[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by feuer

Yes, there is a difference from e-diff to mechanical lsd, just as there are differences from one mechanical lsd to another mechanical lsd. The system is ok and with coding to your liking can function pretty good having in mind that 99.9% of drivers of these cars aren’t professional car drifters. I have been tracking these for a while. I have currently two, one with lsd and the other with open diff. I can put pretty much same time around the track with either, and most interestingly with DCS off or on regardless. I know the track, a know the cars and have reach my capacity as a driver. With different drivers times will be different too. This is why I said driver skill is important even in putting power down. You will be no no but as you read Andyrt200 is just getting familiar with what the DCS button does. With little practice I’m certain that won’t have problem shaking off 320i. Hell I certain that I can shake off 320i even if I remove the turbos and one front wheel. Just kidding there about the wheel….

You still seem to be confused, If I recall correctly Op wasn't going wot or talking about putting the power round the corners, bends.

Wheel spinning off in a straight line with summer tires in winter is easily done with DSC off, it doesn't happen because of lack of driver skill, with DSC on it just cuts power. Of course you can slowly roll into power but that's not the same as being able to do so in summer with correct tyres. If the Op can't stay away from a 320i on the move when traction shouldn't be a issue, then it's probably lack of driver skill.

[studio54]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

That's not how it works on my 07' 335i.

When you first start the car it's in DSC (Dynamic Stability Control) mode....it will kill power to the motor just about any time it feels a loss of traction, a weird wiggle, or someone farts in the seat

When you push the DTC (Dynamic Traction Control) once....it lets the tires spin just a little, and it will let the rear of the car walk around a little, but it will still kill power to the motor if you are really trying to get on the gas hard....even in a straight line.

If you hold down the DTC button for 3 seconds....it turns everything off...which I rarely do because it will try to get away from you in a hurry.

With everything turned off....my car will leave two equal length black marks on the pavement, so I'm assuming the "e-lsd" or "e-diff" (the brakes are used to put resistance on the tire with less traction, equalizing the traction to both rear tires)....is working like it's supposed to.

Honestly, I'm glad these cars have a decent traction control system....these cars are dangerous if you aren't used to driving a big HP/TQ car with a stiff suspension setup (especially when modded).

Works exactly the same on mine aswell.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

You still seem to be confused, If I recall correctly Op wasn't going wot or talking about putting the power round the corners, bends.

Wheel spinning off in a straight line with summer tires in winter is easily done with DSC off, it doesn't happen because of lack of driver skill, with DSC on it just cuts power. Of course you can slowly roll into power but that's not the same as being able to do so in summer with correct tyres. If the Op can't stay away from a 320i on the move when traction shouldn't be a issue, then it's probably lack of driver skill.

I’m not confused at all.

[iqraceworks]

So after 4 pages of posts.....we've all figured out that summer tires in cold temps on cold damp pavement sucks......👍

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

So after 4 pages of posts.....we've all figured out that summer tires in cold temps on cold damp pavement sucks......👍

Everyone except Feuer

[CarAbuser]

I think it depends on the tyres. Michelin PS4S work really well in UK winters, probably more so than actual winter tyres.

I've tried other tyres like Goodyear Eagle Asymmetric 5 and even the standard Michelin PS4 and they were ol but lacked the grip os the PS4S in greasy UK winters.

[ab987]

Originally Posted by CarAbuser

I think it depends on the tyres. Michelin PS4S work really well in UK winters, probably more so than actual winter tyres.

I've tried other tyres like Goodyear Eagle Asymmetric 5 and even the standard Michelin PS4 and they were ol but lacked the grip os the PS4S in greasy UK winters.

Second this, my PS4Ss are great in the winter, I try not to drive below 40F much to avoid cracking but even at 40F I have never had traction issues. Definitely better than my AS3+s.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

Everyone except Feuer

I’m university professor level and your are toddler in day care on the subject.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by feuer

I’m university professor level and your are toddler in day care on the subject.

[Andyrt200]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

You still seem to be confused, If I recall correctly Op wasn't going wot or talking about putting the power round the corners, bends.

Wheel spinning off in a straight line with summer tires in winter is easily done with DSC off, it doesn't happen because of lack of driver skill, with DSC on it just cuts power. Of course you can slowly roll into power but that's not the same as being able to do so in summer with correct tyres. If the Op can't stay away from a 320i on the move when traction shouldn't be a issue, then it's probably lack of driver skill.

No I wasn’t originally talking about WOT or cornering, though it got on to that more later.

I was originally complaining I felt the traction control was cutting in too early killing the power so much the 320i was just stuck to my bumper.

