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Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility
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03-12-2013, 05:54 AM | #1 |
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Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility
A few weeks back I had an issue where my car was outside in the cold overnight and when I tried to start it in the morning it did not want to start and tried to catch then the engine quit. I did it about 5 times and then it misfired and started up, ran rough, then was perfectly fine. Afterwards, I've had no problems since. Because I was worried I pulled codes and found the shadow codes below. I read up on the forums that this is a more recent issue with N52 engines (2006 330i). Now, the car seems to run fine, and I don't have the codes others in the forums have reported or the hesitation during acceleration. I spoke to an independent mechanic and they said that it could be the eccentric shaft sensor, or the valvetronic motor, or the timing and that I should isolate it before throwing parts at it. In addition, I found oil in the electrical connector. I cleaned it with MAF cleaner and let it dry. I have photos attached. Again, the car runs fine now since that one day.
My question(s) before I pull the valve cover off and replace the sensor. 1) Is there a way to isolate this using INPA or other tools. I'd hate to do this only to learn I was wrong in diagnosis. How can pinpoint what I need to fix? 2) What are the possible consequences if I wait until a component like this fails? $SGBD: MSV70 Version: 5.14 ================================================== ========================================= $DATAID: 004 9PP0L 921S 0AC3S === 09.03.2013 === 13:12:37 Aktueller Kilometerstand: 99783 km __________________________________________________ _________ Commandline 1: valvetronic Commandline 2: __________________________________________________ _________ $FehlerOrtNr: 10807 $FehlerOrtText: 2A37 Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility 57022A37080410170908302631320946302631470E46306D31 470F4A Error: 1(2) Nr: 10807 2A37 Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility frequency: 9 type of error: 8 (126 ) Sensor signals to each other not plausibel readiness flag: (16 ) Test conditions fulfilled error-statur: (32 ) current fault not existing, OBD not debounced MIL - Status: (48) fault caused no signal at warning lamp P-Code: P1017 VVT-Sensors Plausibility (Bank 1) F_LZ: 8 environment-text / entry at 99176 km(n.) 98608 km(2.) 98608 km(1.) VVT sensor voltage supply 4.90 V 4.90 V 4.90 V VVT actual angle 55.47 ° 55.47 ° 39.06 ° VVT sensor differential 10.55 ° 9.84 ° 6.33 ° Engine temperature 7.50 °C 4.50 °C 4.50 °C __________________________________________________ _________ $FehlerOrtNr: 10823 $FehlerOrtText: 2A47 Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility 57022A470804101705073026006B2802303D00921402306D00 6C2602 Error: 2(2) Nr: 10823 2A47 Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility frequency: 5 type of error: 8 (234 ) sensor failure readiness flag: (16 ) Test conditions fulfilled error-statur: (32 ) current fault not existing, OBD not debounced MIL - Status: (48) fault caused no signal at warning lamp P-Code: P1017 VVT-Sensors Plausibility (Bank 1) F_LZ: 7 environment-text / entry at 99176 km(n.) 98792 km(2.) 98608 km(1.) Speed 0.00 km/h 0.00 km/h 0.00 km/h Voltage terminal 87 10.97 V 14.83 V 10.87 V Engine speed 1216.00 rpm 640.00 rpm 1280.00 rpm Engine status IS IS IS __________________________________________________ _________ ================================================== ========================================= $DATAID: 004 9PP0L 921S 0AC3S === 09.03.2013 === 13:13:33 Aktueller Kilometerstand: 99783 km __________________________________________________ _________ Commandline 1: detail Commandline 2: __________________________________________________ _________ $FehlerOrtNr: 10807 $FehlerOrtText: 2A37 Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility 57022A37080410170908302631320946302631470E46306D31 470F4A Error: 1(2) Nr: 10807 2A37 Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility frequency: 9 type of error: 8 (126 ) Sensor signals to each other not plausibel readiness flag: (16 ) Test conditions fulfilled error-statur: (32 ) current fault not existing, OBD not debounced MIL - Status: (48) fault caused no signal at warning lamp P-Code: P1017 VVT-Sensors Plausibility (Bank 1) F_LZ: 8 environment-text / entry at 99176 km(n.) 98608 km(2.) 98608 km(1.) VVT sensor voltage supply 4.90 V 4.90 V 4.90 V VVT actual angle 55.47 ° 55.47 ° 39.06 ° VVT sensor differential 10.55 ° 9.84 ° 6.33 ° Engine temperature 7.50 °C 4.50 °C 4.50 °C __________________________________________________ _________ $FehlerOrtNr: 10823 $FehlerOrtText: 2A47 Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility 57022A470804101705073026006B2802303D00921402306D00 6C2602 Error: 2(2) Nr: 10823 2A47 Valvetronic, eccentric shaft sensor: plausibility frequency: 5 type of error: 8 (234 ) sensor failure readiness flag: (16 ) Test conditions fulfilled error-statur: (32 ) current fault not existing, OBD not debounced MIL - Status: (48) fault caused no signal at warning lamp P-Code: P1017 VVT-Sensors Plausibility (Bank 1) F_LZ: 7 environment-text / entry at 99176 km(n.) 98792 km(2.) 98608 km(1.) Speed 0.00 km/h 0.00 km/h 0.00 km/h Voltage terminal 87 10.97 V 14.83 V 10.87 V Engine speed 1216.00 rpm 640.00 rpm 1280.00 rpm Engine status IS IS IS |
