[acarpenter86]

I’m trying to get an issue sorted where my driver’s window only goes up an inch with each button pull. It will go all the way with 10-15 uses of the button.

So far, I tried all the reset/relearn procedures I could find.
I took apart the door, took the regulator and motor out, and with just the motor connected with no regulator, the short burst still occurs. I opened up the motor unit looking for a hall sensor or something and cleaning anything I could. Nothing.
Next, I used my DMM at the motor plug from the car, and watched the voltage as I press the button. Seems to jump to around 8V for a second. I can hear a “click” happening where the FRM is. Is there some kind of window relay that can be replaced?
Next I will test the motor with steady voltage.

Maybe the intermittent voltage is due to the car expecting feedback from a hall sensor that I’m not providing with my DMM?
Or maybe the window switch itself is bad?

[BlackNight28]

mine was doing this (or similar) and I got it to the top position, did two (2) clicks up with the switch and now its fine. Just sayin'

[acarpenter86]

Originally Posted by BlackNight28

mine was doing this (or similar) and I got it to the top position, did two (2) clicks up with the switch and now its fine. Just sayin'

I’ll give it a shot tomorrow.

I disassembled the motor and cleaned the hall sensor magnet and sensors (since I already have the regulator and motor out anyway).
I also disassembled the switch, but there isn’t anything serviceable in there.
I tested the motor with 12V (only two contacts, no sensors) and it goes like a champ.

I bet this is going to be either software, MAYBE a failed switch, or possibly an FRM module. Too tired to think about it anymore today, but I’ll play around some more tomorrow including your technique. I’ll be mad if it works.

[gbalthrop]

Originally Posted by acarpenter86

... my driver’s window only goes up an inch with each button pull... Next, I used my DMM at the
motor plug from the car, and watched the voltage as I press the button. Seems to jump to around 8V for a second. I can
hear a “click” happening where the FRM is. Is there some kind of window relay that can be replaced?... Maybe the
intermittent voltage is due to the car expecting feedback from a hall sensor that I’m not providing with my DMM?...

If the Window only moves an inch or two with each button push/pull, that window needs to be "Initialized". It is also
possible that you have a bad Hall sensor in that motor, but that is unlikely, particularly if the FRM Module has had a power
interruption. You need to perform TWO Steps:
1) Delete Previous Initialization;
2) Perform Initialization Procedure.
You do NOT need a Scan Tool or INPA/ISTA to do that.

Follow the Procedure in the TWO attached ScreenPrints, from Bentley Manual, 512-19 & 512-20.
There is NO Window Relay (external to the FRM). The FRM functions as a relay, and is sending power in 1-second
bursts due to Window NOT Initialized, OR faulty Hall Sensor. BTW, do you have any CC-ID Code? Number?
George

[BlackNight28]

yeah, what he said

[acarpenter86]

Originally Posted by gbalthrop

If the Window only moves an inch or two with each button push/pull, that window needs to be "Initialized". It is also
possible that you have a bad Hall sensor in that motor, but that is unlikely, particularly if the FRM Module has had a power
interruption. You need to perform TWO Steps:
1) Delete Previous Initialization;
2) Perform Initialization Procedure.
You do NOT need a Scan Tool or INPA/ISTA to do that.

Follow the Procedure in the TWO attached ScreenPrints, from Bentley Manual, 512-19 & 512-20.
There is NO Window Relay (external to the FRM). The FRM functions as a relay, and is sending power in 1-second
bursts due to Window NOT Initialized, OR faulty Hall Sensor. BTW, do you have any CC-ID Code? Number?
George

Thank you for your reply, George.
I tried this technique, though after I delete the initialization, nothing seems to change. I still have to use the button 12 times to get it to the top. I’ll fool around with it some more.

Today I went to pick a part and got another motor from another 2011. Same deal. And I doubt the hall sensors is bad in two. Unless I just have really bad luck. Hopefully I don’t have a broken wire.

I do have error code 9cc7 and the image of a window with exclamation mark.
Inpa gives me this screenshot below:

[acarpenter86]

I actually got a newer version of INPA (in English!) to work to command the FRM to initialize windows… only thing is the driver front doesn’t move when commanded to do the process to the front. The passenger window does fine as do the rears.

[gbalthrop]

Originally Posted by acarpenter86

I actually got a newer version of INPA (in English!) to work to command the FRM to initialize windows… only thing
is the driver front doesn’t move when commanded to do the process to the front. The passenger window does fine as do the rears.

