[_N54]

I'm not sure if a lot of DCT owners are aware of this or if there is a thread on this topic so I apologize, but recently in the beginning of July XHP finally released a DCT software. I think it's a bit pricey, but were able to adjust the RPM for launch control, shifts are quicker like the M3 GTS on their stage 3 flash, etc, etc. I listed the information below. I haven't purchased mine yet, but I will once I get my car bolted up and tuned.

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335is Coupe Stage 1
- Torque Limiters removed
- Line Pressure max. 19 Bar


335is Coupe Stage 2
- Torque Limiters removed
- Line Pressure max. 19 Bar
- Removed Automatic Upshift in Manual
- Removed Kickdown in Manual
- Revised Shiftmaps with very comfy shiftpoints in D, more sportive but still daily-drive shifting in D+Sport
- Launch Control RPM set to 4000 (adjustable through App)
- Optimized Kickdown Take-Off for proper acceleration
- Raised downshift limits in Manual
- Last but not least: Nice upshift sounds even in D


335is Coupe Stage 3
- Torque Limiters removed
- Line Pressure max. 19 Bar
- Removed Automatic Upshift in Manual
- Removed Kickdown in Manual
- Super-Fast shifting on M3 GTS Level (90 ms, Sport and DSC OFF)
- Revised Shiftmaps with very comfy shiftpoints in D, more sportive but still daily-drive shifting in D+Sport
- Launch Control RPM set to 4000 (adjustable through App)
- Optimized Kickdown Take-Off for proper acceleration
- Raised downshift limits in Manual
- Last but not least: Nice upshift sounds even in D

[lightmanek]

Amazing!
I need to try it on my brother's 335is DTC

Thanks!

[Wingnutts]

After having this for about 2 weeks now, I was not impressed with where the shift points were in regular drive mode on stage 3. I would be in 7th gear by 40 mph and the car would bog down then.

What I do like though... Being able to adjust where launch control rpm is. And the biggest positive is being able to adjust the gear changes in D and S. You can dial the up and down shifts in to your own liking's. I'm still playing with a couple of gears, but I've got d set up now that I absolutely love it. I have S is just a little more aggressive for how long the gear will hold till it switches to the next. Downshifting happens much quicker as well so you get a little engine braking as well. I still spend 90% + of my time in the manual mode, but now if I'm not shifting myself, he car is more enjoyable to drive.

[_N54]

Originally Posted by Wingnutts

After having this for about 2 weeks now, I was not impressed with where the shift points were in regular drive mode on stage 3. I would be in 7th gear by 40 mph and the car would bog down then.

What I do like though... Being able to adjust where launch control rpm is. And the biggest positive is being able to adjust the gear changes in D and S. You can dial the up and down shifts in to your own liking's. I'm still playing with a couple of gears, but I've got d set up now that I absolutely love it. I have S is just a little more aggressive for how long the gear will hold till it switches to the next. Downshifting happens much quicker as well so you get a little engine braking as well. I still spend 90% + of my time in the manual mode, but now if I'm not shifting myself, he car is more enjoyable to drive.

Did you get a chance to mess with the torque reduction setting? Stock is set to 175 if I'm correct, but XHP automatically has it set to 400 so maybe try playing around with it and see which feels better. I'm pretty sure there will be more revisions on the way as time progresses.

[Wingnutts]

Originally Posted by ///S58

Did you get a chance to mess with the torque reduction setting? Stock is set to 175 if I'm correct, but XHP automatically has it set to 400 so maybe try playing around with it and see which feels better. I'm pretty sure there will be more revisions on the way as time progresses.

I have not. I'm only around 450-475 whp and I've had no slippage issues before uploading xhp. Now that I have it, the shifts are definitely firmer in stage 3, but beyond that, I don't feel any difference.

Last night I did update that app and turned the roll control on, or whatever it is called. It seems to work sometimes and not sometimes. When it not work 100%, the rolling forward or in reverse is very minimal though. It is weird to not be moving though when in gear and no brake is applied.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by Wingnutts

I have not. I'm only around 450-475 whp and I've had no slippage issues before uploading xhp. Now that I have it, the shifts are definitely firmer in stage 3, but beyond that, I don't feel any difference.

Last night I did update that app and turned the roll control on, or whatever it is called. It seems to work sometimes and not sometimes. When it not work 100%, the rolling forward or in reverse is very minimal though. It is weird to not be moving though when in gear and no brake is applied.

