[coolingmist]

Also, I dont know the position of your tank, but remember when you accelerate the fluid will tend to move to the back of the tank, so make sure the tank is positioned so the water moves toward the tap. If you follow the instructions on putting a pickup tube like we did, you will not need to change the tank position. The pickup tap is the best way as you can run the tank almost dry before having any issues.

Let me know how this resolved your issue.

CM

[oc_bimmer]

I reinstalled the pickup fitting and it fixed the problem.
Thanks CM

[coolingmist]

Thats great to know, I know it works because we did substantial testing. It cures it 100% of the time if its done correct.

CM

[R1000K3]

Originally Posted by coolingmist

Yes I understand it says this
"The default value is 22000 pulses/liter, 220 is displayed on the 3 digit display during configuration as the default. The further from the injector the flow sensor is, the more calibration you may need. If you install your flow sensor in the trunk, you will need to change this number to 270"

I am so used to the system I take things for granted. In here we say that if its in the trunk its 270, if at the injector its 220, so I guess I thought it was obvious to adjust between 220 and 270. The adjustment range is from 170 incase anyone needs it. Sorry for the confusion.

CM

I'm a bit confused by this parameter, Flow Input Pulse Liter. What it is actually compensating for? In case the pump is in the trunk and the flow sensor is in the trunk or at the injector, the flow will still be the same. I mean that the flow at a water tap is not any different than the flow at the end of a hose even if it is 100 yards. So there is something I don't understand of the setting of the parameter, please clarify.

1. Is it the lenght from the pump to the flow sensor that is compensated for, or is it the lenght from the flow sensor to the jet?

2. I have the pump in the engine bay, 4 feet hose to the the flow sensor and 3 feet hose to the jet from the sensor. How should the Flow Input Pulse Liter parameter (#6) be set for this configuartion, and why?

3. What is the recommended setting of parameter #16 for v 1.06 Fail Safe Delay for my configuration?

[coolingmist]

Originally Posted by R1000K3

I'm a bit confused by this parameter, Flow Input Pulse Liter. What it is actually compensating for? In case the pump is in the trunk and the flow sensor is in the trunk or at the injector, the flow will still be the same. I mean that the flow at a water tap is not any different than the flow at the end of a hose even if it is 100 yards. So there is something I don't understand of the setting of the parameter, please clarify.

We test everything we sell. I understand its counter intuitive, it goes against logic but its true. You are more than welcome to try this yourself. Flow is flow, yes. it may have to do with back pressure but the fact is you need to change this value for it to be accurate. the further back you have it the more you need to change the setting.

[quote]

1. Is it the lenght from the pump to the flow sensor that is compensated for, or is it the lenght from the flow sensor to the jet?

[quote]

good question.

2. I have the pump in the engine bay, 4 feet hose to the the flow sensor and 3 feet hose to the jet from the sensor. How should the Flow Input Pulse Liter parameter (#6) be set for this configuartion, and why?

Other than our guidelines I cant give you an exact setting. If its within a 6 inches to a foot from the injector leave it at default. If you have it in the trunk wihin a foot of the pump change it to our setting that we suggest. Those are the only to 2 ways we suggest our customers to install it because those are the only configurations we have tested.

Having said that you can configure it one time to fit your needs. Set the display to show flow rate (003 on display mode) Remove your jet from the intake but leave on the hose, put it in a bucket, turn the key to on and put your max boost into the boost gauge for 1 minute. See the CC/M on the gauge and see what is actual. From there you can change the numbers until its accurate. As long as you dont move the flow sensor you never need to calibrate it again.

3. What is the recommended setting of parameter #16 for v 1.06 Fail Safe Delay for my configuration?

The flow sensor position determines this too. I set everything up in my car the perfect way and documented it in the install doc. From there, if customers choose to install it different they will need to change settings to suite.

In my case the flow sensor is 6 inches from the pump and the delay is 35. The further from the pump the longer the delay. As a general rule figure 10 for every 1 feet of line between the pump and flow sensor. IN reality though....you should adjust until it goes away.

[R1000K3]

Taken, thanks, I'll test and will figure out the necessary settings. The Fail Safe Delay is easy, just to make it long enough to give the sensor time to spin at the actual flow rate and perhaps add a margin of 50% or so to not make it longer than necessary. The CMGS will display a under-flow message if it is set to short.

The other parameter (#6), which is not fully understood, is then just to set by cut-and-trie tests in my config to see what works. In case it is set wrong, what is presented on the display, what is the effect of a wrong-setting of #6?

[coolingmist]

Originally Posted by R1000K3

Taken, thanks, I'll test and will figure out the necessary settings. The Fail Safe Delay is easy, just to make it long enough to give the sensor time to spin at the actual flow rate and perhaps add a margin of 50% or so to not make it longer than necessary. The CMGS will display a under-flow message if it is set to short.

The other parameter (#6), which is not fully understood, is then just to set by cut-and-trie tests in my config to see what works. In case it is set wrong, what is presented on the display, what is the effect of a wrong-setting of #6?

#6 is the flow calibration. Setting it wrong will give you in accurate flow display.

David

[R1000K3]

I see, the #6 parameter is actually the calibration of the flow sensor reading, even if we don’t fully understand why this is needed. In case it is not set correctly though, it will give two side effects. The first one is the flow bar will not show correctly. The second effect is it will offset the under-flow and over-flow set points some. So, for practical purposes it can just be leaved at default, since the actual flow will not change a lot (if any) over the length of the hose. Is this correct?

