[Bagelfast]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Let me correct myself. It is Mike who is pressing the "Post Reply" button. But he is just cutting and pasting the info that is given to him by Terry. I know because we often see the same exact text posted, word for word, posted by Terry@BMS on the other forums. But since his account is banned here, Mike is the proxy. I really don't think Mike wants to get in a debate with any actual tuner. And Terry plays the game very well. He posts ridiculous things as Mike and then eventually falls back on the "that was Mike's mistake" strategy when the information is eventually proven to be false. This has been going on for a couple of years. Those of us who have fought this battle from the start, know this very well. Clap, Flyinglow, etc,. are just new players in this old game.

Shiv

So basically your just saying that you think its him... I thought you had proof. o well lol

+1 unban Terry here, would be alot more interesting.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by 1LUMI335

So basically your just saying that you think its him... I thought you had proof. o well lol

I have something even better... common sense It's either Terry cutting and pasting Mike's words. Or the other way around. You can decide which is more probable.

[Surquhar]

Shiv - I thought you wouldnt go there. I am new to the forums and I bought a COBB tune, because i didnt want to F** with my ECU. I am very happy with it. However, as I look to add mods in the future I was leaning towards Vinshu DP's etc because I respect your committement to N54 tuning. But why jump in this BS. You clearly have earned respect in this community!

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by Surquhar

Shiv - I thought you wouldnt go there. I am new to the forums and I bought a COBB tune, because i didnt want to F** with my ECU. I am very happy with it. However, as I look to add mods in the future I was leaning towards Vinshu DP's etc because I respect your committement to N54 tuning. But why jump in this BS. You clearly have earned respect in this community!

I jumped in because everyone is "attacking" Mike when he is not the one who is actually posting this. I think it's unfair to insult him for it. The only thing he is guilty of is misplaced loyalty to his supplier. Which is pretty common in this business

I'm been doing a pretty good job of staying out of the actual debate portion of this thread. Been there, done that. Got the t-shirt to prove it. But make no doubt, anyone who understands the basics of tuning will, after reading some of the stuff that Terry/Mike posts, have a hard time not blowing a gasket. I've learned long ago that engaging in debates with those who have no loyalty to facts is a complete waste of time. People just interpret is as "tuner wars". In this case, I think it's a bit more useful because Clap/Flyinglow/etc,. aren't selling anything. They are just debating topics that they feel strongly about. My only contribution was to suggest laying off firing away at the wrong guy.

[Forcefed3]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

I jumped in because everyone is "attacking" Mike when he is not the one who is actually posting this. I think it's unfair to insult him for it. The only thing he is guilty of is misplaced loyalty to his supplier. Which is pretty common in this business

I'm been doing a pretty good job of staying out of the actual debate portion of this thread. Been there, done that. Got the t-shirt to prove it. But make no doubt, anyone who understands the basics of tuning will, after reading some of the stuff that Terry/Mike posts, have a hard time not blowing a gasket. I've learned long ago that engaging in debates with those who have no loyalty to facts is a complete waste of time. People just interpret is as "tuner wars". In this case, I think it's a bit more useful because Clap/Flyinglow/etc,. aren't selling anything. They are just debating topics that they feel strongly about. My only contribution was to suggest laying off firing away at the wrong guy.

Shiv's first respectful post!

[Surquhar]

Understood. I am one of those guys that have no clue about what everyone is talking about and I am not going to add some BS to the thread. Thanks for the reply, I know there is history. I respect what you have done for the N54 community!

[BrianMN]

Originally Posted by gbreeE90

Shiv's first respectful post!

Mmm, not really. You've just been reading his posts in a state of defensiveness. If you take a step back and lose the rhetoric, you'll see nearly all of his posts are of this level

[Forcefed3]

Originally Posted by BrianMN

Mmm, not really. You've just been reading his posts in a state of defensiveness. If you take a step back and lose the rhetoric, you'll see nearly all of his posts are of this level

I havent really looked at any of his threads lately. But this is the first post I've seen that doesnt have some kind of attitude with it. Dont take that personally, Shiv.

[Bagelfast]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

I have something even better... common sense It's either Terry cutting and pasting Mike's words. Or the other way around. You can decide which is more probable.

If you want it to be probably of course it can seem that way... Anything can seem probable on these forums, it just comes down to how much you want it to be. And in your case and history with Terry, it would assume to be that way. I see exactly where your coming from and dont blame you i suppose.

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

I jumped in because everyone is "attacking" Mike when he is not the one who is actually posting this. I think it's unfair to insult him for it. The only thing he is guilty of is misplaced loyalty to his supplier. Which is pretty common in this business

I'm been doing a pretty good job of staying out of the actual debate portion of this thread. Been there, done that. Got the t-shirt to prove it. But make no doubt, anyone who understands the basics of tuning will, after reading some of the stuff that Terry/Mike posts, have a hard time not blowing a gasket. I've learned long ago that engaging in debates with those who have no loyalty to facts is a complete waste of time. People just interpret is as "tuner wars". In this case, I think it's a bit more useful because Clap/Flyinglow/etc,. aren't selling anything. They are just debating topics that they feel strongly about. My only contribution was to suggest laying off firing away at the wrong guy.

