[neilvosko]

I am not sure if this belongs in the regular post, but i dropped it in the tracking forum as track sessions on the aggressive Homestead Road course sparked my desire to help cool the brake rotors and prevent brake fade.

so the track has a lot of short straights and turns, which abuses the brakes on a heavy 335i E92.

first step was to replace the rotors to stoptech cryotech slotted rotors with stop tech super street pads (my daily drive)..as i did not want to constantly change out pads (track vs street) for the track session.....so the next step was to add the much awaited rotor cooling like on many other track beasts.
as you all know, there is no off-the-shelf kits available, so i decided to custom build a set. here it goes and hope it helps.
so i ordered some brake shield covers for $10 each from ecs tuning

then a set of 3" aluminum flanges:
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalo...uctflanges.php

and the brake ducts from turner: Part #: TBR9962303
http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-13...th-clamps.aspx

[neilvosko]

next up was the rotor side coupling for the hoses. so i made a 3" hole for the flange in each shield on the opposite side of the brake calipers.

then had a shop weld them in place ($ 80 labor + $30 parts)

[neilvosko]

next it was time to install the brake shields, which i had done when i had my rotors changed

[neilvosko]

so then i took the other flange, spray painted it black to match the colors of plastic.

attached the duct hose and mounted in front behind the lower grill.

notes: i had the perfect space (per pic) as you can see since i had a huge FMIC installed and had to remove all the worthless plastic shrouds.

i also had ER dual oil cooler kit installed, and had to remove the worthless stock brake ducts, so the space between the cooler core and frame is perfect for a 3" duct flange.

then i secured with the old reliable, zip tie.

[neilvosko]

here is the final setup on the rotor side.

[neilvosko]

One thing i found is front wheel rubbing the ducts when steering wheel turned ALL the way.

so what i did was compress the hose flatter where the wheel would hit and now make sure i dont turn the steering wheel more than 360 degrees. no issues since.

[IN54NITY]

Awesome. I've been reading a similar thread in the M3 forum. I am DOING it.

[neilvosko]

i will update you on the track temperatures, results sometime this fall time frame. i just had a new LSD installed and waiting the 1000 miles break in period before i track again. oh did i mention i am in miami and the summers here are brutal and not bearable on the track. i may break down and do sebring in july but will try to hold off until the temps cool off a bit.

[The HACK]

The air needs to be directed mostly to the inside hub opening or else you're not really doing any significant cooling of the rotor, since at speed, the rotor spinning will create a bernoulli effect preventing the majority of the cooler air from coming in contact with the hot rotor. Piping even just a small fraction of that air into the inside of the hub will be 100X more effective, since the rotors are vented and as it spins, draws air from the inside hub out to cool the rotor.

[yandy]

Glad you got this working man! thanks for posting it up.

If you don't mind, which LSD did you end up getting and who did the install for you?

I'm installing the ER Wide Body kit soon and may do this while I'm it under there.

[neilvosko]

here are the plastic pieces i removed behind the lower grill between the cooler core and frame to make room for the brake duct flange.

[N54_Fan]

Originally Posted by The HACK

The air needs to be directed mostly to the inside hub opening or else you're not really doing any significant cooling of the rotor, since at speed, the rotor spinning will create a bernoulli effect preventing the majority of the cooler air from coming in contact with the hot rotor. Piping even just a small fraction of that air into the inside of the hub will be 100X more effective, since the rotors are vented and as it spins, draws air from the inside hub out to cool the rotor.

This. Hate to say it Neil I agree with the HACK. You need to get that hole closer to the hub. We have the same ER oil cooler so ther eis not much room for this mod. I think a 2.5 inch hose directed at the center of the hub would work better for you that the 3 inch setup blowing toward the side of the rotor. You should look into getting a pop rivet gun to do this instead of paying someone to weld a new set.

Thanks for the pics Neil. But dont those plastic pieces support the radiator and heat exchanger? It is hard to tell but they look similar to what I have noticed on my car and the reason I was thinking 2.5 inch might fit better. Could you explain what they were doing,...hard to tell in the pic.