03-12-2013, 09:30 AM | #2 |
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Looks like you are onto something there!
Saw this vid last year sometime which might be helpful! Yep, tired of throwing good money at this car of mine - I reckon it is time for me to get rid of it and look for something else, and maybe not even another BMW sadly, pity but why would I want to burn my fingers again!? In your case it does seem like you have a fairly common problem that is fixable. |
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03-12-2013, 11:49 PM | #3 |
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Its your eccentric shaft sensor, the seal around the sensor fails and oil gets into the connector, fouling the sensor, someone on the forums replaced the sensor its not the easiest job, search for the DIY. Cleaning it like you did may solve the problem short term, I'm surprised it still works.
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03-13-2013, 11:33 AM | #4 |
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Hi index,
You mentioned "the seal around the sensor fails and oil gets into the connector, fouling the sensor". 1. Where does this fail specifically? Internally, where I cannot get into it or on the outside. It appears that the oil came up through the electrical pin holes as the connector doesn't appear to have much oil on it but more in it. I see in one of the DIY for this problem that the actual seal is a round wedge that can be tapped in there after you re attach the valve cover. I'm wondering if there are other problems that might be related or if this is really only this sensor going "foul". 2. Does anyone know how I could check/isolate it? I'm a fair hand with IT and the mechnical part as well. I just don't have the experience or exposure to do anything useful other than what I did already. |
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03-13-2013, 04:06 PM | #5 | |
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If you run ISTA/D against the car, it'll ask you if 2A47 was the only valvetronic code, if it isn't (and it's not in this case), it'll immediately tell you to replace the sensor. I had to replace this recently myself, at first I got the code and the car ran fine for awhile, but it got progressively worse and worse. You'll need to pull the valve cover from the car in order to replace the sensor, so if you have a 330i like myself, you'll need a new valvetronic sensor, valve cover gasket, and a new set of valve cover bolts (you cannot reuse the existing bolts as they are aluminum). It's a pain in the ass job, but you are looking at about $400-$500 in parts and time. |
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03-13-2013, 10:42 PM | #6 | |
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To answer your question, my main driving force to rule everything else out and decide it was this sensor was the 2 codes I was getting (2A31 & 2A47), and the fact that it had oil in it. If it has oil that is a good indication this is your culprit. I replaced the sensor, 2 gaskets when you take the valve cover off (one goes around the middle where your coils are, other around the edge), and also the grommet that surrounds the valvetronic motor and the sensor. I figured these were good ideas, and I am happy that I did them. Also screws of course. For the torque settings check the N52 motor manual, it covers exactly what to set. If you need that let me know. I tried the same as you, cleaning the sensor. I found that it didn't fix the issue and my car still got progressively worse. I was troubleshooting and debating the sensor replacement for about 3-4 weeks. Maybe one other thing...Do you find your idle is normal when you start the car and when you're stopped? When you press the clutch in, does the rpm move up ~300 rpm? I saw those problems as well. Once I replaced the sensor, idle is fixed and no more rpm movement when I depress the clutch If you got questions just ask! Last edited by stoppy; 03-13-2013 at 10:48 PM.. |
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03-14-2013, 02:56 AM | #7 |
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Thank you everyone for your contributions. I'd like to rule out other secondary issues but it looks like I will have to start buying parts.
