[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by JOe335i

Thanks for the responses Shiv.

So NO returns, maybe/somewhat of a deal on existing customer for credit towards something in the future. but since nothing will be more expensive, you will have to trade in and some $$?

I didn't mention any details about a return policy yet. So please don't put words in my mouth.

And those who bought the V3 PNP within the last few months thinking they got the best new product, just werent thinking straight about technology and now they just lost around 520 bucks and got more uncessary stuff with the V3, i guess there just out of luck.

They weren't just thinking they got the best new product, they got it. And they still have it. And they will continue to have it for quite some time. I don't know why you are harping on this. They didn't "lose" any money. The PROcede didn't suddently become "outdated". In fact, with the ongoing free software/firmware updates, the PROcede they have now is better than the PROcede they had when they first bought it. I fail to see where they got screwed out of money. And while your concern for them is heartfelt and admirable, I think it's a bit misplaced.

just concerns of mine, since im gonna go with the RACE PNP anyways, but i dont wanna get bent over at the end and regret it, please a grand for just what was 1500+ is a bargain!! in my book. good to see tunes get affordable

If one busy a tune based upon it's resale value, he's making a mistake. I think one should buy a tune based upon how it makes his car drive and what features he'll find useful for his particular needs.

my 2c,
Shiv

[maui86]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

While the old v3s had this feature, the current v3 doesn't for a couple of reasons. One of them being that we used up that analog input for fuel pressure control. So the solution is to wire up a couple of resistors (DIY info posted a couple months ago) in the PNP harness. Costs about $2 and takes 5min. The Rev.II procede has more I/O so it is possible to bring back the software-based approach. But no immediate plans on that.

Shiv

ahhh, good to know since i have a newer v3 pnp harness. so before i install the catless downpipes, i have to do that resistor retrofit so i dont get limp modes or funky engine performance, correct? for some reason, i thought the o2 sim was built in the new ones as well, but oh well no biggy.

[JOe335i]

Shiv thanks alot for the responses, i appreciate taking the time to get things together.

[wu2x]

I voted race PNP: I was already thinking about the Procede for its ability to tweak settings, and this is even cheaper with the same functionality. Being able to upgrade firmware is a huge win.

[tek818]

Race PnP for sure cuz I'm a technology whore

[WOPALX]

Shiv,

I see a lot of people are giving you a hard time about the power tap & ground & the way it's not integrated into the ECU connections. My biggest issue isn't the power tap but the ground with the reasoning that the easiest method for BMW to see I have a tune is to look for the grounding wire.

So I guess my question is why don't you leave the power tap as it but find a way to ground it easily within the ECU?


In regards to the new race PnP I think if you added bluetooth support you'd get a lot of existing procede customers upgrading. I don't want the agro of using USB to serial adaptors etc if I can help it.

Cheers,

S

[Elijaih]

For me, I would want the race PNP version at the Lite pinout version price. I selected the lite pinout because of the price.

Call me cheap, but I bought my 535i used, 1 month old with 1,300 miles to save more than 10k on the car.

Still haven't bought a tune yet....

[gtrokin330]

Im def. down to get a race pNp but at a slightly lower price

[maui86]

Originally Posted by Elijaih

For me, I would want the race PNP version at the Lite pinout version price. I selected the lite pinout because of the price.

Call me cheap, but I bought my 535i used, 1 month old with 1,300 miles to save more than 10k on the car.

Still haven't bought a tune yet....

dude, im with you on that! it had about 3,800miles and saved ~9k from getting it new. 4kmiles = 2months driving for me...well worth the saved money. with that said price does matter, but i also like to be fair. I think the race pnp at its suggested price is definitely a steal. pnp up to ~80rwhp for under $1k and keep stock drivability is, well...awesome.

[usc335]

PROcede race PnP for the features, user adjustability, and clean install. As for the external power tap, I prefer the more robust engineering solution. If that means an external power tap because it's more stable, then so be it. Personally, I do not want to compromise performance/stability just to have "full" PnP. However, I may be in the minority. From what I see on this forum, I think a ton of people are "sold" on the "full" PnP thing and do not care about what the superior engineering solution is. It's always a battle between engineering and marketing. The mass market tends to follow the products with better marketing as opposed to the ones with superior engineering. My two cents.

[kentgbr]

Originally Posted by usc335

PROcede race PnP for the features, user adjustability, and clean install. As for the external power tap, I prefer the more robust engineering solution. If that means an external power tap because it's more stable, then so be it. Personally, I do not want to compromise performance/stability just to have "full" PnP. However, I may be in the minority. From what I see on this forum, I think a ton of people are "sold" on the "full" PnP thing and do not care about what the superior engineering solution is. It's always a battle between engineering and marketing. The mass market tends to follow the products with better marketing as opposed to the ones with superior engineering. My two cents.

