[Kerr]

You are misreading the chart.

When you buy an approved used BMW the dealers are supposed to stick to the guidelines.

He's clearly breaching the rules, and even when picked up on it, tried to lie and he has altered the correct minimum thickness of 26.4mm down to 23.4mm.

They are originally 28mm and BMW allow 1.6mm wear down to 26.4mm. He edited the figures to allow for 2mm more than what BMW permit. So BWM only allow you 1.6mm wear, but he's trying to say 3.6mm is ok.

The pads have a wear sensor at 4.2mm. The pads are at 5mm. That's a minimal amount of life.

You can even see the person who conducted the check has put an X in the box to say attention is required.

They know they need done and have tried to avoid doing it. They've then tried to lie further when picked up on it.

Once they've realised they no chance of getting me to buy the car without new brakes, they've tried to charge me for them!

That's extemely bad practice no matter how you look at it..

[Aragorn30d]

i agree, the guys been a bell end. I'm just pointing out that brake disks under the minimum are fine, until the point that the pads need replaced, at which point the whole lot must be changed. If the pads have 90% life let, and the disks dip below the minimum, you can continue using those disks until the pads are done.

Having said that, the chart also says the pads should be replaced if they're worn within 3mm of the wear limit, which as you've pointed out is 4.2mm. The pads are at ~5. and so should be replaced regardless, as they're only 1mm away from the wear limit.

And ofcourse they cant fit new pads onto those worn disks, so yes, the whole lot does infact need replaced immediately. Bastards!

[Aragorn30d]

I would be writing a letter of complaint to BMW Customer Services.

[m20b25]

This is the third thread I've read recently about Sytner AUCs. 3 different dealers as well.

[djgandy]

Originally Posted by Aragorn30d

i agree, the guys been a bell end. I'm just pointing out that brake disks under the minimum are fine, until the point that the pads need replaced, at which point the whole lot must be changed. If the pads have 90% life let, and the disks dip below the minimum, you can continue using those disks until the pads are done.

Having said that, the chart also says the pads should be replaced if they're worn within 3mm of the wear limit, which as you've pointed out is 4.2mm. The pads are at ~5. and so should be replaced regardless, as they're only 1mm away from the wear limit.

And ofcourse they cant fit new pads onto those worn disks, so yes, the whole lot does infact need replaced immediately. Bastards!

The discs are already well under the minimum.

If you drove this car into BMW For a service, they'd have to you discs and pads, saying the discs are "dangerously low and need changing immediately".

When they are footing the bill, it seems that's not the case.

[Kerr]

Originally Posted by djgandy

The discs are already well under the minimum.

If you drove this car into BMW For a service, they'd have to you discs and pads, saying the discs are "dangerously low and need changing immediately".

When they are footing the bill, it seems that's not the case.

Indeed. It becomes much worse when he was so forceful to tell me I was wrong, then use Paint to alter the genuine figures.

It's not as if he's mistaken, he's made a genuine effort to deceive which is much, much worse.

[ahmedb]

Wow, what a 6 months of experience you've had from crafty salesmen/saleswomen!!

You should name and shame all over the net, that's disgusting behaviour. And to think, if you weren't car savvy or prepared to put up a fight, you could have ended up with either of those cars.

Some other poor soul out there is going to be victim of some serious foul play

[The0pportunist]

I would social media the SHIT out of this dealer!

[Mikeyscott]

I had a bad sales experience with Sytner so the group clearly lowering standards or trying to bully customers

Do BMW permit 3rd party inspections?

[Mikeyscott]

Originally Posted by m20b25

This is the third thread I've read recently about Sytner AUCs. 3 different dealers as well.

Worrying trend

Apart from Birds, who else in independent recommendations

[Kerr]

Here's BMW's response.

Good morning Brian

*Thanks for your email about your sales experience at Sytner Coventry. I’m sorry to hear about this – I can understand your concern.

*BMW UK has certain guidelines for Centres to follow but Sytner Coventry is an independent business - so they’re responsible for the service they provide. I’ve sent a copy of your email to Paul Cridland, used car sales manager at the Centre. He’s agreed to contact you in the next 48 hrs to address the issues you’ve raised. I’ve also asked him to keep me updated with the outcome.

