[EricJ17]

Hello!

I just signed up for my first HPDE in October. I have an 07 328i sport package. The car has General G-Max RS tires and Bilstein B8 struts/shocks with stock sport springs. Brake fluid and pads are fresh, but factory. I have stock power and I'm not going to be crushing this thing into corners but I know beginners have a tendency to ride the brakes. Will I be ok with stock pads, and if not, does anybody know which of the pads from FCP Euro should be suitable? I'm not really interested in getting pads from anywhere else for obvious reasons!

https://www.fcpeuro.com/BMW-parts/32...6&b=5&d=700&v=

[Volasko]

If it is your first time I wouldn't change. You'll be worrying too much about learning the ropes about braking -> turn-in-> apex points to worry about how much braking you have. Stock pads worked well for my first 5 times before I gained the confidence to actually push my car. I would invest in a cheap infa-red temp gun and track your your rotor temps when you come off. If they start reaching levels above 500 deg F I would look into upgrading, but beware that you'll be compromising how they perform on the street, especially in the winter. The only track spec pads from that link are:

Ferodo DS2500 (never tried them, but heard meh reviews of them)
Hawk HT-10 (I don't like these, too specific a temp range for good performance)
Hawk HPS (Might be a bit of stretch to call these a track pad, but would be a decent upgrade to stock wrt upper temp limits).

To put it into perspective the most I've ever seen on my 335i stock pads on a track was 1000 deg F on the fronts (around 750 deg F on the rears), that was on a tight brake heavy track after 15 laps of hard driving. I had the correct pads on it for the temps (Hawk DTC-60's) so the temp was not an issue. Before the DTC-60's I had on HP+ (enhanced) which I reached the upper limits pretty quickly after +30 HPDE under my belt. TLDR - You're fine with stock, but beware of temps and adjust as necessary.

[Brian86]

X2, Don't worry about it on your first trip to the track.

I'm a Carbotech guy, but I'll probably get out voted here in favor of brands with a more prominent internet presence.

[EricJ17]

Thanks guys! That's what I thought. I think no matter what I will want to improve the pads eventually. Hopefully by then FCP Euro's selection is as good for this car as it is for the older 3 series.

[edycol]

Make sure you delete as many nannies as possible. E.diff function is very useful but eats rear pads. Find thread to delete DSC function. Make sure your rear pads are having a lot of beef, at least 50%!

[Volasko]

To further add to this thread, if you're looking to take tracking more seriously and are looking for an upgrade, the first thing I would do is find a cheap pair of 335i rotors + calipers. They bolt right on and if you check the used ads should be able to pick them up for cheap. The best part; aside from the improved size for more thermal load and brake torque; is the pad availability. The calipers are the same as what are used in the M3 so there are tons of options. I believe your rear sport calipers are the same size (at least it was the case for my 330i, I would check real OEM) as the M3/335i so no need to change them.

I've tried a few pads, but find the Hawk DTC-60 the best value track pad available. Mind you I'm limited in Canada to exchange rates and import duties, but a lot of the performance pads people recommend (PFC-08, Pagid RSL-29) end up being more than $1k just for F/R pads alone. The hawks are half this and so far have been up to the duty. You might want to start with the DTC-30's and adjust as necessary once your ability starts to improve. High temp fluid is also a must, especially once start building up real heat into your system.

[edycol]

Originally Posted by Volasko

To further add to this thread, if you're looking to take tracking more seriously and are looking for an upgrade, the first thing I would do is find a cheap pair of 335i rotors + calipers. They bolt right on and if you check the used ads should be able to pick them up for cheap. The best part; aside from the improved size for more thermal load and brake torque; is the pad availability. The calipers are the same as what are used in the M3 so there are tons of options. I believe your rear sport calipers are the same size (at least it was the case for my 330i, I would check real OEM) as the M3/335i so no need to change them.

I've tried a few pads, but find the Hawk DTC-60 the best value track pad available. Mind you I'm limited in Canada to exchange rates and import duties, but a lot of the performance pads people recommend (PFC-08, Pagid RSL-29) end up being more than $1k just for F/R pads alone. The hawks are half this and so far have been up to the duty. You might want to start with the DTC-30's and adjust as necessary once your ability starts to improve. High temp fluid is also a must, especially once start building up real heat into your system.

Rear rotors on 328 are smaller than 335 or 330. On both it is 336X22mm while on 328 it is 300X20mm. Pad size is serious problem on 328 in the rear. DSC functions, specifically e.diff. puts too much strain. 328 had performance brake option that was Brembo brakes like ones on 135.
Swapping brakes from 335, front and rear, is absolutely right step forward. And coding. He has to code DSC to performance brakes to adjust EBD.

[Miska]

I'm another one that recommends the 335 brake upgrade. Get a good set of used calipers on eBay or get a remanufactured set on Rockauto or similar. Then for rotors, I recommend Centric blanks or whatever Rockauto has cheapest besides Durago... Amazon also has good deals on some inexpensive Raybestos rotors sometimes.

As far as pads, you could most likely get away with running your stock pads on your first HPDE, as long as you keep it pretty slow out there. I think the upgrade to the larger 335 rotor will help reduce heat too.

