[cn555ic]

regardless of which tune comes out ahead, I have to say the piggys for the N54 have come a long way...With that said as long as it a fair and unbiased test the forum appreciates the effort that you are going to do...I have a feeling that JB3 is going to have more power than the V3, but thats my opinion....

[e90AW335i]

Originally Posted by lawdude

Do I see another smack-down in the making? Where do you keep the popcorn Kyle?

No, probably just another ignorant poster not understanding anything about the tune he is running.

Originally Posted by cn555ic

Originally Posted by cn555ic

regardless of which tune comes out ahead, I have to say the piggys for the N54 have come a long way...With that said as long as it a fair and unbiased test the forum appreciates the effort that you are going to do...I have a feeling that JB3 is going to have more power than the V3, but thats my opinion....

I agree piggys have come a long way. As far as unbiased testing and being fair there seems to be plenty of that on other threads as well, you just have to know how to read and understand what the OP was trying to explain to you.

Cant wait to see the boost level readings and results of this testing.

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by e90AW335i

Get your popcorn ready !!!


I agree piggys have come a long way. As far as unbiased testing and being fair there seems to be plenty of that on other threads as well, you just have to know how to read and understand what the OP was trying to explain to you.

Cant wait to see the boost level readings and results of this testing.

+1 on the results--I think this will be the first side by side comparo of a totally stock car with each tune. This is great for base knowledge.

[uberschnell]

There's a lot riding on this. Face, honor, reputation..

Of course I'm talking about cn55ic and e90aw335i

[cn555ic]

To be honest with you I hope Jb3 dynos show better output numbers than V3 because it will only prove that V3 is OVERPRICED!! To me its not big deal, but for OP's like Kyle its their life...sad....Your pretty pathetic and you know what I am done with this because I realize this is your life, without out it, you have nothing...Kyle you won!!!
You are the man!! Now please honor what you said a couple of days ago...Please ignore my post and move on and don't post any replys or quote me...Enough I surrender to you!! You are the acclaimed TUNE WHORE!

[cn555ic]

Repeat I think when Driver72 performs these dynos of the two tunes, IMO I think JB3 will show better numbers...So as the world can see I have no Fanboy opinions, but feel since I have V3 doesn't mean I think its the best and superior to others, unlike you Kyle...Thats the difference between you and I, you are by far the Fanboy of E90post....You should get a tattoo on little biceps, I see you have a nervous condition since in your JB3 install video shows that you bite your nails to the nail bed...You have a nervous condition and don't you realize biting nails can cause you to get sick!

[LYLE LUKAS]

Hey i think the V3 is inferior to the JB3 products because Vishnu is just here to make money and not support the community.........he is as cocky as anyone I have ever met and is in it JUST for the money......just cause you have different maps to run or because it has a switch, doesn't mean your product is better.........


But you don't see me arguing with people on the forum because of it........

[cn555ic]

back on topic guys sorry for the off topic discussion!!! my apologies!!!

[e90AW335i]

Sorry for off topic comments as well, cant wait for the results....

[Kbueno]

Originally Posted by LYLE LUKAS

Hey i think the V3 is inferior to the JB3 products because Vishnu is just here to make money and not support the community.........he is as cocky as anyone I have ever met and is in it JUST for the money......just cause you have different maps to run or because it has a switch, doesn't mean your product is better.........


But you don't see me arguing with people on the forum because of it........

Oh, and Terry isn't? Come on. Were you browsing the forums in late 06 and early 07? when Vishnu shared a wealth of knowledge about the N54.

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by e90AW335i

I remember doing some same day dyno testing with multiple tunes and you seemed fine with the results......

Dyno with the PROcede fully adapted so that there is no concern from that crowd (we wouldn't want that...), and then uninstall that and put the JB3 on. I am sure Terry will make sure it is fully adapted (as Shiv did with my car that day), and everything will be fine.

It is funny to me how people eat this shit up when they know it will favor one product but as soon as there is a possibility that it could favor another, they don't want it done. Weird.....

How true!
Initially when I test all tunes on the same day using the same car using the same dyno, Shiv was saying how great the testing was because it was of the conditions.

OP, I think that your testing idea is perfect.
I would recommend the same thing that I did, which was to install the second tune and run through the gears on the dyno like normally driving the car. Go to WOT creating Mx boost and then normal driving.
I would recommend doing this aproximately 3-4 times before doing a dyno run.

[G37KILR]

Shiv is in a state of desperation right now he knows the JB3 is making more power, more reliable, better customer service, more maps in the future for cheap. This is all true and it costs half the price of his V3 the pinout version even less. I dong know why anyone would pay extra andhave to deal with their 2nd place product and his piss poor customer service and support.