Your INPA ScreenPrint indicates:
9CCF: Hallsensor Fahrertuer defekt = Hall sensor driver's door defective
Battery Voltage = 12.07V
Sensor Voltage = 0.00V (suggests open circuit in one of 3 Brown/x wires
Fehler Momentan Vorhanden = Fault is currently Present
Fault would NOT (kein) cause warning lamp to light.

Attached are ISTA ScreenPrints of Window Outputs wiring. NOTE the 3 Brown/x wires in first ScreenPrint. Those are the Hall Sensor
wires, and if they do NOT convey the Hall Sensor signal to the FRM due to an open circuit, the FRM acts as though sensor faulty.
At least that's my interpretation of the wiring diagram and Lines ID.

Also attached are ScreenPrints of Connector Location & Connector view, at Motor, at Door Hinge, and at FRM, needed to test wiring.
If any questions, just ask. INPA/ISTA gets you in the ballpark, but it usually takes creative testing with Multimeter to correctly
identify a wiring/connector fault and prevent Throwing Part$. My impression from wiring diagram & Lines ID is that there are
TWO Hall Sensors in the Motor, providing two signals: INK1 & INK2, using a common ground, INKM. So I would test all three
wires, Brown/Orange, Brown/Violet, & Brown/Red for continuity. Test Brown/Orange wire (INKM) for continuity to Chassis
Ground, and two Sensor Signals for periodic voltage. That's just my initial interpretation of the wiring diagram with NO experience.

I assume BOTH motors work similarly, an inch at a time with door button, and runs to full stop if power applied to two motor wires,
X749/5 & X749/6, Blue/Gray & Black/Green wires, reversing polarity to reverse direction?

Since you are an ace at removing Door Panels by now, you could always Back-probe connector or stick pins in same wires on
Passenger door to see how systems works (voltages) when functioning correctly. Beifahrer (BF)= Passenger Wiring attached.
Hope you are able to each us something.
George

[acarpenter86]

Originally Posted by gbalthrop

Your INPA ScreenPrint indicates:
9CCF: Hallsensor Fahrertuer defekt = Hall sensor driver's door defective
Battery Voltage = 12.07V
Sensor Voltage = 0.00V (suggests open circuit in one of 3 Brown/x wires
Fehler Momentan Vorhanden = Fault is currently Present
Fault would NOT (kein) cause warning lamp to light.

Attached are ISTA ScreenPrints of Window Outputs wiring. NOTE the 3 Brown/x wires in first ScreenPrint. Those are the Hall Sensor
wires, and if they do NOT convey the Hall Sensor signal to the FRM due to an open circuit, the FRM acts as though sensor faulty.
At least that's my interpretation of the wiring diagram and Lines ID.

Also attached are ScreenPrints of Connector Location & Connector view, at Motor, at Door Hinge, and at FRM, needed to test wiring.
If any questions, just ask. INPA/ISTA gets you in the ballpark, but it usually takes creative testing with Multimeter to correctly
identify a wiring/connector fault and prevent Throwing Part$. My impression from wiring diagram & Lines ID is that there are
TWO Hall Sensors in the Motor, providing two signals: INK1 & INK2, using a common ground, INKM. So I would test all three
wires, Brown/Orange, Brown/Violet, & Brown/Red for continuity. Test Brown/Orange wire (INKM) for continuity to Chassis
Ground, and two Sensor Signals for periodic voltage. That's just my initial interpretation of the wiring diagram with NO experience.

I assume BOTH motors work similarly, an inch at a time with door button, and runs to full stop if power applied to two motor wires,
X749/5 & X749/6, Blue/Gray & Black/Green wires, reversing polarity to reverse direction?

Since you are an ace at removing Door Panels by now, you could always Back-probe connector or stick pins in same wires on
Passenger door to see how systems works (voltages) when functioning correctly. Beifahrer (BF)= Passenger Wiring attached.
Hope you are able to each us something.
George

Thanks a bunch for taking the time to post those ISTA shots. I did not realize you could find wiring diagrams in there! I need to play with that program more. I get lost in it sometimes.

And your hunch is exactly right on the two Hall sensors. When I had the motor apart, you could clearly see them and the magnet. So the wiring makes sense. The two power wires are thicker gauge, so they are easy to identify as well.

