing wasnt from a free flow intake but more the fact the car almost ran a full point leaner under boost due to the non stock design. All your gains are most likely from running tubulance from your straight pipe design making the maf read differently and putting the car in an unsafe leaner condition.

As much as I dont want discredit your work there is no proof. On top of that it sits right in the engine bay above the heads, eating up hot air. Anyone can dyno a car with a fan on the intake making it simulate cool air, but not when the hood is down in real world conditions. That filter is SEEING 220+ degree temps and your intake air temperature sensor is noticing this and pulling degrees of timing to compensate. This will cause detonation in some instances especially idling for a while and then going into boost. There is a reason why BMW pulls air from outside the motor. Do not use the "the air heats up at the turbo anyways" the IAT sensor will sense this and compensate. I see this all the time on the dyno. When someone shows up with a short ram intake i tell them to get rid of it if they want power and consistencys and less tendency to knock.


On top of that it looks like something i could have made at home depot, down to the ebay filter. I suggest you go back to the drawing board if you are going to charge $335. I can't sit here and let it go unnoticed any longer. I suggest you bring real data to the table.

I would like to see:

Air fuel plots - before and after
Boost plots - before and after
Intake air temps - before and after
Idling temps - before and after
maf V and grams per second - before and after

especially with a car like the 335i with high oil temps to start adding more heat to the table with a open element engine bay filter is a bad bad idea. Unless i see data like above it really is just another ebay-esque intake idea.

[crimsone90]

Originally Posted by bren335i

Okay i usually keep my mouth shut but this thread cought my eye

As a professional tuner for Subarus and EVOs, i think this intake is a sad design and has NO data to support its actual gains. There is no boost or air fuel chart with the dyno graph. When you install the high flow air filter you can skew the maf signal (not sure what the 335i uses) and create more boost or a leaner air fuel. Unless you logged before and after datalogs with consistent temps and IATs then i dont beleive those gains one bit. Back in the day everyone who ran out and bought an INJEN or AEM intake read the gains and installed them on their STis to find out that the only gains they were seeing wasnt from a free flow intake but more the fact the car almost ran a full point leaner under boost due to the non stock design. All your gains are most likely from running tubulance from your straight pipe design making the maf read differently and putting the car in an unsafe leaner condition.

As much as I dont want discredit your work there is no proof. On top of that it sits right in the engine bay above the heads, eating up hot air. Anyone can dyno a car with a fan on the intake making it simulate cool air, but not when the hood is down in real world conditions. That filter is SEEING 220+ degree temps and your intake air temperature sensor is noticing this and pulling degrees of timing to compensate. This will cause detonation in some instances especially idling for a while and then going into boost. There is a reason why BMW pulls air from outside the motor. Do not use the "the air heats up at the turbo anyways" the IAT sensor will sense this and compensate. I see this all the time on the dyno. When someone shows up with a short ram intake i tell them to get rid of it if they want power and consistencys and less tendency to knock.


On top of that it looks like something i could have made at home depot, down to the ebay filter. I suggest you go back to the drawing board if you are going to charge $335. I can't sit here and let it go unnoticed any longer. I suggest you bring real data to the table.

I would like to see:

Air fuel plots - before and after
Boost plots - before and after
Intake air temps - before and after
Idling temps - before and after
maf V and grams per second - before and after

especially with a car like the 335i with high oil temps to start adding more heat to the table with a open element engine bay filter is a bad bad idea. Unless i see data like above it really is just another ebay-esque intake idea.

+1

The 335 makes STOCK 270whp and 280wtq! What's so critical about this intake design that raises the horsepower by 12whp? Looking at the graph it looks like the 258whp was just a cold dyno run hence the lower numbers and the ~270whp was a hot properly done run.

I`m not bashing the product, Going from an airbox design to a tubing design would actually reduce horsepower if the proper heatshielding is not added. I just would like to know 1) Why would this cost $350 if is just a tube with a filter? And 2) Whats so different about this design that actually increases horsepower by 12whp?

