[Dmacc]

Originally Posted by usc335

Exactly my point! I said haven't died YET. Let me spell it out for you.
(1) Smoking leads to premature deaths. However, people can smoke for years before the effects accumulate and lead to poor health (generally speaking).
(2) Knock, detonation, et al, causes engine damage and premature engine failure. However, people can run a tune with no timing control for years before the effects accumulate and lead to poor performance.

I thought I made this clear. If you don't care about the longterm well being of your car, then you shouldn't be in this thread... period

[Morpheus]

Originally Posted by usc335

Exactly my point! I said haven't died YET. Let me spell it out for you.
(1) Smoking leads to premature deaths. However, people can smoke for years before the effects accumulate and lead to poor health (generally speaking).
(2) Knock, detonation, et al, causes engine damage and premature engine failure. However, people can run a tune with no timing control for years before the effects accumulate and lead to poor performance.

are you kidding me? seriously?

If the junkyards were full of blown n54s, like graveyards are full of smokers (and non-smokers) then I would say you had a fair comparison.

[shifterboy45]

Originally Posted by usc335

Great shop by the way!

very cool dude.... reputable shop with character

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by shifterboy45

very true -- not all car enthusiast are tuners. True?

not all forum members are mechanically inclined so where do we draw the line to be civil?

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by shifterboy45

very true -- not all car enthusiast are tuners. True?

not all forum members are mechanically inclined so where do we draw the line to be civil?

Above incityphot and expensivetaste and below me....hows that?

Great job, another 2 pages full of wasted bandwidth to measure dick size when not even relevant to the topic at hand.

[shifterboy45]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

im cool with it.. really -- ive just worked at more than one dealer and we have all had hotrods and tuned cars.

as an advisor i took car of a lot of modded M5s, gave reqs about parts, services and vendors -- i never shot a customer down if they tuned, just warned them.

i think your a alright guy ... i just have a hard time swallowing the bad sentiment against techs -- as i used to be one... in all fairness i did take it personally.

no harm, no foul.

[shifterboy45]

Originally Posted by Clap135

Above incityphot and expensivetaste and below me....hows that?

Great job, another 2 pages full of wasted bandwidth to measure dick size when not even relevant to the topic at hand.

you are way too full of yourself...

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by shifterboy45

im cool with it.. really -- ive just worked at more than one dealer and we have all had hotrods and tuned cars.

as an advisor i took car of a lot of modded M5s, gave reqs about parts, services and vendors -- i never shot a customer down if they tuned, just warned them.

i think your a alright guy ... i just have a hard time swallowing the bad sentiment against techs -- as i used to be one... in all fairness i did take it personally.

no harm, no foul.

Let me give you an example of my techs, my tailight went out, (recall on the 1) I got the car back, they said they replaced the bulb. Tail light was still out. Advisor looks at records, wrong tailing bulb was replaced HERES THE KICKER the bulb wasnt the problem, it was the led strips.

2) motor in headlight went south. Got the car back, headlight points straight up, fender doesnt line up with the bumper, clips broken

This is BASIC BASIC shit.

I went in for wastegate rattle, played dumb. Some rookie 20 year old came out and goes I think the underpan is loose. I kindly asked for antoher tech. Guy in his 50 comes out, revs the car and goes "wastegate, this is gonna take a while..."

There are different levels of techs, the ones I deal with are idiots as I don't have serious problems.

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by shifterboy45

you are way too full of yourself...

like wise buddy. Get on topic now.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by shifterboy45

im cool with it.. really -- ive just worked at more than one dealer and we have all had hotrods and tuned cars.

as an advisor i took car of a lot of modded M5s, gave reqs about parts, services and vendors -- i never shot a customer down if they tuned, just warned them.

i think your a alright guy ... i just have a hard time swallowing the bad sentiment against techs -- as i used to be one... in all fairness i did take it personally.

no harm, no foul.

Well I apologize if you took the broad terminology I used so as not to offend, offending. My point was to show not all techs or advisors are to be listed in the category as enthusiast/tuners/engine builders.

Some of them just go to work to work, get trained to do their job, and could careless if their own car or yours made stock power or 800WHP.

Like I said, I had 4 years in the industry, not some crazy number, but enough to see whats going on.

Location is also a good factor, but I would be hard pressed to see a 100% of a dealership be in the "know" when it comes to this stuff.

If the dealer I worked with had 20 techs, I can recall 2 that knew more then just regular maintenance and warranty jobs. I actually went to them back in the day for aftermarket advice.

I have too many stories to show the level of inteligence or lack thereof, doesnt make them a bad person.

But when someone says "We should ask a BMW tech about XYZ" They are not going to be my go-to-person after what Ive seen in real life.

Clap... Remember the BMW tech/advisor? that thought your OCC was a boost controller? Case and point.

Totally Off Topic, and shifterboy Ive been trying to end this debate.

You win? Lets move on?

[Clap135]

yea i went in for a broken power steering pump, car went in stock. They call and ask me to take the tune off. I go what tune. The advisor puts me on hold. Comes back and says the tech found a boost controller near my battery post with two hoses going to it.


REALLLLLYYY?!?

[Forcefed3]

The PROcede fakes the load signal back in to the DME based on the load target. So by design you'll never see load changes in the ignition advance and that is the same reason CPS offsets are so necessary during transitions with it.