Dracon, In reference to to your "only code" it has two codes (2A47/2A37) Are these separate errors for the same component or is there another sensor? Reading up on them it says the "plausibility" error is due to the data being fed to the DME is invalid or out of spec but how does it know this without a second sensor/measurement? 1) Where would I find the diagnosis tool ISTA/D? 2) Is this a correct list of parts for a 2006 e90 330i sedan with sport? Eccentric Shaft Sensor: 11-37-7-524-879 Eccentric Shaft Sensor gasket: 11127528242 Valve/cylinder cover gasket: 11127581215 Valvetronic motor gasket 11-12-7-552-280 Aluminium Blue Screws 11-12-0-409-288 Any other screws or parts? To answer your question stoppy: "Do you find your idle is normal when you start the car and when you're stopped? When you press the clutch in, does the rpm move up ~300 rpm?" I have an AT but I noticed the shifting idle speeds bouncing up and down. It didn't run "harsh" or shake itself though. Since using the MAF cleaner the up down ~300 rpm is gone. On an off note, I noticed a more pronounced "ticking" and strange engine behavior but I don't have a way to describe it. The best I can do is just say I've had that car nearly seven years and I know when anything is amiss even when I can't articulate it. It still drives fine, seems a little more flat at the low RPM but I don't have facts. 3) Should I replace other components? Since I'm in the valve cover and at 100km. Plugs, for example? Any recommendations while I'm in there? I didn't get codes for coils, etc. I read about people cleaning parts in there such as solenoids. This is off topic (but related) but I have a more pronounced lifter tick now. I did not notice it as much as I used to drive the snot of out the car (the high flow oil pump was always getting a workout) but I do lots of short driving trips for the past six months. If/when I isolate the "eccentric shaft sensor" component; I will replace it myself as I have the tools, am mechanically inclined, and have all the "how-tos" on the internet to cross reference. However, the part I'm not sure about is: 4) Does anything else have to be "recalibrated" by a software or tool I don't own? A perfect example of what I'm talking about is the battery which anyone can replace and it works just fine. Anyone out there can replace the battery but most people or even non BMW servicing garages will not know to reset the "learn mode" for the charging profile adaptation or to change the coding for if you go from a normal battery to an AGM as they are completely different. Cheers everyone and thank you for effort and contributions. Last edited by Yzandrl; 03-14-2013 at 11:49 AM.. Reason: Updated corrected part numbers |
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03-14-2013, 05:00 AM | #8 |
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Just replace the sensor, you have oil in the sensor, the car is throwing codes specifically to that sensor, its not the valvetronic motor like said above you would be throwing codes on that.