[bren335i]

the part that makes it prove my point even more (or the cold engine remark) is the fact the curve follows the exact same powerband as the stock map, this would mean it ran leaner with the same boost/timing curve and picked up some HP that way.

[Grac]

Originally Posted by bren335i

Okay i usually keep my mouth shut but this thread cought my eye

As a professional tuner for Subarus and EVOs, i think this intake is a sad design and has NO data to support its actual gains. There is no boost or air fuel chart with the dyno graph. When you install the high flow air filter you can skew the maf signal (not sure what the 335i uses) and create more boost or a leaner air fuel. Unless you logged before and after datalogs with consistent temps and IATs then i dont beleive those gains one bit. Back in the day everyone who ran out and bought an INJEN or AEM intake read the gains and installed them on their STis to find out that the only gains they were seeing wasnt from a free flow intake but more the fact the car almost ran a full point leaner under boost due to the non stock design. All your gains are most likely from running tubulance from your straight pipe design making the maf read differently and putting the car in an unsafe leaner condition.

As much as I dont want discredit your work there is no proof. On top of that it sits right in the engine bay above the heads, eating up hot air. Anyone can dyno a car with a fan on the intake making it simulate cool air, but not when the hood is down in real world conditions. That filter is SEEING 220+ degree temps and your intake air temperature sensor is noticing this and pulling degrees of timing to compensate. This will cause detonation in some instances especially idling for a while and then going into boost. There is a reason why BMW pulls air from outside the motor. Do not use the "the air heats up at the turbo anyways" the IAT sensor will sense this and compensate. I see this all the time on the dyno. When someone shows up with a short ram intake i tell them to get rid of it if they want power and consistencys and less tendency to knock.


On top of that it looks like something i could have made at home depot, down to the ebay filter. I suggest you go back to the drawing board if you are going to charge $335. I can't sit here and let it go unnoticed any longer. I suggest you bring real data to the table.

I would like to see:

Air fuel plots - before and after
Boost plots - before and after
Intake air temps - before and after
Idling temps - before and after
maf V and grams per second - before and after

especially with a car like the 335i with high oil temps to start adding more heat to the table with a open element engine bay filter is a bad bad idea. Unless i see data like above it really is just another ebay-esque intake idea.

Hey Dude,

Check it out!!!!!!!
If your not into this Group buy, please keep your comments to your self. We will do our own testing with this product when we get it, but from what I can tell you, you should do some reserach before comming here and talking BS! Yes, this system is a Hot air short ram on top of engine.
Now that this is out of the way, lets talk about the other intakes on the market......
all being a black box sitting on top of the engine absorbing heat though convection, conduction, radiation. Have you ever put your hand inside of your intake box after driving normally for 30min. I bet you cant hold it there for more then 20sec's. Now that is pretty freaking hot.
Carbon fiber is flammable at higher temps, why do you think exhaust arn't made of carbon fiber. I personally think you are full of BS! So please see your self from this Forum, unless you are going to contribute.

Cheers
Grac

[bren335i]

Originally Posted by Grac

Hey Dude,

Check it out!!!!!!!
If your not into this Group buy, please keep your comments to your self. We will do our own testing with this product when we get it, but from what I can tell you, you should do some reserach before comming here and talking BS! Yes, this system is a Hot air short ram on top of engine.
Now that this is out of the way, lets talk about the other intakes on the market......
all being a black box sitting on top of the engine absorbing heat though convection, conduction, radiation. Have you ever put your hand inside of your intake box after driving normally for 30min. I bet you cant hold it there for more then 20sec's. Now that is pretty freaking hot.
Carbon fiber is flammable at higher temps, why do you think exhaust arn't made of carbon fiber. I personally think you are full of BS! So please see your self from this Forum, unless you are going to contribute.

