[S65V8]

Thanks for posting this for sure, everyone will now know the details. You really are taking a risk with engine mods, a lot can go wrong in every specific situation. However, the gratification when showing up a CLS 55 or Porsches w/ bad drivers (ha) is pretty awesome. Question is what kind of driver are you, one who uses the power regularly or just likes the idea. If the latter don't mod, not worth money or risk. Give and take.

[ddigangi]

thanks!

[Saintor]

If my car is lowered with aftermarket but not extremely (similar to sport pack) and realigned at dealer, could a wheel bearing repair on warranty be denied?

[Quisp]

Originally Posted by Saintor

If my car is lowered with aftermarket but not extremely (similar to sport pack) and realigned at dealer, could a wheel bearing repair on warranty be denied?

That is what I took my car in for when they did it to me.

[2M]

Hey guys i lifted my car last week and saw that the transmission was covered in oil...there is no light on the dashboard for low oil or nothing but ive noticed its also leeking cause my spot where my car sits has an oil leak...i have a juicebox for the n/a engine...should i disengage it or completely remove it before service?

[E90 87ss]

Originally Posted by Alpine3

Hey guys i lifted my car last week and saw that the transmission was covered in oil...there is no light on the dashboard for low oil or nothing but ive noticed its also leeking cause my spot where my car sits has an oil leak...i have a juicebox for the n/a engine...should i disengage it or completely remove it before service?

I would remove completely unless it's for minor stuff like oil or brakes... I could swear that someone just got caught on map 0...

[mgonz3]

great post!

[manbart]

Maybe the key is to get some idea of how frequently people who've moded their cars have had a warranty voided or something not covered due to the mod. From my experience it happens but seems to be quite infrequent.

Tilf

[hjernazian]

friend of mine takes his 335 in for service with his intake and JB2 installed. He's had now FOUR hpfp's replaced, numerous oil changes, and other standard maintenance and they have never said anything about the mods. However, I did not take the same risk. I removed both the intake, JB3, and replugged in the golf-tee mod wire in the back before taking it in earlier this week. It took me about an hour and although I probably didn't have to, just made me feel safer. You never know what kind of shady shit SA's will try to pull.

[hersh244]

Alright, so I am 21 and just got my first bimmer. 2008 328xi coupe is there any chips or any performance parts that will not void the warranty. Any suggestions on what would be a good thing to add first? Would dinan parts work if installed by an official BMW shop? I got CPO and a warranty and maintenance till 2014 so I really don't want that ruined. Thanks

[JoeyBananaz18]

Originally Posted by hersh244

Alright, so I am 21 and just got my first bimmer. 2008 328xi coupe is there any chips or any performance parts that will not void the warranty. Any suggestions on what would be a good thing to add first? Would dinan parts work if installed by an official BMW shop? I got CPO and a warranty and maintenance till 2014 so I really don't want that ruined. Thanks

dinan, and BMW performance are the only products that will not void your warranty. the only problem is you will be paying alot more to keep that warranty.
as far as chips and tunes are concerned, you could run into a great deal of problems if you get caught with one. some are not detectable. unfortunately im not to familiar with ECU stuff.

[Chicks-Love-Bimmers]

Simple lighting mods like angel eyes, interior leds, back up lights or license plate lights can't void warranty can it?

[skifreek]

Originally Posted by hjernazian

However, I did not take the same risk. I removed both the intake, JB3, and replugged in the golf-tee mod wire in the back before taking it in earlier this week. It took me about an hour and although I probably didn't have to, just made me feel safer. You never know what kind of shady shit SA's will try to pull.

x 10

I have the jb3 removal, dci removal, and golf tee removal time to 15 minutes for all 3.

If 15 minutes isn't worth your time removing said mods, and clearing any shadow fault codes, then don't bother modding.

[cb1111]

Let me try to explain mods and warranties in logical layman's term. I'm sure that some will come up with all sorts of nebulous arguments but they are not real world.

1. The oft misquoted MM act has nothing to do with performance parts. It was enacted to keep manufacturers from requiring the use of a specific brand of replacement part in order to keep the warranty intact.

Accordingly, the use of a "substantially similar" replacement is OK and the manufacturer must show that the "substantially similar" part caused the failure if they refuse warranty service for that failure.

In practical terms, this means that you can substitute a Osram H7 bulb for the Bosch H7 that the car originally came with.

2. Let's look at performance parts for a moment. By definition, performance parts are not "substantially similar" as they are intended to alter the performance characteristics of a system. Based upon this, performance parts fall outside the scope of the MM act.

In order to refuse warranty service for a failure, the manufacturer (legally) merely needs to show that a part that is not "substantially similar" was used and that this part could have caused the failure. At this point, the burden of proof shifts to the consumer to prove that the part did not cause the failure.

Going back to out lightbulb example, if you have an electrical failure and you've replaced your 55w bulbs with 85w "hyperwhites" or LED's then the dealer is under an obligation to the manufacturer to refuse warranty service on the failure if they believe that the performance bulbs caused the failure.

Simple - right?

Now, let's talk warranty a moment.

