[ILoveAndHateN54]

If you aren’t in the 650-800whp don’t worry about rod bearings.

[iqraceworks]

Originally Posted by ILoveAndHateN54

If you aren’t in the 650-800whp don’t worry about rod bearings.

The problem is you can be making 400hp...and if the previous owners has leaking injectors, and never hardly changed the oil...the bearings could be looking pretty rough.

In reality...you never really know what kind of shape they are in until you pull off the caps.

[AWD Addict]

My '08 335xi has 135,000 miles on it. I've owned it since she was born (I ordered it custom) and drove it off the lot with 2 miles on it. Car has the sport package (so has the oil cooler). It's a daily driver with a mix of 50/50 highway and city driving. I'm a sporty driver, and apart from a couple autox runs since I bought it (which I don't plan any more of), the car has not and will not be raced.

Oil has been changed every 5,000 miles since inception. Plugs, coil packs, injectors etc are all regularly maintained, as is coolant and tranny fluid. Only wrinkle there is I'm now running Liquimoly instead of just the BMW spec'd castrol. I've done 3 oil analyses in the past 3 years, and they're all perfect. Car ran stock until end of warranty at 50,000 miles. I then added a VRSF 5.5" stepped intercooler, and a cobb stage 1+ tune. Turbos were replaced at ~85,000 due to a slight wastegate rattle (under warranty ) She's had a bunch of other typical stuff replaced over time (transfer case, clutch, water pump, hpfp, etc)

Car's been undergoing a broad refresh (new android screen for the i-drive, suspension/chassis upgrades, some exterior clean up) and is about to be 15 years old, which means no more emissions check. Car's going into the shop in a week for a new rustproofed subframe (the only thing on my undercarriage that's not immaculate), VRSF downpipes, new 02 sensors, an oil catch can, and intercooler flush (it's oily), and a couple other maintenance odds and ends. I'll probably do a wildly unnecessary compression/leak down test too. I also finally ditched the Cobb, and have been running the MHD tune for a month in preparation for the upcoming Stage 2+ setup.

I love this car. I'm pretty sure it loves me too. If my wife divorces me, I'm parking this thing on her side of the bed. My mechanic is suggesting I consider rod bearings given the whole story above. He's had a few 535xi's spin bearings, and did a motor swap on another 5 series where they checked the bearings, and at least one was cracked - rest were heavily scratched up. I've read this thread, and I'm generally on the "I take care of my car and don't track it, this is a waste of money" stance. I'm also a "if it ain't broke" type of guy. That said, I'll have the subframe off, and already be under there and spending money. Is this cheap insurance at this stage? Should I do this? I'm already dumping dough on the thing. I'm guessing all told this is another grand or so with labor.

Assuming this is a "yes, do it" the next question is:

1) Do I do the oil pump while I'm in there too? That probably makes the $1000 closer to $1800. I'm not pinching pennies here, but as noted previously, where does the preventative piece here stop?

2) Any strong feelings on which bearings? My mechanic likes BE, but theres Kolbenschmidt, OE, etc. I don't want to diminish this, but shit. They're strips of metal. Just pick a high quality group and go, right?

Thanks for the help! Flame suit on!!!

AA

[AWD Addict]

Depending on the responses, perhaps we can run a little pool on what they're going to look like.

[iqraceworks]

If you are the original owner, and have always taken care of maintenance and done oil changes when you are supposed to.....no way I would mess with the rod bearings. If it makes you feel any better....send an oil sample to Blackstone Labs and for $30 they will tell you if you have any metals in your oil that would indicate bearing issues.

99.9% of the time, it seems like the guys who have bearing issues either don't change the oil often enough and/or drive with leaky injectors for way too long.........or buy their car from someone who did that.

N54's don't seem to have bearing issues if they are well maintained.......like your seems to be.

[AWD Addict]

Last 3 blackstone lab reports came back immaculate. I was doing pre/post oil type switch to liquimoly. There was no difference fwiw.

Appreciate the response.

[Ozzie335i]

It had been hashed out a few years ago that the Blackstone analysis is useless on these engines. Maybe fatty can elaborate.

AWD, you'll be right there. Swap them. You'll also get a new oil pan gasket in the process.

[Ozzie335i]

11/25/19 feuer commented.

[iqraceworks]

Originally Posted by Ozzie335i

It had been hashed out a few years ago that the Blackstone analysis is useless on these engines. Maybe fatty can elaborate.

AWD, you'll be right there. Swap them. You'll also get a new oil pan gasket in the process.

So somehow if an N54 has metal particles in the oil, or high amounts of fuel, coolant, or other contaminants.....Blackstone can't detect it because it came out of an N54?

[AWD Addict]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

So somehow if an N54 has metal particles in the oil, or high amounts of fuel, coolant, or other contaminants.....Blackstone can't detect it because it came out of an N54?

I think he's just saying it's not a panacea for early detection of upcoming rod bearing failure or wear.

That said, I do suspect earlier n54s might be a bit more prone to show their hand on issues given the different composition of the rod bearings back then.

Simply put, the oil analysis might give you an early clue, but a clean report doesn't necessarily mean youre 100% clear.

dR

[feuer]

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

I think he's just saying it's not a panacea for early detection of upcoming rod bearing failure or wear.

That said, I do suspect earlier n54s might be a bit more prone to show their hand on issues given the different composition of the rod bearings back then.

Simply put, the oil analysis might give you an early clue, but a clean report doesn't necessarily mean youre 100% clear.

dR

Exactly! It might! Unfortunately not necessarily! Best of luck getting that message to register with some on the forum. Oil analyses have been useless from personal experience. Have worked on quite few n54 engines with rod bearing issues. Ranging from 75k to 165k although to me mileage is irrelevant. Same with power output. Contrary from ILoveAndHateN54 opinion. It’s how engine is utilized and maintained. 350hp n54 that is being hard tracked frequently vs 700hp n54 that is being pussy foot driven to car meet? N54 that runs properly vs n54 running with misfires? A lot of variables but nevertheless the n54 is solid engine.