LOL O man, this is getting good, Shiv is defending Mike!!!
But i dunno if i should believe this post, or this is you trying to push the issue that its Terry posting.
We shall never know so no point in even bringing it up so we will have to assume its Mike.. Hasnt ever lead us into believing he is not so.

[Sniz]

Originally Posted by 1LUMI335

If you want it to be probably of course it can seem that way... Anything can seem probable on these forums, it just comes down to how much you want it to be. And in your case and history with Terry, it would assume to be that way. I see exactly where your coming from and dont blame you i suppose.




LOL O man, this is getting good, Shiv is defending Mike!!!
But i dunno if i should believe this post, or this is you trying to push the issue that its Terry posting.
We shall never know so no point in even bringing it up so we will have to assume its Mike.. Hasnt ever lead us into believing he is not so.

I'll make the 1st post of 2-26-11

I've been impressed recently with Shiv's ability to restrain from getting into these threads. The old Shiv would be in here like this ->


as to whether its Mike or Terry posting, thats why I like to call him Merry.

[stressdoc]

Let's try and get this thread turned back around to engineering and away from business politics.

If you don't have something useful and knowledgeable to contribute on the tech side of things, just hold off the 'reply' button.

Accusations and speculations just fuel the trolls.

[Sniz]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

Let's try and get this thread turned back around to engineering and away from business politics.

If you don't have something useful and knowledgeable to contribute on the tech side of things, just hold off the 'reply' button.

Accusations and speculations just fuel the trolls.

will do

does anyone have ANY photos from any engine showing what detonation in a n54 can cause?

would like to see some pitted or ringland damaged pistons. They have to be out there.

[ZTUNER]

Originally Posted by Sniz

will do

does anyone have ANY photos from any engine showing what detonation in a n54 can cause?

would like to see some pitted or ringland damaged pistons. They have to be out there.

Not enough motors have been taken apart to show that. I think the ringlands break before any real pitting shows up.

Harry

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

So I was reading up on the new macbooks that were released (disappointed the air didn't get any loving) and one of the threads turned into the usual PC vs. Mac thing and it made me think of this threads and a few other threads from the last week. This post sums it up perfectly I think. Just shows that this kind of internet bias/banter is PAR for the course I guess.

Originally Posted by Stevamundo

Exactly! I really don't understand some people.

I don't spend a second on a Microsoft forum bashing Microsoft. Why? I really don't like Microsoft thus I really don't care about Microsoft. It's plain and simple as that.

So if you don't like Macs or if you think that Macs are too expensive THEN DON'T BUY MACS.

It's a personal preference thing really anyway.

Me, I love Macs and OSX. It's my personal preference plain and simple. ALSO I don't choose to bash PCs or Windows ANYWHERE. Why? Because that's just childish.

[Joshboody]

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

So I was reading up on the new macbooks that were released (disappointed the air didn't get any loving) and one of the threads turned into the usual PC vs. Mac thing and it made me think of this threads and a few other threads from the last week. This post sums it up perfectly I think. Just shows that this kind of internet bias/banter is PAR for the course I guess.

If it was norton and symatec forums and one program was harmful for the computer, then the discussion would probably be similar.

Your analogy is like BMW versus Audi.

[Joshboody]

wait norton is symantec... i don't know... software company 1 versus software company 2... there

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

So I was reading up on the new macbooks that were released (disappointed the air didn't get any loving) and one of the threads turned into the usual PC vs. Mac thing and it made me think of this threads and a few other threads from the last week. This post sums it up perfectly I think. Just shows that this kind of internet bias/banter is PAR for the course I guess.

Theres a difference with those threads and this one. Both sides present logic, where as this thread provides logic from one side (tuning) and then theres you.

[fisherbln]

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

So I was reading up on the new macbooks that were released (disappointed the air didn't get any loving) and one of the threads turned into the usual PC vs. Mac thing and it made me think of this threads and a few other threads from the last week. This post sums it up perfectly I think. Just shows that this kind of internet bias/banter is PAR for the course I guess.

No, this is not that at all. If you want a computer analogy, this is more like a Java Newb (note that I'm not referring to all Java programmers) telling a group of well seasoned multi-lingual computer programmers that he doesn't have to worry about memory leaks when he codes because the Garbage Collector in Java will take care of all of that for him.

[Tzu]

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

So I was reading up on the new macbooks that were released (disappointed the air didn't get any loving) and one of the threads turned into the usual PC vs. Mac thing and it made me think of this threads and a few other threads from the last week. This post sums it up perfectly I think. Just shows that this kind of internet bias/banter is PAR for the course I guess.

Well put.

Point is, BMS doesnt care, because people are still going to buy their products. How many people have been discouraged from buying a JB4 by reading this thread? A dozen? BMS is laughing. Thats assuming they took the 3+ hours its taken me to read 60+ pages.