Cheers
Grac

I tune cars for a living on a dyno, what do you do ?

Maybe you should do some research, I didn't mention or compare it to any other intakes on the market. Why are you ranting about carbon fiber? You have no idea what you are talking about. I think half the words i wrote above like grams per second went right over your head. I just think its poor all around design with poor data to support its "claims." Man BMW people will buy ANYTHING and not ask questions.

PS: Maybe you should do some education/research on a spell checker.

007 emola red 335i with Proceed, custom metallic (wtf?) exhust

[Grac]

What I do for a living i cant talk about, it takes place > then 8 ATA's below the surface and ware a Superlite 17, so dont talk data to me, about grams per second, nor pressure. Go buy yourself a bmw then we will talk. For your info 1 ATA equals 14.7 psi which is your Surface equilivant value (SEV) What reserach do you want me to do? I was just saying other intakes, which happen to be Carbon fiber for this car. try using the T formula mister tuner it may help you with your subi, no pon intended

Cheers
Grac

Originally Posted by bren335i

I tune cars for a living on a dyno, what do you do ?

Maybe you should do some research, I didn't mention or compare it to any other intakes on the market. Why are you ranting about carbon fiber? You have no idea what you are talking about. I think half the words i wrote above like grams per second went right over your head. I just think its poor all around design with poor data to support its "claims." Man BMW people will buy ANYTHING and not ask questions.

PS: Maybe you should do some education/research on a spell checker.

007 emola red 335i with Proceed, custom metallic (wtf?) exhust

[verboten]

[QUOTE=bren335i;1393159]
As much as I dont want discredit your work there is no proof.


First off, we thank you for reading our post here in the vendor/ sponsor area (GB). The opinion that you are offering would be better discussed in the General Forced Induction forum, see "Prototype MSDS air filter" thread. Many of your QA's are over there, and the vendor/ sponsor area is simply just that: an area where vendors will offer their products to interested parties.
Our test car has now logged over 5,000 miles os SoCal street, freeway, and canyon driving, as well as some illegals and dyno time. To date , absolutely NO c-e-l-s, NO limp modes, and silky smooth hot or cold engine performance.
If you search these forums, you will find several upgrade products that are causing intermittent c-e-l-s and limp modes, perhaps you should be directing your proclaimed technical expertise to some of those mfgs, as they are in need of your guidance. Since we really don't want to lead our MSDS filter GB off topic here (it's a tentative sale), and have a moderator lock it up, I'll be brief: please don't accuse MSDS of short-stepping our R & D on our products. In this world of IPR (intellectual property rights) violations, products are being reverse engineered and counterfeited daily. We do not make anything easy for the countries of Forgeria to knock off our products. Weapon -R Performance was the last defendant we prevailed upon to stop making one of our products. So please don't expect to see any details of our product development online. If you feel that we are promoting a product not to your level of technology, don't purchase it.
MSDS is the first mfg here with a 335i filter kit that is showing the consumer Before/ After power gains. And this is with a totally OE car, and ONE "Stand alone" upgrade added. Accept it or not, our product made the gains at the dyno, but I reiterate once again...if it is not to your technical requirements, no one is recruiting you as an MSDS customer.


On top of that it looks like something i could have made at home depot, down
to the ebay filter.


AFAIK, Jeff and Barry (ceo's) at S & B Filters do not promote their filters over at Ebay , such as the offshore lowballers $4.95 special. Maybe you've seen the S&B knock off filters for sale there and are confusing the two
When you are at the Home Depot, make sure to go down the aisle with the Teledyne Pines #2 or the VectorBend #300 hydraulic mandrel bending machines. Tell the clerk that you will be needing some 1-Dia radii bends out of 2.250" and 3.00" c/r U.S. made steel tube with a .005 flash control. Find the TIG welding clerk on the next aisle and you're set

Unless i see data like above it really is just another ebay-esque intake idea.