Sorry if this is a repost, I have missed the last 10 pages. I found this quote on another site.

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by gbreeE90

Sorry if this is a repost, I have missed the last 10 pages. I found this quote on another site.

That site is run by idiots, all piggy backs do this....
If this wasnt the case, they could simply tell the dme its running at 180 load on stock boost, this would drop timing caused by a different preset map at that load level. This is however impossible cause load is caluclated off boost, and if the ecu doesnt see what it wasnt to see boost wise, it closes the throttle or limps.

[Forcefed3]

Originally Posted by Clap135

That site is run by idiots, all piggy backs do this....

Why would they use that as an argument if the JB4 does it also? Are you 100% positive on that?

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by gbreeE90

Why would they use that as an argument if the JB4 does it also? Are you 100% positive on that?

yes, that is how a piggy back works. They all send false signals to the ecu in order to keep it happy. None of the signals the ecu sees (boost/fuel/timing, if you can control it) is actual.

[Litos]

Originally Posted by Morpheus

are you kidding me? seriously?

If the junkyards were full of blown n54s, like graveyards are full of smokers (and non-smokers) then I would say you had a fair comparison.

that's a good point.

have yet to see a blown JB3/JB4 car.......funny thing is that everyone is saying that the cars should be imploding left and right.....

[shifterboy45]

Originally Posted by Clap135

Let me give you an example of my techs, my tailight went out, (recall on the 1) I got the car back, they said they replaced the bulb. Tail light was still out. Advisor looks at records, wrong tailing bulb was replaced HERES THE KICKER the bulb wasnt the problem, it was the led strips.

2) motor in headlight went south. Got the car back, headlight points straight up, fender doesnt line up with the bumper, clips broken

This is BASIC BASIC shit.

I went in for wastegate rattle, played dumb. Some rookie 20 year old came out and goes I think the underpan is loose. I kindly asked for antoher tech. Guy in his 50 comes out, revs the car and goes "wastegate, this is gonna take a while..."

There are different levels of techs, the ones I deal with are idiots as I don't have serious problems.

flip side:

after working on customers car for the first time ever and getting the car out same day as requested -- customer return next day stating whatever we did caused an intermittent rattle in the car --- say ok, let take a look .. put customer into loaner.. for three days -- noise evident but no where close to the engine bay work we performed -- finally pulled dash assy and disassembled console -- finally pulled the driver front seat, and trapped on the seat rail assy is a pager -- which had a message waiting and buzzed every couple of minutes or so.

now the tech is not getting paid for this cause we when with the customers idea that it was something we did-- evidently it wasnt

so i call the customer and say the car is ready, he comes down and i show him the pager -- he said he had been looking for it ... it told him it was the noise he was hearing and there was nothing wrong with the work we did.

he apologizes and we part friends and the tech is short 11 hours of labor --

and this only one of many customer diagnosed issues that i have either worked with the customer on or the shop ate the charges and the tech lost their shorts ..

so do i disbelieve every customer that comes in thinking he/she knows whats wrong with the car ?

[Forcefed3]

Originally Posted by Clap135

yes, that is how a piggy back works. They all send false signals to the ecu in order to keep it happy. None of the signals the ecu sees (boost/fuel/timing, if you can control it) is actual.

Where did you learn all of this?

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by shifterboy45

flip side:

after working on customers car for the first time ever and getting the car out same day as requested -- customer return next day stating whatever we did caused an intermittent rattle in the car --- say ok, let take a look .. put customer into loaner.. for three days -- noise evident but no where close to the engine bay work we performed -- finally pulled dash assy and disassembled console -- finally pulled the driver front seat, and trapped on the seat rail assy is a pager -- which had a message waiting and buzzed every couple of minutes or so.

now the tech is not getting paid for this cause we when with the customers idea that it was something we did-- evidently it wasnt

so i call the customer and say the car is ready, he comes down and i show him the pager -- he said he had been looking for it ... it told him it was the noise he was hearing and there was nothing wrong with the work we did.

he apologizes and we part friends and the tech is short 11 hours of labor --

and this only one of many customer diagnosed issues that i have either worked with the customer on or the shop ate the charges and the tech lost their shorts ..

so do i disbelieve every customer that comes in thinking he/she knows whats wrong with the car ?

Trust me, I have met a few very intelligent/savy techs. They are called master techs, or on the way to being high up. This is NOT the norm though. The norm is what I explained, at least in NJ anyway. This is also not only bmw, this is mazda/nissan/honda/bmw/acura ect

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by gbreeE90

Where did you learn all of this?

Where did I learn this from, I assisted in development for multiple cars, this one being one of them.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Litos

that's a good point.

have yet to see a blown JB3/JB4 car.......funny thing is that everyone is saying that the cars should be imploding left and right.....

You are too funny today..

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=439505 (note the title "another")

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=379716 (somewhere in that thread he blows his engine)

Talk to enrita as well.

[shifterboy45]

Originally Posted by Clap135

Trust me, I have met a few very intelligent/savy techs. They are called master techs, or on the way to being high up. This is NOT the norm though. The norm is what I explained, at least in NJ anyway. This is also not only bmw, this is mazda/nissan/honda/bmw/acura ect

true..

take care -- tomorrow ill see if i can get some design specs for the current knock sensing system..

cheers!!