Correct on the motor. I actually tested it removed from the car and applied 12V, it runs as long as I want it to. So the FRM is not allowing it to 'go'. The 'new' motor behaves the same way.

I will see what I can find and report back. It seems the most straightforward way to test my wires is at the motor connector and the FRM connector.

[acarpenter86]

Well… I have continuity from motor plug to FRM.
I guess I’ll button up FRM and test for a hall sensor voltage from the motor plug with the battery reconnected.

Would the FRM shut the circuit off after a certain count as it does the bulbs?

[gbalthrop]

Originally Posted by acarpenter86

... I did not realize you could find wiring diagrams in there! I need to play with that program more. I get lost in it sometimes...

Yes, the ONLY way I know of to understand how to access the desired content in ISTA is to "Practice" using it.
That is what I'm doing under the guise of "Helping others". It's just a cover for increasing my own ISTA knowledge with "Practice".

I've been meaning to produce a PDF that demonstrates HOW to search documents using ISTA. Some Day. Soon perhaps?
There are 19 different TYPES of Documents in ISTA, and SSP wiring diagrams are only ONE of those types. See attached ScreenPrint.
That shows 18 of 19 possible Document Types selected (Default Filter). You can Change selection. Click Filter Button at screen Bottom.
Also attached are ScreenPrints of Bentley pages explaining Conventions & Symbols used in SSP wiring diagrams.

The SSP Wiring Diagrams are "Interactive", meaning you can click on any BLUE component ID Code, and get MORE information on
that component. As Example, clicking on the "X749" Connector Code opens the box shown that has (1) a Tab for Installation
Location (EBO Document Type), and also (2) a Tab for Connector View (STA Document Type).

Get Started in this case by opening ISTA (NO connection to vehicle required). When Program Loads (~ 30 seconds ):
1) Click "Operations" button at Top-Left of Screen;
2) Enter Last-7 Characters of your VIN in "Input VIN" box;
2a) If you were searching info on different vehicle with unknown VIN, you would click Basic Features Tab and select vehicle features;
3) When Vehicle Details loads, click Vehicle Managment Menu Button, Troubleshooting Submenu button, and Text Search Tab.
4) In "Search String" box, enter "window outputs"; I get ONE Hit (Power window outputs) on my vehicle;
5) Click/Double-click on that line on the "Hit List", and Power window outputs SSP appears.
6) You can now Zoom in, Zoom out, click Overview for info on Components, Lines, Connector, Fuses. You can drag enlarged
screen Up/Down/Left/Right to see exactly what you want.
7) Click on a component ID Code, such as "M21" to see Name/Identification of Component along with Installation Location,
and also Connector View Tab if "X" Connector.

8) NOTE: the "Document History" Symbol/Icon between the two arrows to Right of "Home" Icon (Close Operation).
Until you close the operation, that Document History contains a link to each document you have viewed, and you can
Navigate between Multiple Documents in the History by clicking the Left/Right arrow buttons.
9) Click the "Home" Icon and click OK to Close Operation, to either exit the program, or enter a different vehicle.
10) You can also Close Operation by clicking X button at right of "Symbol Bar" or ToolBar, Top-Right of Screen.
11) You can view ISTA User Manual/ Help PDF by clicking "?" Symbol on Top-Left of Screen.
12) You can Minimize ISTA (run in background) by clicking "DownArrow" between Close (X) and ? Icons.
13) You can open at least 3 instances of ISTA at once. I have NOT experimented with MORE than 3, with different vehicle in each.
14) You can leave ISTA running in background (Minimized), even in multiple instances. It can affect navigation or Task Bar
(Hidden) sometimes, and simply clicking "Minimize" (Down Icon) in ISTA clears the issue, at least 'til Next Time.

There, I finished a few more pages of the "Upcoming PDF".
Hope to hear from you with suggestions of what to include in the "ISTA Document Tutorial".
George

[gbalthrop]

Originally Posted by acarpenter86

Well… I have continuity from motor plug to FRM. I guess I’ll button up FRM and test for a hall sensor voltage from the motor plug with the battery reconnected. Would the FRM shut the circuit off after a certain count as it does the bulbs?

Don't know the answer to your question, other than to say I don't recall anyone reporting that with regard to Window Outputs from FRM.