[iqraceworks]

Because nobody would ever fabricate a story in order to get clicks on their YouTube video......

[AWD Addict]

Originally Posted by PureBlood

This guy on youtube paid blackstone labs to analyze his oil sample after finding metal flakes on his oil filter and told him that his oil sample was perfect!

The next video in that guys series shows the bearings. They were junk. Given how badly that car was maintained, and that they found dozens of metal flakes on the oil filter, I'm surprised the lab report didn't turn ANYTHING up.

I'd love to hear blackstones response to that video. Bad look for them, no doubt.

[iqraceworks]

Originally Posted by PureBlood

That makes total sense! My gosh, why didn't I think of that?!

Thank you so much Mr. IQ

What's harder to believe....some random guy on a video saying Blackstone (well respected leader in oil analysis) didn't detect chunks of metal and tons of fuel mixed in his oil......or some random guy fabricating the story to get YouTube clicks?

Yeah...I'd definitely believe random YouTube dude over Blackstone Labs.

Not saying it didn't happen.....but you have to admit that it's kind of hard to believe.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

The next video in that guys series shows the bearings. They were junk. Given how badly that car was maintained, and that they found dozens of metal flakes on the oil filter, I'm surprised the lab report didn't turn ANYTHING up.

I'd love to hear blackstones response to that video. Bad look for them, no doubt.

Oil analysis is not a definitive way of saying if Rod bearings are done for, did Blackstone say it was 100% accurate?

Rod bearings are more of an issue with the S65 engine, not saying it can't happen to N54's but seems like it's blown out of proportion by some.

I agree with Freur that it's got a lot to do with how the car was maintained, warmed up, tracked etc but I don't personally know of anyone with N54 rod bearing issues, never had any on mine for the last 5 or so years.

[AWD Addict]

If there are metal shards in your oil filter, and rods are scraping bearings into oil, I'd sure like to think an oil analysis would provide some intimation that something's wrong. Worse, blackstone said everything looks good, and that "wear metals are low"!

Obviously the analysis was wrong in determining that. Metal was surely wearing.

Blackstone didn't say their tests would pick up rod bearing failure 100% (to my knowledge) but wtf are we doing oil sampling/testing for if something that significant doesn't get picked up?

All I said was I'd like to hear from blackstone on the matter. who wouldn't? It's obviously just one report (not including those here), and anecdotal evidence is just that. But that's an extreme case I'd have expected blackstone to at least raise a flag.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

If there are metal shards in your oil filter, and rods are scraping bearings into oil, I'd sure like to think an oil analysis would provide some intimation that something's wrong. Worse, blackstone said everything looks good, and that "wear metals are low"!

Obviously the analysis was wrong in determining that. Metal was surely wearing.

Blackstone didn't say their tests would pick up rod bearing failure 100% (to my knowledge) but wtf are we doing oil sampling/testing for if something that significant doesn't get picked up?

All I said was I'd like to hear from blackstone on the matter. who wouldn't? It's obviously just one report (not including those here), and anecdotal evidence is just that. But that's an extreme case I'd have expected blackstone to at least raise a flag.

Metal can be from a lot of different parts in the engine and not necessarily from rod bearings. For metal to be detected it has to be very fine particle to mix with the oil. Metal chunks won't go into the oil for testing because they get trapped in the filter. This is why oil analysis isn't always helping. There might be a major engine issue, like cracked piston with huge chunks, broken off bolt, but won't show anything in the oil. This isn't anecdote, its my personal experience, on the weekend one of my n54 spun bearings, on Wednesday I received super clean oil analysis report. If one want the thrill I guess, oh I'm waiting for the results kind of deal, one can do this oil sample tests. Other that that I don't see the point.

[AWD Addict]

Were talking about metal from rod bearings. Not chunks.

I didn't think that video showed only large chunks. The bearings were all scuffed and scratched - certainly a condition that would generate very small elements - the same and smaller as found in the filter. Not "chunks"

If oil analysis isn't picking up the wear from that video, I'm wondering if it's predictive at all, for this or any other similar wearing.

I'vr decided i'll be doing my bearings in a couple weeks as a part of the larger scope of work. Should be interesting. As noted above, I follow a strict maintenance regimen and have since the car was built. I'll be sure to post back here.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

Were talking about metal from rod bearings. Not chunks.

I didn't think that video showed only large chunks. The bearings were all scuffed and scratched - certainly a condition that would generate very small elements - the same and smaller as found in the filter. Not "chunks"

If oil analysis isn't picking up the wear from that video, I'm wondering if it's predictive at all, for this or any other similar wearing.

I'vr decided i'll be doing my bearings in a couple weeks as a part of the larger scope of work. Should be interesting. As noted above, I follow a strict maintenance regimen and have since the car was built. I'll be sure to post back here.

Those trapped in that filter are chunks relative to micro size metal particle able to flow through the filter element and mix with the oil send to lab for analysis. Additionally, I think you misread my post. I was stating that metal in oil filter or in oil analysis could be from other sources than bearings. My recommendation to anyone with plans of keeping these cars would be to replace the bearings.

[AWD Addict]

I think we agree.

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

If oil analysis isn't picking up the wear from that video, I'm wondering if it's predictive at all, for this or any other similar wearing.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

Because nobody would ever fabricate a story in order to get clicks on their YouTube video......

No everybody fabricates their Youtube videos to generate clicks. What would you tell this guy:https://www.e90post.com/forums/showp...99&postcount=1

[Ozzie335i]

Wise choice PureBlood.