Then when you want to step up your game in the future, all you'll have to do is order a good set of pads (Hawk, EBC, Ferodo...).

For DSC coding, I never coded for my 335 brake upgrade on my 330, but I do the 3 second press on my traction button when at the track to turn that off regardless.

[edycol]

Originally Posted by Miska

I'm another one that recommends the 335 brake upgrade. Get a good set of used calipers on eBay or get a remanufactured set on Rockauto or similar. Then for rotors, I recommend Centric blanks or whatever Rockauto has cheapest besides Durago... Amazon also has good deals on some inexpensive Raybestos rotors sometimes.

As far as pads, you could most likely get away with running your stock pads on your first HPDE, as long as you keep it pretty slow out there. I think the upgrade to the larger 335 rotor will help reduce heat too.

Then when you want to step up your game in the future, all you'll have to do is order a good set of pads (Hawk, EBC, Ferodo...).

For DSC coding, I never coded for my 335 brake upgrade on my 330, but I do the 3 second press on my traction button when at the track to turn that off regardless.

330 already has different EBD set up as rear brakes are same as 335.
Generally, on 330 it is not big issue as on 328 as rear brakes are bigger. Rear are the real issue.
Here is comparison of pads.
Top pad is rear Brembo from 135 and 328/330 performance package.
Middle 335.
Bottom 328:

[Volasko]

Originally Posted by Brian86

X2, Don't worry about it on your first trip to the track.

I'm a Carbotech guy, but I'll probably get out voted here in favor of brands with a more prominent internet presence.

What Carbotech pad compound do you like? The upper limit for Hawk performance pads for the rear are the HP+ (at least for my car), which are OK but I'd like some more balance with respect to friction levels. Especially considering I run DTC-60's on the front, which I really like TBH.

[Brian86]

Read the website. You're basically buying by temperature range, and as the temp range goes up the coefficient of friction gets a little higher. A neat feature for mixing and matching if the car doesn't have ABS or bias adjust for different circuits or weather.

Best pads out there for brake release.

They are not inexpensive. About $250-$300/axle these days.

I'm at XP10/XP8 - Front/Rear on the e36 M3. Stock S52, rotors, and calipers. I drive it hard.

I get about 8h out of a set of fronts, 16h out of the rears. +/- a few hours depending on which circuits I'm visiting.

There is effectively zero rotor wear. The rotors will TMF crack out long before they wear. Soft on rotors also means benign dust. It just washes right off. Zero iron fallout.

I replace my front rotors after two or three sets of pads, just eyeballing the TMF cracks for my level of comfort.

IIRC the XP8 is about 1050F or 1100F. XP10 about 1350F? Next ones up are the XP12 and XP14.

When you do break past the temperature range on the pads they are very forgiving on fade. Much smaller friction reduction than other pads under temp fade. If you're over heating the compound there is a minor loss in friction and they tend to thump up the rotor.

Carbotechs are not compatible with any other pad manufacturer You need dedicated rotors for the carbotech pads.

The XP10/8 are oK for a little street driving. A quick trip to the grocery store between track days is oK, They will thump up if you're using them on the street extensively. I pop on a set of 1521 street pads if I'm not going to be at the track much.

[72GMC]

Stoptech 309 (Sport) has been working well for me.
After 8 track days they are down to 4mm.
They also functioned well over the winter.

EBC Blue Stuff NDX will be going on next.
Same category (Sport)

[EricJ17]

Originally Posted by edycol

Rear rotors on 328 are smaller than 335 or 330. On both it is 336X22mm while on 328 it is 300X20mm. Pad size is serious problem on 328 in the rear. DSC functions, specifically e.diff. puts too much strain. 328 had performance brake option that was Brembo brakes like ones on 135.
Swapping brakes from 335, front and rear, is absolutely right step forward. And coding. He has to code DSC to performance brakes to adjust EBD.

I just did this track day on Saturday! The brakes held up well but the pedal started pulsating and the steering wheel was vibrating badly towards the end of my last session. I think the rears were ok and I have the e diff coded out. Is everyone doing the 335 upgrade modifying their parking brake shoes in the rear? I’d rather not do that for a car that’s seeing track use but I also want to make sure the car is “right.” Don’t want more braking force up front than in the rear.

[72GMC]

Good job getting out there!

"Toward the end of the last session"
...There's a good chance it was the tires getting hot and greasy, triggering the ABS.

First time out?
I'd bet you were working the tires a lot less earlier in the day, and finding a big chunk of pace later in the day.

[Volasko]

Originally Posted by Volasko

What Carbotech pad compound do you like? The upper limit for Hawk performance pads for the rear are the HP+ (at least for my car), which are OK but I'd like some more balance with respect to friction levels. Especially considering I run DTC-60's on the front, which I really like TBH.

Just following this up as I ended up getting a new set of HP+ for the rear pads (only Hawk track pad option available) and I found them to nicely pair with the DTC-60's in terms of brake balance. I believe the new compound has similar friction levels at the operating temps I typically see on a track to the DTC-60's.