[cn555ic]

Originally Posted by G37KILR

Shiv is in a state of desperation right now he knows the JB3 is making more power, more reliable, better customer service, more maps in the future for cheap. This is all true and it costs half the price of his V3 the pinout version even less. I dong know why anyone would pay extra andhave to deal with their 2nd place product and his piss poor customer service and support.

I don't think that may be the case as far as desperation, but the price of JB3 alone will make it much more attractive package to buy from the consumers...Either which way, I am sure both companies are not starving for money! So many impulse buyers like myself to make both Vishnu and BMS profitable in the long run!

[stressdoc]

In science we often use repeated measures. In this case, test both tunes one day, then test them again another day, switching the order. And then do the same with a different car. It could still be the case that one or the other tune takes longer to develop optimal "adaptation" and that could only be assessed by testing the tunes after running them for several days, the problem being that you could not control for "day of testing" effects. In that case again all you can do is repeat the tests enough times to get sufficient data to control for the effect of testing on different days.

For me, dyno tests are not very important. Power curves, control, reliability, and effects on engine are much more significant than 10 whp here or there. But don't let me piss on your parade, obviously we are all interested. Good luck and have fun!

[G37KILR]

Where is Driver72 in all of this? LOL he hasn't responded to anything yet

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

In science we often use repeated measures. In this case, test both tunes one day, then test them again another day, switching the order. And then do the same with a different car. It could still be the case that one or the other tune takes longer to develop optimal "adaptation" and that could only be assessed by testing the tunes after running them for several days, the problem being that you could not control for "day of testing" effects. In that case again all you can do is repeat the tests enough times to get sufficient data to control for the effect of testing on different days.

For me, dyno tests are not very important. Power curves, control, reliability, and effects on engine are much more significant than 10 whp here or there. But don't let me piss on your parade, obviously we are all interested. Good luck and have fun!

I agree with this, but unfortunately with independent testing, there isn't that much money to do what you've explained. What you said does make the best case scenario.

Since I've dyno'd my car so many times, I can tell if a tune has adapted or not. This is why when I change out to a different tune, I run the car normally shifting normally on the dyno a couple times. I also do a couple WOT pulls in different gears before the next "run".

With all of this talk about taking a lot of time to adapt, I don't agree with this at all. You can easily tell on the dyno if a tune has not adapted.

There seems to be so many excuses on this board when a mamber performs independent testing, but I really believe that if the member does what I have said about letting the second tune adapt on the dyno by doing what I have described, then there should be no excuses.

OP, hopefully you will have some say in how the testing will be performed instead of just paying a shop to do 3 runs on each tune.
If the shop just switches out the tune and then does 3 pulls then I would agree with Shiv. The first 2 would most likely not reflect the "adapted" map.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by e90AW335i

I remember doing some same day dyno testing with multiple tunes and you seemed fine with the results......

I also remember taking the car off the dyno after one test and driving it on the street for an hour before puttting it back on the dyno for another test. I think you were in the passenger seat.

Shiv

[e.n335]

Originally Posted by G37KILR

Where is Driver72 in all of this? LOL he hasn't responded to anything yet

This thread has been a drama already, temporary being closed, cleaned up and reopened again. Some would have lost their interests.

[stressdoc]

It should be easy to test the "adaptation" rates. I trust those of you with a lot of dyno experience, but it would be useful to have data demonstrating what the effects are. Run a tune virgin, then with 3 pulls, then with an hour of driving around, then with a couple days of driving around, all with keeping extraneous variables (temp, etc.) constant. That is the way the R&D engineers get to do it in their high-tech labs...

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by eldy

why can't you just do 10 dyno pulls instead of 3?

You could but it would just cost more because of time.
There's wait time between runs as well to give time to cool down.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by eldy

why can't you just do 10 dyno pulls instead of 3?

Depends on the conditions. Ten runs will make the room temp go up several degrees. More so, it will introduce a lot of exhaust gas into the room. Both these factors will lead to measurable power loss which will counter the effects of positive adaptation. If it's a proper dyno room (exhaust ducting, fresh air supply, temp control, etc,.), none of this is an issue. Unfortunately, due to the cost of making such a room, few dyno shops are designed this way. This is why most shops like to keep the number of runs to a minimum. Especially those with carbon monoxide meters. Cooling is also an issue. The better the IC cooling, the bigger advantage the higher boost car will have. The worse the cooling, the lower boost car will do better.

shiv

[Driver72]

For results go here:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=162124


Moderators, please close this thread now.