In a few weeks , our Stage 2 "Remote filter location " kit (out on our 335i road car now) will be back at the dyno for further testing. We will then see if it makes additional power ...or just keep the short ram gains constant and consistent over heat soak conditions. It would be a pleasure to hear your comments about that product over in the "General forced induction " area.
Marty

[ulises 335i]

In a few weeks , our Stage 2 "Remote filter location " kit (out on our 335i road car now) will be back at the dyno for further testing. We will then see if it makes additional power ...or just keep the short ram gains constant and consistent over heat soak conditions. It would be a pleasure to hear your comments about that product over in the "General forced induction " area.
Marty

how long is a few weeks? 1-2 weeks or 4-5 weeks?

[verboten]

3 weeks to go back to the dynojet with the cold air package on the car.
The car is slated for a V2, so we will need to twist the customers arm to get it back to OE for testing. Some jpegs of the cold air should be posted next week. Easy install, no cutting , very clean.
Marty

[Grac]

[QUOTE=verboten;1399508]

Originally Posted by bren335i

As much as I dont want discredit your work there is no proof.


First off, we thank you for reading our post here in the vendor/ sponsor area (GB). The opinion that you are offering would be better discussed in the General Forced Induction forum, see "Prototype MSDS air filter" thread. Many of your QA's are over there, and the vendor/ sponsor area is simply just that: an area where vendors will offer their products to interested parties.
Our test car has now logged over 5,000 miles os SoCal street, freeway, and canyon driving, as well as some illegals and dyno time. To date , absolutely NO c-e-l-s, NO limp modes, and silky smooth hot or cold engine performance.
If you search these forums, you will find several upgrade products that are causing intermittent c-e-l-s and limp modes, perhaps you should be directing your proclaimed technical expertise to some of those mfgs, as they are in need of your guidance. Since we really don't want to lead our MSDS filter GB off topic here (it's a tentative sale), and have a moderator lock it up, I'll be brief: please don't accuse MSDS of short-stepping our R & D on our products. In this world of IPR (intellectual property rights) violations, products are being reverse engineered and counterfeited daily. We do not make anything easy for the countries of Forgeria to knock off our products. Weapon -R Performance was the last defendant we prevailed upon to stop making one of our products. So please don't expect to see any details of our product development online. If you feel that we are promoting a product not to your level of technology, don't purchase it.
MSDS is the first mfg here with a 335i filter kit that is showing the consumer Before/ After power gains. And this is with a totally OE car, and ONE "Stand alone" upgrade added. Accept it or not, our product made the gains at the dyno, but I reiterate once again...if it is not to your technical requirements, no one is recruiting you as an MSDS customer.


On top of that it looks like something i could have made at home depot, down
to the ebay filter.


AFAIK, Jeff and Barry (ceo's) at S & B Filters do not promote their filters over at Ebay , such as the offshore lowballers $4.95 special. Maybe you've seen the S&B knock off filters for sale there and are confusing the two
When you are at the Home Depot, make sure to go down the aisle with the Teledyne Pines #2 or the VectorBend #300 hydraulic mandrel bending machines. Tell the clerk that you will be needing some 1-Dia radii bends out of 2.250" and 3.00" c/r U.S. made steel tube with a .005 flash control. Find the TIG welding clerk on the next aisle and you're set

Unless i see data like above it really is just another ebay-esque intake idea.


In a few weeks , our Stage 2 "Remote filter location " kit (out on our 335i road car now) will be back at the dyno for further testing. We will then see if it makes additional power ...or just keep the short ram gains constant and consistent over heat soak conditions. It would be a pleasure to hear your comments about that product over in the "General forced induction " area.
Marty

+1

[Grac]

Thanks so much for your customer service,

[Grac]

Cant wait to see the Stage 2 kit

[bnj]

Originally Posted by verboten

3 weeks to go back to the dynojet with the cold air package on the car.
The car is slated for a V2, so we will need to twist the customers arm to get it back to OE for testing. Some jpegs of the cold air should be posted next week. Easy install, no cutting , very clean.
Marty

I think the stock intake limitations are evident especially with V2 and many who aim to purchase your product woujld be interested in how it performs with V2. At least I don't care what are the gains with intake only as I consider the upgraded intake as a part of a set of mods. I am very interested in knowing what are the gains of your stage 2 intake on top of Procede V2.