Did you test resistance (~ 0 Ohms) for all three wires between X749 at motor & X14261 at the FRM, and all three were basically SAME resistance?

Did you test each wire/socket for "short-to-ground" with both connectors disconnected (at FRM & Motor)? I would think that could result in 0.00V Sensor Voltage as reported by INPA, and you would still get "continuity" testing end-to-end.
George

[acarpenter86]

Originally Posted by gbalthrop

Don't know the answer to your question, other than to say I don't recall anyone reporting that with regard to Window Outputs from FRM.

Did you test resistance (~ 0 Ohms) for all three wires between X749 at motor & X14261 at the FRM, and all three were basically SAME resistance?

Did you test each wire/socket for "short-to-ground" with both connectors disconnected (at FRM & Motor)? I would think that could result in 0.00V Sensor Voltage as reported by INPA, and you would still get "continuity" testing end-to-end.
George

I had actually put it back together (forgot to test those two attributes) but of course several FRM errors… not sure what happened but I’m going to default code it and really hope that fixes it. Gotta love when you are troubleshooting and it breaks way worse than it was.
Anyway, I took it back apart to make sure I did everything properly and also did those tests you suggested.
All three wires had similar resistance (.5ohm) and neither seemed shorted to ground. Maybe the FRM is on its way out and that was the first sign. I really hope not :/

[acarpenter86]

Well, not sure if a plug wasn’t all the way in last time or something. I actually didn’t default code it, but I made absolutely sure the large FRM connectors were all the way seated and those errors went away. Thank goodness!

Still have the 9cc7 though. Lol.
I guess it’s possible that both of these motors’ Hall sensors are bad, but that seems very unlikely.

[acarpenter86]

Originally Posted by gbalthrop

Don't know the answer to your question, other than to say I don't recall anyone reporting that with regard to Window Outputs from FRM.

Did you test resistance (~ 0 Ohms) for all three wires between X749 at motor & X14261 at the FRM, and all three were basically SAME resistance?

Did you test each wire/socket for "short-to-ground" with both connectors disconnected (at FRM & Motor)? I would think that could result in 0.00V Sensor Voltage as reported by INPA, and you would still get "continuity" testing end-to-end.
George

I’m probably obsessed with this silly thing, but I can’t stop tinkering.

Bad news… I took apart the passenger door, plugged up the motor and it worked perfect. I also discovered that if you meter voltage to the hall sensors you get a stead 12ish V from each sensor and ground. Both work on the driver door AND passenger door.

So what gives… FRM? I doubt I’ll replace it just for this since I won’t keep this car long. Is there anything else I could try? Does the JBE come into play?

[Engine]

Just buy a new regulator with motor in amazon is like between 40 and 60

[sibanez]

Originally Posted by acarpenter86

I’m probably obsessed with this silly thing, but I can’t stop tinkering.

Bad news… I took apart the passenger door, plugged up the motor and it worked perfect. I also discovered that if you meter voltage to the hall sensors you get a stead 12ish V from each sensor and ground. Both work on the driver door AND passenger door.

So what gives… FRM? I doubt I’ll replace it just for this since I won’t keep this car long. Is there anything else I could try? Does the JBE come into play?

I realize it's almost been a year, but did you ever figure this out?

I'm seeing nearly the same thing on my 128i. Driver-side window doesn't move. The switch is lit up, all other functions work (passenger-side window, driver and passenger side-view mirrors, sunroof).

I checked for error codes, don't see any. Pulled the door panel and removed the motor, it works fine with 12V run to leads that the power wires run to (thicker cables).

I tested the harness where the power runs and am getting zero volts on both connections.

I plugged the motor into the passenger-side door and it worked fine (as expected).

Fuses look fine, too.

[acarpenter86]

Originally Posted by sibanez

I realize it's almost been a year, but did you ever figure this out?

I'm seeing nearly the same thing on my 128i. Driver-side window doesn't move. The switch is lit up, all other functions work (passenger-side window, driver and passenger side-view mirrors, sunroof).

I checked for error codes, don't see any. Pulled the door panel and removed the motor, it works fine with 12V run to leads that the power wires run to (thicker cables).

I tested the harness where the power runs and am getting zero volts on both connections.

I plugged the motor into the passenger-side door and it worked fine (as expected).

Fuses look fine, too.

I fixed it by selling the car…
Haha.
Unfortunately I never got mine fixed first. It must have been the FRM.