I knew I could totally turn off the traction control & I do have many years of experience of driving high power RWD cars with no ABS never mind traction control on summers on cold roads, it used to be my favourite time of year! I felt quite sure I could have gone that bit faster with a good controled amount of wheel spin. The trouble is you can’t exactly stick your head out of the window & ask the guy behind you to wait at least 3 seconds while I hold the button down!

I’m happy now I’ve found the quick single press seems to let me have just enough wheel spin, for public roads at least.

As nice my track car is it takes permanent 100% concentration to try to drive anywhere near briskly on damp roads in the summer never mind the winter. I’ve been full opposite lock just changing lanes on the motorway in the winter, lots of other owners have ended up crashing off up the side embankments not catching them in time.

The BMs with traction control on are much better really for day to day driving if your mind is on other things…

PS4s do sound good though

[ab987]

Originally Posted by Andyrt200

No I wasn’t originally talking about WOT or cornering, though it got on to that more later.

I was originally complaining I felt the traction control was cutting in too early killing the power so much the 320i was just stuck to my bumper.

I knew I could totally turn off the traction control & I do have many years of experience of driving high power RWD cars with no ABS never mind traction control on summers on cold roads, it used to be my favourite time of year! I felt quite sure I could have gone that bit faster with a good controled amount of wheel spin. The trouble is you can’t exactly stick your head out of the window & ask the guy behind you to wait at least 3 seconds while I hold the button down!

I’m happy now I’ve found the quick single press seems to let me have just enough wheel spin, for public roads at least.

As nice my track car is it takes permanent 100% concentration to try to drive anywhere near briskly on damp roads in the summer never mind the winter. I’ve been full opposite lock just changing lanes on the motorway in the winter, lots of other owners have ended up crashing off up the side embankments not catching them in time.

The BMs with traction control on are much better really for day to day driving if your mind is on other things…

PS4s do sound good though

It is a bit overly aggressive on our cars, the N52's is really quite good. They seem to have gotten it right on the G20, can't speak for the F30 but if the F80 is anything to go off of...

On NA cars it's quite easy, just retard timing until slip stops, maybe close the throttle a tiny bit if it gets bad. On turbo cars not only are EGTs much higher (things could melt if timing was retarded for extended periods of time unless you dump loads of fuel, then efficiency is out the window) but throttle closure also doesn't do much because of the huge pressure. Not fast enough for TC, so they do a combination of everything. Close throttle, open wastegates and in some cases even BOVs, and retard timing. Suddenly you have a lower output N52 with its throttle partially closed. I've heard some meaty bangs when it cuts in on 20psi.

Anyways I know you didn't ask, but that's why it's so invasive on our cars and why it's impressive that they've managed to get it right on newer cars.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by Andyrt200

No I wasn’t originally talking about WOT or cornering, though it got on to that more later.

I was originally complaining I felt the traction control was cutting in too early killing the power so much the 320i was just stuck to my bumper.

I knew I could totally turn off the traction control & I do have many years of experience of driving high power RWD cars with no ABS never mind traction control on summers on cold roads, it used to be my favourite time of year! I felt quite sure I could have gone that bit faster with a good controled amount of wheel spin. The trouble is you can’t exactly stick your head out of the window & ask the guy behind you to wait at least 3 seconds while I hold the button down!

I’m happy now I’ve found the quick single press seems to let me have just enough wheel spin, for public roads at least.

As nice my track car is it takes permanent 100% concentration to try to drive anywhere near briskly on damp roads in the summer never mind the winter. I’ve been full opposite lock just changing lanes on the motorway in the winter, lots of other owners have ended up crashing off up the side embankments not catching them in time.

The BMs with traction control on are much better really for day to day driving if your mind is on other things…

PS4s do sound good though

The above in bold was what I was referring to, but Freur just kept having multiple brain malfunctions claiming it was due to driver skill that you couldn't get away from the 320i. Face-palm.

I did a log once in 2-3 degrees C ambient temp with summer tyres, DSC fully off, full WOT, snapped violently sideways in a dual carriageway, fortunately no one was around and I managed to regain control.

With DSC/DTC fully off, you have to be on the ball if your going WOT, can be very dangerous otherwise.

I agree DTC is a good halfway point, and DSC should be on for normal driving, unless your Freur who is some "next level expert" driver

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

The above in bold was what I was referring to, but Freur just kept having multiple brain malfunctions claiming it was due to driver skill that you couldn't get away from the 320i. Face-palm.

I did a log once in 2-3 degrees C ambient temp with summer tyres, DSC fully off, full WOT, snapped violently sideways in a dual carriageway, fortunately no one was around and I managed to regain control.