[verboten]

BNJ...we are also very interested on the V2s perf on an all stock car with just the CAI filter (stand alone) upgrade. When we roll in off of the 110 freeway to the dyno shop and the car is toasty hot...we will simply make a few "Before " runs. This will be with the V2 not in play (bypassed). Just before we call it a day, we will plug the V2 into play, and give it a couple pulls. This of course will be if our customer's V2 even shows up in the next week or so.
With that said, depending upon the downpipes & catback that we select for this car (in Oct.), we will be welding in some extra o2 ports for wideband afr readings . AFR readings from the tailpipe area are NFG due to surrounding air entering the probe area. By November we shall have a good idea on how well the V2 is mapped for a CAI, DP and Catback sys.(no rear cats)
Marty

[ulises 335i]

how much do you think the price will go up with your stage 2 intake?

[verboten]

Ulises ...the pn ACST2 is at our www.msdsinc.com site for $225.00, which added to the reg short ram kit ($375.00) is $600.00 (non GB prices). If there is interest in the CAI stage 2, there may be a GB estsablished...only time and testing will tell
Marty

[verboten]

MSDS # ACST2 cold air intake (upgrade to the short ram) that's been spoolin around L.A. and audibly turning heads on the streets. This system is definitely not for you if you don't like listening to a turbo symphony...and yes it does deliver the cold stuff. Some dyno time awaits, and a wee bit more of tooling up in the MSDS factory and it will be available to our customers. No sheet metal hacking , and about a 30 min install. It's also over @ Forced Induction threads.
Marty

[verboten]

Thanks to all for your interest in MSDS products !
PMs sent to you all
Marty

["07"BobbyBimmer]

Marty, A couple of quick questions about ACST2, it looks to me like in order to service the filter you will have to take off the front bumber in order to remove the filter, is that correct? Also, at the location its at, any chance of water intake from it's low location? Thanks, it looks very promising.

[verboten]

Bobby, the filter is usually serviced @ 2 year intervals. The bumper comes off/on in about 10 minutes with a small 10mm socket/ and small allen wrench. The S & B cone filter sits about 1' 6" above the ground, we do suggest that the Stage 2 kit is used (as most cai's) in Dry Land Areas. No worries though as you can just use the short ram section in the winter/// bolt on cold air in the summer ! We actually drove the pants off of our car this past weekend in L.A. in a freak rainstorm with Stage 2 !
Marty

[ulises 335i]

Originally Posted by verboten

Bobby, the filter is usually serviced @ 2 year intervals. The bumper comes off/on in about 10 minutes with a small 10mm socket/ and small allen wrench. The S & B cone filter sits about 1' 6" above the ground, we do suggest that the Stage 2 kit is used (as most cai's) in Dry Land Areas. No worries though as you can just use the short ram section in the winter/// bolt on cold air in the summer ! We actually drove the pants off of our car this past weekend in L.A. in a freak rainstorm with Stage 2 !
Marty

im here n the la area too, and if all that hard rain fall (and i mean realy hard)didnt get sucked up into the intake thats amazing!!!!!

[verboten]

Yea we thought the rain just off of Catalina was holding offshore for some time, but then around 12pm Sat. WHAM ! At least 2 hours of heavy stuff, so we just kept on driving for some real time testing. Since the duct inlet is not exactly in the center line of the cone filter, the majority of the rain/ splash just hits the front bumper. I would not recommend "Storm chasing" to our customers with a cai, this is just another reality check we were making before releasing the stage 2...and it's still ticking
Marty