Go on Amazon, purchase the Bentley 3 Series Service Manual (2010 version) its about $80 outlines this procedure, if you plan on doing it yourself, and/or read the sensor replacement DIY posted on here. But the book is good because it gives you all the torque valves which bolts to replace ect. Find the part numbers on realoem.com Looks like your in germany so I doubt you can get the parts for 20 percent under MSRP like we can from getbmwparts.com Its just a sensor, nothing you have to reset/calibrate. Don't worry about the lifter noise, its a non-issue just annoying, the noise is coming from the springs no damage or wear is occurring, there are TSB's on this to replace the lifters with new updated parts which I had done on my car but just drive the car longer. Plugs/Coils should be solid for 100k miles not KM. Careful not to get any fuel on the silicon coils as this degrades them. Keep a eye out for your oil filter housing gasket, part is about $15 mine started leaking around 90k miles. I waited a long time to change it made a mess of a oil leak all over the front half of the motor. Book also outlines this, but dont remove the intake manifold work around it with tools universal joint ect. to get the 3 bolts out drain the coolant first (just drain the radiator) pull it off clean replace gasket done. Fill/bleed coolant using procedure outlined in book with OEM coolant mixed with 50/50 distilled water (Important) Last edited by RemovedUser; 03-14-2013 at 05:10 AM.. |
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03-14-2013, 12:33 PM | #9 |
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I have the Bentley service manual and yes I think I will do this myself. I took the car today to a dealer for diagnostics just to be sure of the problem. I just received the email stating that it is only the sensor in error. They have run tests and I don’t know what they ran but they said it was only the sensor. Sometimes I fear that they just start the engine, pull codes, and the computer spits out “replace parts, a, b, c, and d”. I truly hope it was more than that.
Index, 1) You mentioned be “…Careful not to get any fuel on the silicon coils as this degrades them.” How would that occur? 2) Should I change the plugs? Is that “throwing parts” at a problem that doesn’t exist or is it “prudent”? 3) Should I replace the valvetronic motor gasket? Parts list: Eccentric Shaft Sensor: 11-37-7-524-879 Eccentric Shaft Sensor gasket: 11127528242 Valve/cylinder cover gasket: 11127581215 Valvetronic motor gasket (SA stated it was not necessary as it does not expand) Aluminium Blue Screws 11-12-0-409-288 Parts would total $359.91 USD and the labor would be about $671.00 USD |
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03-14-2013, 04:19 PM | #10 |
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Thats a good deal on the parts, I guess german dealers don't mark up parts 100 percent over MSRP like they do in the US.
Just a warning if you ever disconnect a fuel line don't let it come in contact with the coils. (Not necessary in this job.) I would replace the valvetronic motor gasket your going to have to remove it anyway, and its cheap and easy. Wait on the plugs you have low miles, wait till the car hits 100k miles before you change them. |
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03-17-2013, 09:20 AM | #11 | |
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1) You can find it online, but unless you purchase the darksys version, you'll need an ICOM to use it. ISTA/D is the dealership diagnostics program used by BMW, it reads the error codes and gives you repair plans based on those codes. 2) Looks correct to me, although, it's not required but you may want to replace the bolts that hold the valvetronic motor in place as well. Should be very cheap, but they are also technically aluminum and are supposed to be one time use like the valve cover. |
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03-18-2013, 09:51 AM | #12 |
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Dracon,
Thank you for your reply. For your first comment about diagnostics; what would work with the darksys version? For ISTA it sounds likes its out of my price range with ICOM. I'm starting to understand why the dealership replaces so many uneccesary parts. One component with three behind it if they scan all and shows four errors...just let the decision tree application pump out the answers and replace all four instead of one. Effective? 100% Necessary? No. I have requested both the motor mount gasket and the three bolts. They are not blue tipped but if they are aluminum, then I agree with you. I'm already anxious enough about having to find ways to get broken aluminum bolts out of the head much less dealing with breaking them because I was too cheap to find three bolts on a $1000 USD repair effort. Part# 11 37 7 516 302 for the valvetronic motor gasket Part# 07 12 9 902 813 for the valvetronic motor mounting bolts |
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03-21-2013, 01:37 PM | #13 |
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Update
After an ordeal I've managed to isolate the problem and had it confirmed by dealer. I finally obtained all the correct parts (hopefully), and have been researching posts and YouTube videos to prepare myself for the repair. I have the tools, and the Bentley publishers repair book and have read through it as well as the online DIY step by step guides for replacement of sensor.