I agree with you fully on every point, the more robust engineering solution is preferable. With the way the Procede controls and drives the boost control solenoids, it's a good idea to tap the power from the largest gauge wire before any IR drops in the harness. Using the star connection approach for signal ground is smart as well. The Rev I box uses high quality sealed connectors and is clearly designed for the automotive underhood environment. Yet people complain it's too big relative to a competing device that uses unsealed, non-automotive grade connections. I'm satisfied with my over-engineered Rev I unit, especially as Vishnu has pledged to continue parallel development for Rev I and II.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by kentgbr

I agree with you fully on every point, the more robust engineering solution is preferable. With the way the Procede controls and drives the boost control solenoids, it's a good idea to tap the power from the largest gauge wire before any IR drops in the harness. Using the star connection approach for signal ground is smart as well. The Rev I box uses high quality sealed connectors and is clearly designed for the automotive underhood environment. Yet people complain it's too big relative to a competing device that uses unsealed, non-automotive grade connections. I'm satisfied with my over-engineered Rev I unit, especially as Vishnu has pledged to continue parallel development for Rev I and II.

Yep.. one of the most expensive components of Rev I is the water proof Deutche brand enclosure and connectors. It actually accounts for a surprisingly large fraction of the overall parts cost. And if it wasn't for the fact that we can install it in the ECU compartment, we would still retain that enclosure. In fact, we will still produce the Rev.I for applications where we have to mount the unit under the hood (Mazdaspeed 3, Mitsu Evo X, etc,.) As for the power and ground, we're not at all concerned about the ground tapping into the ECU harness. So at least we'll get rid of the ground loop that currently extends into the engine bay. Rev.1 guys can easily retrofit this wiring mod if that external ground wire really bothers them. The 12v power source choice will not be a compromise. I have no problem going with the external power that we currently use with the Rev.I. So no worries there. We'll make sure it's bulletproof.

Once again, thanks to everyone for taking the time to give us all this great feedback. Keep it coming

Cheers
shiv

[335i/335d?]

I voted the RACE PNP!! Especially for us European customer its a great option to download and load the maps into the procede. I just hope we can also see some dyno results to see how it compares to the JB3.

Shiv, do you know of any tuned DCT's yet??

[munters]

I didn't vote, but I would for the Race PNP.
I own the Procede 1 and I don't feel at all cheated. (technology improoves)
The benefits of loading maps is great.
To buy a chip and pay 10 times as much for shipping to europe is just crazy.

[JOe335i]

RACE PNP almost 4:1 aganist the LITE, this forum is a techy one

[rdsport323]

Originally Posted by JOe335i

RACE PNP almost 4:1 aganist the LITE, this forum is a techy one

I wouldn't say they were techys necessarily... but for only $200 more than LITE, is a small price to pay for all functions. Had he kept the price at 1495, the LITE would be getting the most votes.. it all comes down to price. Its like with Cable TV... you can get HBO for $5 month or, you can get HBO/Showtime/Cinemax/Starz all for $10/month. Which would you pick?..

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by 335i/335d?

I voted the RACE PNP!! Especially for us European customer its a great option to download and load the maps into the procede. I just hope we can also see some dyno results to see how it compares to the JB3.

Shiv, do you know of any tuned DCT's yet??

Nope.. haven't even seen one yet

Shiv

[darkphantom]

^
That would be very interesting.

I like the look of this, no mess, no wires!

hmm...but that Lite version does look good for those who want the put it and forget + speed delimiter(good for a long track)

this will definitely make people think twice about what tune to get (in a good way)

[T2x]

Come on guys you gotta realize shiv is running a business.

Prices should be set to compete and those who cant match or beat prices of the competition for similar products will not survive.

A sub-$1000 V3 is the only way for shiv to stay in the game long term and it will make getting a V3 a more attainable goal for many users.

For those who paid a lot for it before, think of yourselves as the ones that funded the research and development for a great product. Your money didn't go to waste and you shouldn't expect to get any of it back if shiv releases a cheaper version because that's just life and business.

Anyway I'm all for competition. Competition creates the will to invent better products and give better support. In the end, the company with the best device at the lowest price will be the one ahead of the pack

[ATSR]

Originally Posted by darkphantom

^
That would be very interesting.

I like the look of this, no mess, no wires!

hmm...but that Lite version does look good for those who want the put it and forget + speed delimiter(good for a long track)

this will definitely make people think twice about what tune to get (in a good way)

The speed limiter defeat was the decision maker for me to go with Procede Lite PnP Rev.II instead of JB3.

My car is limited to 130 (even though it has the sports package ) so I was going to get the AA speed defeat plus JB3 but I didn't like the idea of having two separate piggybacks.

[335i/335d?]

Nope.. haven't even seen one yet

Shiv

Picked up mine last week! Just dont want to be the first to try it ! Still trying to break it in (not really succesfull in doing that, to addictive to floor it). After that I am in for more