As per shiv's post, people have to take the advice with a grain of salt. Filter through the bullshit, AFTER reading how an engine actually works and UNDERSTANDING what precautions need to be taken.

Ive spent a lot of time reading this thread, and keeping my nose out of it. But my two cents are as follows:
As an engineer, we live by a safety factor. You take what needs to be accomplished, and (usually) multiply the stress and strain by 2-3 as a precaution of catastrophic failure and recalculate everything to be 2-3 times as strong. This applied to all aspects of whats being designed. Never does anyone say "meh, that'll work", you make it work with certainty. I'm not implying that the engine is 2-3 times as strong as we think it is (it may be) but rather that the proper precautions need to be made when modifying a controlled system.

Yes, the BMS piggy has been used by many, but others have this extra precaution. Im personally buying a procede, because of this, and user adjust-ability, and flexibility.

I held my tongue 20 pages ago, but until we can see activity from the knock sensor vs. timing logs, or an engine tear down, theres not much else we can do but speculate theory, which the world revolves around.

[Ensi]

Originally Posted by Tzu

I held my tongue 20 pages ago, but until we can see activity from the knock sensor vs. timing logs, or an engine tear down, theres not much else we can do but speculate theory, which the world revolves around.

And scene, 1 vote to lock this thread, it's like a train wreck that I can't help but watch......same info restated and torn apart over and over again.

[Alpina_B3_Lux]

Originally Posted by The HACK

BUT. I do want to speculate as to why you don't see or hear a lot of JuiceBox failures on these forums. And the reason is pretty simple. Quite a vast majority of 335i owners who put tunes on their car rarely put enough stress on their engines to even come remotely close to the conditions that would cause a catastrophic failure.

Most of the owners you see and read about here that put all these crazy tunes and meth and sprays and intercoolers and whatnot, put all the money into their cars to make 450+hp at the wheels ONLY to show that they can make that much power. Most of the time, in fact, I would say, 99.95% of the time they drive from point A to point B, and occasionally put the car on a dyno just so they can show their friends how much power they're making, and once in a while do a "pull" against a C63 lined up at the light or try to show the E9X M3 next to them who's the "boss." Otherwise the rest of the time the car cruises on the freeway at 70 mph at 2,400 rpm.

I think that's a very good point.

The only car (N54) that I've actually seen having loads of track time, being tuned to the max with upgraded turbos and being driven to its limit on lots and lots of occasion is the one from E92Fan. He's done several hundreds of laps on the Nürburgring, driven on the German Autobahn without speed limit and disassembled his engine twice already. There's a thread about his engine rebuild in this forum (sticky) which is quite enlightening.

I fully agree that most users don't even come close to driving to their engine's limit - and even myself, driving lots on German Autobahn for several minutes above 220/240 km/h, up to 300 km/h and doing laps around the 'Ring, I would not pretend to do that less than maybe 3% of the time the engine is actually running.

People in the US with speed limit and most of them without access or intention to go on a track, be it a real circuit or some 1/4 mile racing, cannot really be taken into the equation to judge whether a tune is good or bad for the engine.

For myself, I'll drive my car quite hard this season (again), multiple track visits are intended and probably at the end of this year / beginning of next year I'll also have my engine disassembled. Then we can talk again - as I've only had flashes in my car (first Evotech, now GIAC) as compared to a JB3/4 or PROcede. Everything else is just worthless (well, maybe not entirely but you get my meaning) speculation IMO.

Alpina_B3_Lux

[themyst]

Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux

I think that's a very good point.

The only car (N54) that I've actually seen having loads of track time, being tuned to the max with upgraded turbos and being driven to its limit on lots and lots of occasion is the one from E92Fan. He's done several hundreds of laps on the Nürburgring, driven on the German Autobahn without speed limit and disassembled his engine twice already. There's a thread about his engine rebuild in this forum (sticky) which is quite enlightening.

I fully agree that most users don't even come close to driving to their engine's limit - and even myself, driving lots on German Autobahn for several minutes above 220/240 km/h, up to 300 km/h and doing laps around the 'Ring, I would not pretend to do that less than maybe 3% of the time the engine is actually running.

People in the US with speed limit and most of them without access or intention to go on a track, be it a real circuit or some 1/4 mile racing, cannot really be taken into the equation to judge whether a tune is good or bad for the engine.

For myself, I'll drive my car quite hard this season (again), multiple track visits are intended and probably at the end of this year / beginning of next year I'll also have my engine disassembled. Then we can talk again - as I've only had flashes in my car (first Evotech, now GIAC) as compared to a JB3/4 or PROcede. Everything else is just worthless (well, maybe not entirely but you get my meaning) speculation IMO.

Alpina_B3_Lux

I'd say that is a valid point as well about most people not driving their cars hard, if ever.

I, for one, have 17-18 psi on tap with FBO+meth, find myself doing 75-80 on the freeway on the way to work 99% of the time. That other 1% is racing MB AMGs in Mexico