That's because most people think of the DCT like a torque converter and expect it to creep.

[Wingnutts]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

That's because most people think of the DCT like a torque converter and expect it to creep.

Until this latest update, it does/did. Still undecided about it though.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by Wingnutts

Until this latest update, it does/did. Still undecided about it though.

Most DCT's dont normally creep without gas. Latest XHP update has it I think.

You have any clips on N54 DCTs and how fast they shift up and blip?

Would like to see if the difference between the ZF6 and DCT is large.

[CarAbuser]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

Most DCT's dont normally creep without gas. Latest XHP update has it I think.

You have any clips on N54 DCTs and how fast they shift up and blip?

Would like to see if the difference between the ZF6 and DCT is large.

Shift speed is in a different league to the slushbox to begin with. xHP doesn't really make the DCT noticeably quicker just more aggressive. I don't doubt the shift time is quicker but it's not really obvious.

The tach isn't a reliable method for judging shift times since it's programmed to have dampened operation with limited rate of change. You can code the KOMBI to make it move faster.

[Wingnutts]

This is a copy and paste from spool street from one of the guys at XHP. Good reading and has some insight.

Clemens here from xHP...

As it's next to impossible to transport information through Social Media (it is lost after 2 days...), so we'd like to contribute to the discussion here. A few words as introduction, before we get to the points made here:

TCU-Remaps do not exist on it's own in a sealed environment. They are put onto cars, where owners have flashed the DME, stacked a JB4 on it, coded stuff with Carly and also did some fancy stuff like "flash the DSC from a M-Car onto a Z4, it works awesome". Also some of them are not on matching iStep, but have exchanged units from different MY cars, or maybe only updated their EMF through WinkFP to fix some quirks. All those units communicate with each other. Then someone flashes his TCU and has strange things happen and of course it has to be the last thing changed. Our Job is then to trace that stuff and teach the App how to recognize things and act accordingly. And of course BMW itself also has it's Bugs...it's software and it always has. You can't test that fully. Never. It always surfaces once a few hundred people out there use a product. What we do is develop on proper cars and then release and learn. In case of the DCT development took 15 months, 2 Transmissions and 3 cars. We developed (and are developing) on 335i E92, Z4 35i and M4 F8x.

And once it is out, everyone of course knows within seconds whats wrong. (it's a non-matching ZB, they use old software, blablabla). All crap. Actually the ZB is just a Number...we could put in someones name their as well, if it makes him happy. A calibration for a Z4 can be turned into one for a 335i in a few minutes. (well we can...) The differences are in mapping and behavior mostly. Only small parts are in fact due to different hardware, which is in case of the Z4 the DEC switch and the EMF parking brake. (and of course all works normal on our own Z4 35i) N54 or N55 is negligible in the TCU mapping. Also EU or US does not play a role, yet there exist different ZBs for them. Some insight: The difference between most EU and US ZBs is different mapping of some gear-hold functions during lateral-G due to US customers seen as the more comfy ones by BMW. Sometimes they change a bit more, sometimes it's only a single bit for a sub-function turned off entirely. Stuff we remap anyway, so no need to care about that. I'm always smiling when comparing "user-experience" in forums between different ZBs and then open those maps and look what is actually changed. Thats why user-feedback is not of value in many cases. Peope just tend to trick themselves. Especially on first impression, when being still excited.

Making a map for single car is "easy". Making it work on thousands of cars with unkown history is the hard part. Everyone contacting us at support@rbttuning.com with issues with his Z4 (btw...to date it's 3 cars/owners) got a custom map and is fine. We are still working on a generic Map-Update, which should be there in a few days.


Now on to the things we read here:

"Launch Control does not work on Track": The "AG" cars use the DSC for Traction Control during LC, which is sub-optimal. The "M" Cars regulate it fully inside the TCU (while DSC is OFF) which is a much faster and precise method. Unfortunately it's not too easy to make the M-LC work on a AG car but with todays update on Android (Apple in a few days) there is a way out, with the "Kickdown Launch" Custom Function. This lets you select 2 type of clutch engagements (Perfomance or Burnout) and set an RPM for it. All you have to do is configure it, set car to DSC OFF, stage it and quickly go full throttle incl. Kickdown. The car will raise the RPM to the set threshold and then drop the clutch (Burnout Mode) or fade it in (Performance-Mode). On "Track" disabling the Creep function will help as well.