With DSC/DTC fully off, you have to be on the ball if your going WOT, can be very dangerous otherwise.

I agree DTC is a good halfway point, and DSC should be on for normal driving, unless your Freur who is some "next level expert" driver

What you write is so immature. Just proves the infant you are! Not only that you didn’t understand what the original question was, you fail to understand my responses too. Go ahead, turn all of my responses in bold. Then re read them at least few times. Repetition helps slow people learn. Knowing what DTC does or doesn’t, how and when to use it, how to code it, is all considered driver skill. DTC is set off by default via JB4 on mine upon start up.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by feuer

What you write is so immature. Just proves the infant you are! Not only that you didn’t understand what the original question was, you fail to understand my responses too. Go ahead, turn all of my responses in bold. Then re read them at least few times. Repetition helps slow people learn. Knowing what DTC does or doesn’t, how and when to use it, how to code it, is all considered driver skill. DTC is set off by default via JB4 on mine upon start up.

Looks like you had another brain malfunction,

I already knew DSC and DTC does before you posted your link about coding it. What I didn't know is about coding the module which can be done through Protool easily after having a look through the coding options, not worth it for street driving.

Having DTC or DSC off by default must mean your an expert driver lol?

I drove around with it off several times and that is not proof of a good driver. Controlled slides, keeping the car in a straight line whilst putting the power down with DSC/DTC both off, regaining control when you loose traction, reaction time etc, are part of driver skill. I get it English is probably not your first language, that would explain your incapacity to understand and assumptions about other.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

Looks like you had another brain malfunction,

I already knew DSC and DTC does before you posted your link about coding it. What I didn't know is about coding the module which can be done through Protool easily after having a look through the coding options, not worth it for street driving.

Having DTC or DSC off by default must mean your an expert driver lol?

I drove around with it off several times and that is not proof of a good driver. Controlled slides, keeping the car in a straight line whilst putting the power down with DSC/DTC both off, regaining control when you loose traction, reaction time etc, are part of driver skill. I get it English is probably not your first language, that would explain your incapacity to understand and assumptions about other.

If you have such good comprehension of the English language how you missed the part that OP didn’t know how dtc works? You drove around few time with off? Didn’t wreck the car? Impressive! You are an amazing driver. Pro level.

[rismo]

Originally Posted by feuer

I’m university professor level and your are toddler in day care on the subject.

10 points for your patience.

Going full Salomon on this; I'm sure the wrong tyres for the situation does not help, but driving a 335i vs 320i and not beating crap out of the 320 even on straight ice (joking/overdoing) is with the driver for now.
Even a factory 335 will slaughter that 320.. summer/winter/rain..

So I believe that is the point of our Mr Feuer, whom shares much more info and hints then picked up by his audience ... the sad story of a professor :-D

[Andyrt200]

Originally Posted by ab987

It is a bit overly aggressive on our cars, the N52's is really quite good. They seem to have gotten it right on the G20, can't speak for the F30 but if the F80 is anything to go off of...

On NA cars it's quite easy, just retard timing until slip stops, maybe close the throttle a tiny bit if it gets bad. On turbo cars not only are EGTs much higher (things could melt if timing was retarded for extended periods of time unless you dump loads of fuel, then efficiency is out the window) but throttle closure also doesn't do much because of the huge pressure. Not fast enough for TC, so they do a combination of everything. Close throttle, open wastegates and in some cases even BOVs, and retard timing. Suddenly you have a lower output N52 with its throttle partially closed. I've heard some meaty bangs when it cuts in on 20psi.

Anyways I know you didn't ask, but that's why it's so invasive on our cars and why it's impressive that they've managed to get it right on newer cars.

I didn’t ask directly but that’s very interesting non the less! As I mentioned at the start we had a new at the time 2002 Golf (Rabbit I think in the US) GTD, being FWD it lost traction very easily in the wet but the way it cut was far worse than the stage 2 N54, virtually stopping the car half way out of a junction leaving you with no power at all, being at turbo diesel I suppose there was even less for the ECU to play with, certainly no spark timing, I don’t think they have throttles either.

Much later we had a 2012 F13 640d the way that cut in the TC (stock tune) was almost perfect.

I don’t know how good the TC is on the G31 540i because with xDrive it hasn’t ever cut in with the stock 340bhp (mind you Stage 1 on a stock engine is 420bhp on those once the warranty runs out ).



You can certainly say it’s my fault for not understanding what the single press did, I do feel rather embarrassed about that!

[feuer]

Here is a guide: http://petrolov.com/335i-e-diff-dele...ws-fun-ruiners