I’m planning on the surgery this weekend but studying up before I do it. Could anyone provide any further feedback on things that aren't in the Bentley or DIY guide? Any "lessons learned" out there that people would be willing to share? I read posts and DIYs here, saw DIYs on different forums as well as this video I found on YouTube for a 328i. 1. I read from others that getting the valve cover out of the engine was very difficult. What did everyone do to fix that? I see in the video the technician removed sheet metal in order to make it easier. 2. I saw in the video it was very difficult to remove the fuel injector wiring harness and it had to be pulled out with difficulty, is there a finesse way to do this? 3. I read in the Bentley book that when installing I should use glycerin to coat the parts that touch the gasket. Any other tricks such as this? Also, is it better to put the gasket on the cover or the cylinder head? 4. In the Bentley book it also states in the warning part to "not get silicone sealant in near the vanos or actuator or solenoid or it will cause faults". It also states to "place a small quantity of silicone sealant at metal to metal seams. I don't understand where to put that. Isn't the gasket the entire seal? 5. I read that it would be a good idea to cycle the key without starting 5 times. Do I need to reset any adaptations after doing this and what would I use in INPA? Anything else I should check while in there or not likely to be aware of and should be? Cheers! |
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04-09-2013, 05:01 AM | #14 |
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Replace eccentric valve sensor - after action report
It took about 5 hours to do and wasn't the easiest to do. Some parts were pretty easy but the rest wasn’t. Here are some after action notes for the next person to go after this.
I had to trim with dremel the plastic bits that get in the way of the cover which made it much easier to remove/add the cover. I didn’t go all the way though the plastic as you see, just about half a centimeter was enough to let the rear hose port out. I added a little silicon just in case the seal is weakened by my action. After, I practiced with the valve cover and old gasket before I tried to the new one. With the modification it was easy; please practice add/remove before you use the new gasket. I scraped clean the metal surfaces of the old gasket using a wooden spoon. Worked well and won’t hurt the metal. I then covered both the top and bottom surfaces with a little light covering of glycerin to allow it to seat. I had some trouble adding and removing the sensor with the bottom bolt in it. I tied dental floss to it and carefully and unscrewed it all the way out and it was easy and did the same for the installation. When dealing with the small spaces and the rear cylinder bolts I used floss there too in case of dropping. Had a massive pain getting coil number #4 out it took a whole bunch of time and pulling. There has to be a tool or something to use. I had the rest out without too much trouble but #3 and #4 were next to the valvetronic motor and was hard. When I change plugs in the future I will search for a tool or tie a narrow rope around it and pull (not on connector). Had a little confusion about which cables went over which in the rear. Take photos or good notes. I managed to find other photos on the internet to confirm the locations. Same with the battery/ground posts (see blue circle). The ones that are red go to red, the black goes to black. Also, if I did it again I might disconnect the coolant reservoir to make space for the wiring harness as I couldn’t disconnect the ends easily and had to pull it over to the side with bungee cords (see red circle). I also found that the Bentley guide wasn’t as much use as I would have liked. It had the torque values but much of the rest was pretty much too simplistic or incorrect. I found many differences between the pictures and information from my engine to the others. Speaking of torque values; please find a bicycle tool torque or a small automotive torque wrench. My mid-size torque wrench was useless because of size and the small torque amount. I hand tightened the bolts with a screw driver extension and oily fingers to about 5-6 ft lbs and then did the 90 degree tighten. I’d have to buy a separate torque wrench if I did this again. All in all, it went well. No leaks and the engine certainly runs and idles smoother and starts immediately. I don’t know if it has more responsive power or fuel economy but I think it does with my un-calibrated butt dyno and will need to do a road trip to see how the fuel economy is. To finish it off I opened the old sensor and found that the seal under the metal plate is gooey - fluid like and appears to be dissolved or saturated by oil. I use Mobile1 LL1 spec 0w40. I don’t know if the oil or its additives could have done this but here is a photo of the inside of the sensor. Hopefully the new one is better. |
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09-10-2013, 02:40 AM | #16 |
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Update on results
Hey - realise this hasn't been posted to for a little while, but believe I may have the same issue and am preparing to do the same DIY.