Short-Shifting: Thats more an opinion as really an actual error. Can be intended by us and is just not as the user wants it to be or is caused by changed throttle/load mapping in ECU Tune. Shiftpoints in BMW Software are based on raw Pedal-Value. If Tuner applies a more "aggressive" Throttle-Mapping in DME, it inevitably pulls down all Shift-Points. Possible solutions: Ask Tuner to leave that stuff alone, flash Stock DME Map, remove crappy "Throttle-Tuner" (Placebo-Box connected at Pedal), press Sport Button, use Shiftmap-Editor in xHP, check "Use Stock Shiftmaps" in xHP. For instance on our 335i the typical take-off 1-2 shiftpoint is down from 3000 to 2300, with the current FBO DME Map. The shiftmap in the TCU has not changed, but the throttle is adjusted to be more aggressive in the DME Tune, so you are only giving it 20% Throttle, instead of ~ 35% on a normal take-off, which pulls down the shiftpoint. Thats inherent and thats the reason the Shiftmap-Editor is there. There is no "optimal" mapping for all the throttle/load maps all the Tuners out there create. We map for stock Load/Throttle Mapping as that is the only base and consistently tell all Tuners to leave those maps alone. (they often just do not know what they are causing)

"Jerky" Take-Off part-throttle: Purely DME related. Same Topic as above. We did not change anything there. Actually the clutch grabs a bit more aggressive on the Z4 cars, but again...thats just different mapping by BMW, not hardware related. Solution: Similar as above, just be more gentle on throttle or disable creep. This makes take-off in general a bit more smoother as there is no Clutch-Torque added from the Creep-Function itself.

"RPM stays fixed for a short period after shift:" Yes, it does. It always did. You just started to recognize it now. The RPM needle does not show real RPM. (it would wobble all the time) Instead it's a calculated value the DME wants you to see and sometimes very, very alert people acknowledge those small deviations during shifts.

"My Car feels little better": It will feel even more different with the coming updates and will get a lot smarter in terms of driver-recognition in D and S Mode. (change behavior based on braking, cornering, throttle aggression etc.) It will then also blip on itself during braking in Sport Mode.

"Sport+ becomes the same as Sport, only fast in DSC OFF:" Sorry, to disappoint you but Sport and Sport+ is the same shift-speed. It always was. Only D and S mode chose different shift-points, but M mode stays the same. With the stock map you are not even able to access the DSC OFF Shiftmode. (it stays the same as Sport) It's not active in AG cars, only in M3. So the car will shift exactly the same in Sport/Sport+ and DSC OFF with stock map. With Stage 2 and Stage 3 the full potatoe in DSC OFF is unlocked. Try to lower torque reduction to 100 Nm in Custom Settings and see your tyres spin on 1-2 upshift in DSC-OFF.

And just for the record, we are 6 people at xHP.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by CarAbuser

Shift speed is in a different league to the slushbox to begin with. xHP doesn't really make the DCT noticeably quicker just more aggressive. I don't doubt the shift time is quicker but the chn

The tach isn't a reliable method for judging shift times since it's programmed to have dampened operation with limited rate of change. You can code the KOMBI to make it move faster.

I know shift speeds gonna be faster, ZF6 is much older after all.

What about comparing the DCT from 335is to a XHP stage 3 tuned ZF6,

How much faster would you say the DCT is?

[CarAbuser]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

I know shift speeds gonna be faster, ZF6 is much faster older after all.

What about comparing the DCT from 335is to a XHP stage 3 tuned ZF6,

How much faster would you say the DCT is?

Never been in a ZF6 with xHP. I have been in a ZF8 with xHP and that still felt slow compared to the DCT. The changes are quicker but not comparable.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by CarAbuser

Never been in a ZF6 with xHP. I have been in a ZF8 with xHP and that still felt slow compared to the DCT. The changes are quicker but not comparable.

ZF8 is almost as fast as DCT, I'm surprised you think it's slow,

M135i below is running XHP stage 3 on ZF8 gearbox.