Thanks

[neilvosko]

Hi Yandy, i got the Quaife LSD. i had Foreign Affairs Motorsport in pompano beach install it. a bit of a drive, but well worth it, as its father and two sons that run the shop and they are super meticulous. Jarod there has a 335is runs the bmw portion. we see them at homestead all the time.

[neilvosko]

thanks for the input guys, i agree with you too, but i could not cut the hole any closer, i had to leave 1/4" for support. here are some similar setups from the 1M and the M3.

i think the lucky 135 owners can use the 1m kit? and the M3 setup is over 400 bux.

i had the 3" crushed a bit at the point where there may be some rubbing, so its tighter than 2.5" would be, plus still have the large volume of air going there with the 3".

i would think that at the high speeds the rotors would create a suction effect and channel some of the air from the ducts anyway?

[neilvosko]

another lesson learned is that you can use the 3" hose and not have it rub at all if you tunnel a bit lower, i have the ER dual oil cooler and super worried about puncturing the lines with either the hole saw or metal from the hose, so i went a little higher, but then realized that a bit lower would avoid the tire.
i have an open lower grill, so looks like air will still get channeled to the flange.

let me know if there are any other pictures you need me to take. i will take pics with 360 degree steering wheel. 540 and 720 degree steering.

[3002 tii]

I have no doubt brake ducts serve a purpose but I can't help but think you went about this backwards. If you're that serious about tracking (which appears to be the case), I think you would have been better off just biting the bullet and getting a 2nd set of track pads. That combined with high temp fluid would see better results than brake duct kit + street pads. It's almost as if you're trying to avoid the inevitable, which is no street pad is going to prevent fade in a heavy car like yours on the courses you describe. Also, not sure how your tubing is routed but do you find that it pinches during full lock?

[yandy]

Originally Posted by Dubbedown

I have no doubt brake ducts serve a purpose but I can't help but think you went about this backwards. If you're that serious about tracking (which appears to be the case), I think you would have been better off just biting the bullet and getting a 2nd set of track pads. That combined with high temp fluid would see better results than brake duct kit + street pads. It's almost as if you're trying to avoid the inevitable, which is no street pad is going to prevent fade in a heavy car like yours on the courses you describe. Also, not sure how your tubing is routed but do you find that it pinches during full lock?

This I have to agree with, if you are serious about continuing to track, proper track pads is a must.

I played the street pad game, even the hybrids, but as you push harder and harder, you'll need real pads for the track.

[neilvosko]

here is the pic of the ducts with steering wheel at 360 dergees

[neilvosko]

steering wheel at full lock

[mid-corner fun]

+1

In all the excitement for the pics and fitment, I missed the street pad comment altogether. Leave the street pads for the street and get some track pads. After a few tries, you should be able to swap all 4 corners in less than an hour. Very little time investment for a major improvement at the track.

[neilvosko]

i had to crush the hose to get the effective diameter down to 2.5" so really you can use 2.5" hose and flanges for your kit if you like, for me i just went with 3" as thats what the hose kit from turner had and i had bought the 3" flanges for the mr5 intake.

note: thats plasti-dip i sprayed to use as an indicator for any damage.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by neilvosko

thanks for the input guys, i agree with you too, but i could not cut the hole any closer, i had to leave 1/4" for support. here are some similar setups from the 1M and the M3.

i think the lucky 135 owners can use the 1m kit? and the M3 setup is over 400 bux.

i had the 3" crushed a bit at the point where there may be some rubbing, so its tighter than 2.5" would be, plus still have the large volume of air going there with the 3".

i would think that at the high speeds the rotors would create a suction effect and channel some of the air from the ducts anyway?

Problem with those kit is that they look like they're designed by someone who don't know what they're doing and didn't bother to actually do some real testing to see if it dramatically improved the brake cooling issues plaguing the 1 series, and decided to just "CF" the parts to make it look pretty. Because, if it's made of carbon fiber, it's got to be race worthy, right?

Most of the well designed kits I see on the Track/AX forum on Bimmerforums sold by teams that actually race their cars, has at least 1/3rd of the opening covering the inside of the hub. That way, air is redirected to where it's needed, not where it's being bounced back by spinning rotors.

I have to admit, they do look pretty.