In the meantime, if there’s anything else I can help you with, please get back in touch.

So basically AUC means nothing. Each garage can apply their own standards, or lack of more like.

[Mikeyscott]

Same response I had when I had a VW issue. Said we can advise, nothing more. So VW AUC means nothing too.

Dealer blocked me from their Facebook page after a stinging review

[Kerr]

The manager responded and has asked me to put forward his response to clear things up.

Good afternoon Mr Kerr,

*

Firstly may I convey my apologies for how you feel your experience has been with us thus far. Upon reading your email a number of issues concerned me, as amongst them are some fairly serious allegations you are making. I have conducted an internal investigation to understand where the failings have occurred and uncovered some interesting details that we can learn from.

*

In your email you mention the minimum thickness of the brake discs as stated by BMW to pass AUC checks is 26.4mm. I can confirm this is indeed correct. However a Z4M Coupe can be fitted with 2 different size brake discs that will perform perfectly safely, the size from the factory is 345x28 which requires a minimum of 26.4mm for AUC OR it can be fitted with 325x25 which require a minimum of 23.4mm. Please see attached a screenshot from BMW’s Integrated Service Technical Application (ISTA) system to back this up, I have circled the 2 different discs sizes and minimums for clarity. I would suggest that at some stage during this vehicle’s life a previous owner has had new pads and discs fitted, and chosen the smaller (assumingly cheaper) alternative. Having spoken with the technician who carried out the AUC it would appear that he has simply written down the first measurement (26.4mm) and on review of the discs on the car overwritten this number with the correct 23.4mm number. So I feel confident that we are not trying to skirt BMW’s standards, something we take extremely seriously and carry out to the letter. Especially on a safety related subject such as brakes.

*

Can I just say at this stage that there is absolutely NO evidence whatsoever to lead me to believe an AUC document has been doctored, to suggest my sales executive of that merely on the basis that he has the Microsoft Paint programme open on his computer is, I feel, somewhat unwarranted and disappointing.

*

Having said all that I feel the main issue we have fallen down on is that of communication. My sales executive should not be speculating as to any measurement unless 100% confident and with all relevant details to hand for you the customer to consider. Something I can assure you I will be taking up with him at the next available opportunity.

*

You spoke in your email about raising this issue on various forums, please feel free to feedback this information on any available format, as I must admit even I did not know this without doing my homework and clearly would not expect our customers to be armed with such technical knowledge when enquiring to our businesses.

*

I would hope that this explanation restores some trust in the AUC programme BMW run, which is extremely comprehensive and a superb reason for our customers to buy with faith and peace of mind.

*

Kind Regards,

*

Paul Cridland

Does anyone buy that? His attachment didn't load.

So there was an option of smaller discs, that were 25mm wide.

However according to the AUC report, the pads were worn all the way down to 5mm, yet the disc measured 25.5mm.

The incredible growing brake discs.

[Dann]

I don't agree with that at all.
BMW only lists one size brake disc for the Z4M which is the 345 x 28mm.

There is a 325mm disc available but that's for the normal M3 not the CSL and as the calipers and carriers are different, wouldn't fit the smaller disc properly?

Could you ask for them to measure the diameter or give the PN off the discs?

Do you have the VIN or numberplate?

[Kerr]

N1 DHO is the plate on the car.

If you look on page one, you'll see the chassis number too.


I emailed him back about the discrepencies on his numbers and his salesman's effort to rip me off.


The response was to enjoy my new car!

Caught out and he knows it.

[Aragorn30d]

If the disk measured 25.5 then it cant possibly have the 25mm disks fitted.

Disks get thinner with age, not thicker :P

So it would seem the car does infact have the 345x28 disks fitted, and they are heavily worn down to 25.5mm

[djgandy]

Originally Posted by Dann

I don't agree with that at all.
BMW only lists one size brake disc for the Z4M which is the 345 x 28mm.

There is a 325mm disc available but that's for the normal M3 not the CSL and as the calipers and carriers are different, wouldn't fit the smaller disc properly?

Could you ask for them to measure the diameter or give the PN off the discs?

Do you have the VIN or numberplate?

Smells like BS. Who would put 325mm discs on the Z4MC?! And yes you'd likely need to change others parts it would make no economical sense!