[Terry335]

Originally Posted by Ado

Interesting results....

I would have never though that it would be that close.

Hey Terry,

You got any guys in or around Toronto (Canada) that have the JB2R? I'd like to run them.

Yeah there are a few actually, throw a post up I bet you'll find some!

[e.n335]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

I'm pretty sure I spent no less than 100 hours tuning my own car on the dyno, on the road, on the drag strip, etc,. I'm pretty sure everyone else gets a map that they download off the website or emailed to them. For the sake of lowest common denominator, the customer maps are always on the conservative side. Where I will push things to 9/10ths on my car. Customer (beta or not) cars may only get 7/10ths. But the advantage of pushing things harder on my car is that I can creep up on the limits on my car without subjecting customers to unnecessary risks. This really shouldn't be shocking. And then there is that whole issue with running carefully hidden non-disclosed mods just to win a race against people who really have no motivation to do the same. Hey, it happens

In the end, tuners should race other tuners and get as creative as they want. And customers should race other customers, running standard off-the-shelf product. The latter being the test of product and, of course, driving. The former being a test of all of the above with creatively, deception and balls.... lol

-shiv

That's how it should be. Beside additional hp/tq tuners have the responsibility to provide reliability as well. Good for their reputation and their customers wallets .

- Eugen

[Driver72]

Originally Posted by e.n335

That's how it should be. Beside additional hp/tq tuners have the responsibility to provide reliability as well. Good for their reputation and their customers wallets .

- Eugen

Exactly.
Another reason when I get my v2.02 I'm going to take away 1-3% on the default settings to play it even a touch more safe.
I don't care if it loses me 5-6 rwhp at peak.

If I wanted to be the fastest 335i out there, I would of spent money I could easily afford to get all the performance mods on it.
But then I would of just bought the Z06 I was considering then anyway.

I'm happy with the power/performance these cars make with just the piggybacks.
Besides, when you are doing rolling runs, being 2 CL's back from 40-130 doesn't seem (and really isn't) that much anyway.
You cover that 2-3 CL's in a blink.

[Terry335]

Originally Posted by Driver72

Besides, when you are doing rolling runs, being 2 CL's back from 40-130 doesn't seem (and really isn't) that much anyway.
You cover that 2-3 CL's in a blink.

... and 2-3 CLs is probably 20-30rwhp. 5-10rwhp is maybe a half car, very little disadvantage.

[Driver72]

Originally Posted by Terry335

... and 2-3 CLs is probably 20-30rwhp. 5-10rwhp is maybe a half car, very little disadvantage.

Yup.

I've been doing rolling runs for YEARS (started in the baron streets in the middle of the desert in Phx. growing up) and I know people bicker and argue over 10 rwhp here, 15 rwtq there, and 2 CL's here, and .1 of a second there.

But until you actually go out and see how little difference that really is, people just don't understand.

I use to always go by the rule ".2 tenths and 2 mph" difference comes down to the drivers. And that's a conservative rule.

For those who don't know, the runs last night show that perfectly.
Two different cars, two different tunes, two different transmissions, varying degrees of mods, and possibly 15+ rwhp difference on a dyno.
But some times the lowered power car will win, other times the higher powered car will win, many times they will tie.

People need to take .1-.2 seconds and 1-2 mph trap speeds into perspective when you are talking about 110+ mph.
It's literally a BLINK of one's eye.

BTW Terry, nice thread to start.
I think it started with us burying the hatchet several weeks ago via PM's and on the other BMW board.
Glad it's spread, thanks

[e.n335]

Originally Posted by Driver72

Exactly.
Another reason when I get my v2.02 I'm going to take away 1-3% on the default settings to play it even a touch more safe.
I don't care if it loses me 5-6 rwhp at peak.

If I wanted to be the fastest 335i out there, I would of spent money I could easily afford to get all the performance mods on it.
But then I would of just bought the Z06 I was considering then anyway.

I'm happy with the power/performance these cars make with just the piggybacks.
Besides, when you are doing rolling runs, being 2 CL's back from 40-130 doesn't seem (and really isn't) that much anyway.
You cover that 2-3 CL's in a blink.

+1

Take away 3-5%

- Eugen

[c0nstant]

well said, terry

[supertech335]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

I'm pretty sure I spent no less than 100 hours tuning my own car on the dyno, on the road, on the drag strip, etc,. I'm pretty sure everyone else gets a map that they download off the website or emailed to them. For the sake of lowest common denominator, the customer maps are always on the conservative side. Where I will push things to 9/10ths on my car. Customer (beta or not) cars may only get 7/10ths. But the advantage of pushing things harder on my car is that I can creep up on the limits on my car without subjecting customers to unnecessary risks. This really shouldn't be shocking. And then there is that whole issue with running carefully hidden non-disclosed mods just to win a race against people who really have no motivation to do the same. Hey, it happens

In the end, tuners should race other tuners and get as creative as they want. And customers should race other customers, running standard off-the-shelf product. The latter being the test of product and, of course, driving. The former being a test of all of the above with creatively, deception and balls.... lol

-shiv

shiv i agree with what you are saying, but there is one problem with customers racing customers, the people i know who have your product are waiting on there v2, so until you send it out to them, us cusomters can't race each other. so if you could get it out to them we all would enjoy seeing, customers race customers so we can test them in the "real world"

[sambonator]

Originally Posted by supertech335

shiv i agree with what you are saying, but there is one problem with customers racing customers, the people i know who have your product are waiting on there v2, so until you send it out to them, us cusomters can't race each other. so if you could get it out to them we all would enjoy seeing, customers race customers so we can test them in the "real world"

In other words, "I WANT MY V2 HARNESS NOW, D*MN IT!!"

[supertech335]

Originally Posted by sambonator

In other words, "I WANT MY V2 HARNESS NOW, D*MN IT!!"

no i actually have a jbs2r, i would like to compare it to other customers vehicles with only a v2 as my car has only a jbs2r, i know someone (both are cars are manual sedans) so it would be a good comparison, he is dying to get his v2 so we can do this. and if i am not mistaken sam you asked shiv to go to the track on the 30th to race terry, so the tuner cars can go at it, not a tuner car vs customer car, not wanting the war to continue, just wanted to say hey, people are willing to do what you want to compare, but we need your help in this too shiv.