What's the verdict on performance/issues after a few months of driving? Cheers |
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09-10-2013, 03:20 AM | #17 |
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The result is there have been no more "problem cold starts" and the system has no more errors stored in code as I pull the full codes occasionally using VMware windows/XP/ODBC usb cables. There is definitely a measurable increase in fuel economy and I still believe there is more power on acceleration. This was a precise, necessary repair that worked out well.
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09-10-2013, 10:01 AM | #18 |
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Hello, new to all this forum stuff so please bare with me. I recently bought a 318SE E90. Best car i have had so far in terms of how it drives.
Yesterday i was visiting friends around 100 miles away. Car drove beautifully all the way there. However, when i got back in the car later on, it would not start. It is turning over but just a consistent starter motor noise. After about 3 attempts the orange engine sign came on. From reading previous posts it seems that this is the loss of power warning light. As i was 100 miles from home i rang the RAC who plugged it into there computer. 7 fault codes appeared all relating to this valvetronic system. The codes he wrote down are as follows - 2A59 Valvetronic Excentric Shaft Sensor 2A5B Valvetronic Excentric Shaft Sensor 2A61 Valvetronic Adaption 2A67 Valvetronic Internal Fault 2A6B Valvetronic Restriction 2E7C Data Interface 2EBE Unknown These are as he wrote down for me. I have now had the car towed to a BMW Specialist, who says he will have a look at it. I just want to know if anybody has had a similar problem in which the car is working fine and then completely nothing as most of the threads on here and around the internet have said that the car has this problem but then starts (causing it to be a bit throaty at first then normal). Just want to make sure that when the garage ring me they are not having me over because as you can probably tell by how this is worded im not that clued up with car mechanics. Many Thanks in advance. |
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09-19-2013, 10:17 PM | #19 |
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Hi. This is my first post in E90post, and I really wished it wasn't a rant :/
I bought a 2008 328i with really low miles (~36k) (from Dallas, TX) back in May, and then I moved to (Austin, TX) for college. Before moving, I did full 30pt inspection at the BMW Dealer at Plano and it passed without any problems. I did have to change my oil in about 3000 miles. Last week I changed my oil at a repair shop specialized in BMW, since it was closer to where I stayed and did the oil change while I waited. About four days after, the car starts to rumble during every cold start; the rumbling would go away after few minutes of driving. I went back to the shop and they said the oil had leaked into the valvetronic and everything surrounding it. Also, that it would cost about 1400 for the parts and labor. I was obviously very infuriated with this, however, told them to go ahead and fix it. Of course they had said that this is a common problem with every E90 and was not the result of their oil change. Is there any validity in their case? What else should I ask them to be sure it is their fault or not? Thanks for any reply! |
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12-11-2013, 12:56 PM | #20 |
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Yzandrl great job! Good to hear you fixed the problem and save a ton of money.
I would love to tackle this myself but I'm not sure if I could and it's winter and getting really cold here in Canada. If I had a heated garage I might have tackle this myself... Seems like a common problem now. My car the code 2A43 Valvetronic Thermal Overload Protection Warring Threshold a few months back and I was told by my mechanic to take it to a BMW dealership to get the DME Software updated. I didn't get that done so yesterday I was driving out of work and my CEL came on. I went back to the same mechanic and he read the code again. I got two codes this time. The 2A43 and the other one I forgot but he did explain to me that I needed to replace these parts. -Eccentric Shaft Positioning Sensor -Eccentric Shaft Actuator Seal (I called a BMW dealership on this and they couldn't find a part related to that) -Shaft Connector Seal (same with this part) -Valve Cover Gasket 5 hours lab and he suggested to do an oil change also so around $1275 + taxes. I'm not sure if the 2A43 cause the Eccentric Shaft Sensor to fail but I don't think the oil change cause the sensor to fail in your case. |
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