3. The term "void the warranty" is often bandied about by both consumers and dealers alike.

Very few things will actually "void the warranty." This was alluded to by other posters but not fully explained. If a car is so badly abused, or modded to the point where virtually every system failure can be traced back to a mod, then the manufacturer can "void the warranty." A flood damaged car or one that was in a severe accident might also be candidates for the manufacturer to void the warranty on the entire car.

Mitsubishi voided the warranty on a bunch of cars that they saw were used at racetracks.

What is commonly referred to as "voiding the warranty" actually refers to a dealer refusing warranty service on a particular service.

Quite simply, if a dealer believes that a modification, chip, performance part, abuse or whatnot caused (or substantially contributed) to a failure, then he has an obligation to the manufacturer to refuse warranty service on that failure.

Accordingly, using our lighting example again, the dealer could refuse warranty service on any electrical failure. This could actually extend to ECUs or the entire electrical system.

Farfetched? Not really. A few years back a guy on VWVortex decided to paint his sidemarker bulbs silver on his brand new Jetta.

The bulb heated up, melted the paint and dripped into the housing. The housing melted and shorted out parts of the wiring loom. Since the Jetta uses a CAN-BUS, the whole thing needed replacement $2500 later the car was on the road again.

4. Why doesn't the dealer give the customer the benefit of the doubt? The manufacturer often asks for parts back to determine the cause of the failure. They are extremely vigilant for failures that often are seen on modded cars.

Fell free to argue until you're blue in the face - but - like it or not, the above is the way it is.

You can always find a lawyer who will argue a different viewpoint, but that doesn't mean it is right.

So, what is the bottom line?

ANY mod may cause warranty woes. Consider ALL the implications of any mod you are contemplating and be mentally and monetarily prepared to pay for the consequences.

Read your owner's manual carefully. It specifically warns against engine (ECU) and suspension mods as examples of mods that will cause problems.

Feel free to mod away, but remember that you might have to pay to play. The other posters who say "just do it" aren't the ones that will have to foot the bill.

As a clarification - there is some heated discussion about the manufacturer's burden of proof regarding the use of "performance parts" but the bottom line remains the same.

In addition, if the manufacturer allows a case to go to court then there is a good bet that he has sufficient evidence to back up their claim.

[Quisp]

Good clarification of a confusing and somewhat grey area for dealers and owners alike.

[geneatals]

post #81= WIN

thank you for taking the time to post...

[BTM]

Originally Posted by TrackRat

The facts in post #81 has been known by many for some time but a lot of wishful people think that a car maker must warranty a product in a form they never sold it despite the new vehicle warranty exclusions which prohibit Mods to the vehicle engineered specifications.

The exception I take is the "X is connected to Y is connected to Z" game that dealers will try and use (not every dealer does this but some of the stories are pretty bad). Denying service on wheel bearings because of non-rfts or on turbos because of a cat-back exhaust are completely ridiculous. Wasn't there someone who's catalytic converter warranty was denied because they had the valve opening wire unplugged? When BMW themselves sell an exhaust that bypasses the valve?

In many cases I agree with you however. There is a guy on another forum that always bashes his old N54 as having been a piece of junk - which he had modded to the hilt and was getting about 430hp out of, I'm always like, you don't think that had anything to do with your crappy reliability?

[cb1111]

Originally Posted by BTM

The exception I take is the "X is connected to Y is connected to Z" game that dealers will try and use (not every dealer does this but some of the stories are pretty bad). Denying service on wheel bearings because of non-rfts or on turbos because of a cat-back exhaust are completely ridiculous. Wasn't there someone who's catalytic converter warranty was denied because they had the valve opening wire unplugged? When BMW themselves sell an exhaust that bypasses the valve?

In many cases I agree with you however. There is a guy on another forum that always bashes his old N54 as having been a piece of junk - which he had modded to the hilt and was getting about 430hp out of, I'm always like, you don't think that had anything to do with your crappy reliability?

Often, that is based on a previous bad experience, ignorance on the dealer's part or a crappy customer.

If a customer goes to the dealer with a car that is scraping the weeds, a catless exhaust and a bunch of bling then the dealer may well start looking for exclusions. If the customer comes in with an attitude as well then he can kiss warranty service goodbye.

A reasonable customer with a few reasonable mods probably won't have issues. It is the "bling mods" that draw attention to the mod and bring little in return - these are cold air intakes, catless exhausts and similar mods that scream "look at me" but bring very little in terms of performance.

Combine that with a service writer who doesn't understand the intricacies of mods and you're in trouble.

[Ben Richards]

i am a noob...and i am reading. 'ppreciate the info.

[LSO]

Noob here too...great points on this topic and many things to consider in regard to modding the car.

[atlharry]

2nd post and I believe it's in the right thread. This pretty much tips my to-mod-or-not-to-mod seesaw all the way to not-to-mod.

Must... Wait... For... Dinan N55 Stage 2... sigh.

[LagMode335i]

Originally Posted by atlharry

2nd post and I believe it's in the right thread. This pretty much tips my to-mod-or-not-to-mod seesaw all the way to not-to-mod.

Must... Wait... For... Dinan N55 Stage 2... sigh.

Good luck with Dinan even if you wait..............