Latest ones in F90 M5 etc are even quicker than the earlier ZF8, as fast as MDCT

[NeoVsMatrix]

hi all, new to the forum, will take a 2013 335is from his current owner sometime next week, and am really excited.
i was looking for a manual, but had to learn that they are just SO uncommon here in the US.. so i settled for the DCT now.

Question (sorry for being a total newbie on all of this):

Is there a difference between the BMW DCT and the M-DCT ? i can't find a clear answer online, the videos i see online for the "M" DCT, explaining their "low speed assistant", i am wondering if this is applying for "all" BMW DCT's, or is there a special M version ?

thanks for any responses and helping out the new guy... !

[_N54]

Originally Posted by NeoVsMatrix

hi all, new to the forum, will take a 2013 335is from his current owner sometime next week, and am really excited.
i was looking for a manual, but had to learn that they are just SO uncommon here in the US.. so i settled for the DCT now.

Question (sorry for being a total newbie on all of this):

Is there a difference between the BMW DCT and the M-DCT ? i can't find a clear answer online, the videos i see online for the "M" DCT, explaining their "low speed assistant", i am wondering if this is applying for "all" BMW DCT's, or is there a special M version ?

thanks for any responses and helping out the new guy... !

I don't know if the transmissions are spec to spec the same, but I know the 335is has a dual mass flywheel which is heavier and the M's have the transmission modes to pick from, but the 335is does not. I have recently flashed to the XHP Stage 3 and the shifts are lightning fast now (M3 GTS speed apparently). I have also purchased a M3/M4 flywheel which is a single mass and 10-lbs lighter, but have not installed it yet. You won't be disappointed. The 335is is known for the DCT trans even though a manual is more rare and some what more fun.

[mike_o]

2011 335is DCT MHD 2+ FBO 420WHP w Quaife LSD here - new to the thread. I never used launch control much - it seemed a bit to wild - and now it's indirectly disabled after I disabled the kick-down function.

Looking for the best (quickest) way to launch the car, I stumbled upon xHP. Would that - parallel to the MHD kick down disable - allow me to use the launch control with, say, 2500rpm launch point?

I may have to race my director's C63 AMG (stock), so I need all the help I can get.

thanks

EDIT: Took the plunge and installed xHP st3. Works well and fairly smooth. I like the anti-creep function which adds to the DS mode takeoff. 2500RPM is possible, but I haven't tried it yet (wet, wet, wet)

[_N54]

Originally Posted by mike_o

2011 335is DCT MHD 2+ FBO 420WHP w Quaife LSD here - new to the thread. I never used launch control much - it seemed a bit to wild - and now it's indirectly disabled after I disabled the kick-down function.

Looking for the best (quickest) way to launch the car, I stumbled upon xHP. Would that - parallel to the MHD kick down disable - allow me to use the launch control with, say, 2500rpm launch point?

I may have to race my director's C63 AMG (stock), so I need all the help I can get.

thanks

EDIT: Took the plunge and installed xHP st3. Works well and fairly smooth. I like the anti-creep function which adds to the DS mode takeoff. 2500RPM is possible, but I haven't tried it yet (wet, wet, wet)

You can also enable the performance-mode launch so it launches smoother. It's almost like feathering the clutch on a manual car and if you want to shred the tires enable the burn out mode.

[NoGuru]

Originally Posted by mike_o

2011 335is DCT MHD 2+ FBO 420WHP w Quaife LSD here - new to the thread. I never used launch control much - it seemed a bit to wild - and now it's indirectly disabled after I disabled the kick-down function.

Looking for the best (quickest) way to launch the car, I stumbled upon xHP. Would that - parallel to the MHD kick down disable - allow me to use the launch control with, say, 2500rpm launch point?

I may have to race my director's C63 AMG (stock), so I need all the help I can get.

thanks

EDIT: Took the plunge and installed xHP st3. Works well and fairly smooth. I like the anti-creep function which adds to the DS mode takeoff. 2500RPM is possible, but I haven't tried it yet (wet, wet, wet)

I personally would not use launch control in a race. You have to leave some TC enabled to use it and it could give you throttle closures.
Since you have LSD, just ease into throttle with TC off.

I have never raced a C63 that was faster then me although I might have a few more mods then you I think you can take him.

[Mohammad335i]

Hi guys any one can tell me what is the best flash sitting regarding Xhp stage 3 for my 335i n55 DCT mhd stage 2+ , in details because I cannot find online someone do it online in video