[coolingmist]

Originally Posted by R1000K3

I see, the #6 parameter is actually the calibration of the flow sensor reading, even if we don’t fully understand why this is needed. In case it is not set correctly though, it will give two side effects. The first one is the flow bar will not show correctly. The second effect is it will offset the under-flow and over-flow set points some. So, for practical purposes it can just be leaved at default, since the actual flow will not change a lot (if any) over the length of the hose. Is this correct?

The flow calibration is designed to be flexible for the user. If you decide to move the flow sensor you need a way to calibrate it so its accurate. I believe in making products that are adaptable. Try to think outside of the box. Lets not do "one size fits all" and call it a day. Lets not mass market junk and think were experts because you can buy us at a warehouse. We dont want to be the biggest, we want to be the best. To be the best we need to be innovative and have features that are simple to use and flexible.

You are right on your first points, however your actual flow rate reported to the CMGS will be incorrect...not just the display, so if you move for example the flow sensor to the trunk, you need to set the calibration. If not, the flow sensor will read incorrect and you will be flowing different than you are expecting. If for example you have flow sensor in trunk and dont calibrate it, you will likely hit your "00.1" low flow every time, even with a big delay.

CM

[R1000K3]

Originally Posted by coolingmist

The flow calibration is designed to be flexible for the user. If you decide to move the flow sensor you need a way to calibrate it so its accurate. I believe in making products that are adaptable. Try to think outside of the box. Lets not do "one size fits all" and call it a day. Lets not mass market junk and think were experts because you can buy us at a warehouse. We dont want to be the biggest, we want to be the best. To be the best we need to be innovative and have features that are simple to use and flexible.

You are right on your first points, however your actual flow rate reported to the CMGS will be incorrect...not just the display, so if you move for example the flow sensor to the trunk, you need to set the calibration. If not, the flow sensor will read incorrect and you will be flowing different than you are expecting. If for example you have flow sensor in trunk and dont calibrate it, you will likely hit your "00.1" low flow every time, even with a big delay.

CM

That is my understanding to and why I wrote it will offset the set points for under- and over flow situations.

One last comment though since I dont buy the actual flow varies along a hose, unless it is leaking.The flow sensor has no chance to know what is behind or in front of it. It is a closed system (the sensor), which will generate a number of pulses v.s the flow by its body. The sensor-wheel will spin at the same rate for a continous flow wheter it is located directly at the pump or at the injector 10 feet away. I understand you have found it is relavant to adjust it though. My best guess it is to make it work properly also when the flow is pulsed during the progressive phase. Such pressure pulses will look different just outside the pump than after 10 feets where they are dampened.

[coolingmist]

Originally Posted by R1000K3

That is my understanding to and why I wrote it will offset the set points for under- and over flow situations.

One last comment though since I dont buy the actual flow varies along a hose, unless it is leaking.The flow sensor has no chance to know what is behind or in front of it. It is a closed system (the sensor), which will generate a number of pulses v.s the flow by its body. The sensor-wheel will spin at the same rate for a continous flow wheter it is located directly at the pump or at the injector 10 feet away. I understand you have found it is relavant to adjust it though. My best guess it is to make it work properly also when the flow is pulsed during the progressive phase. Such pressure pulses will look different just outside the pump than after 10 feets where they are dampened.

I understand. The distance between the flow sensor and the injector is the catalist without any doubt, without any mistake, the amount of line between the flow sensor and the injector sets the stage for this. What is the exact cause? I never meant to simply say its the amount of line..end of story...I have not found the exact reason and frankly its not all that important.

The pump is a positive displacement pump and the flow sensor is not a positive displacement flow sensor. Without any doubt it is sensitve to pulsing. Using a positive displacement flow sensor would double the price of the kit and not be very practicle.

CM

[R1000K3]

Yes, it is always a compromise. A cheap basic system with just a simple boost pressure sensor controlling the pump on/off will perform about the same under normal conditions. The reason I bought the CMGS is still valid though. It will display whether methanol flow is operating or not when it should, and the amount of it. Not very precisely under the progressive phase, but good enough to see if and when trouble occurs. It will also monitor the flow status vs. boost pressure, and present alarms if the flow is too low (or high=leak) above boost threshold. This in combination with the boost meter and low on fluid indication and automatic map switching in case of faults makes it a versatile solution. Not to mention the upcoming v.1.07 that will send a linear control signal to piggyback’s for flow rate enabling them to adjust boost accordingly.

[coolingmist]

The flow sensor has a very fast reaction time and it is very precise and accurate. Using a basic on/off system has only the advantage of cost. Not performance or value. On the top end if you have a boost switch system setup accurately, it will perform similar. However, on the low end you will have too much flow. I realize everyone has a different want/need/budget so we make different kits so everyone can get something they can budget.

CM

[cn555ic]

Originally Posted by R1000K3

Yes, it is always a compromise. A cheap basic system with just a simple boost pressure sensor controlling the pump on/off will perform about the same under normal conditions. The reason I bought the CMGS is still valid though. It will display whether methanol flow is operating or not when it should, and the amount of it. Not very precisely under the progressive phase, but good enough to see if and when trouble occurs. It will also monitor the flow status vs. boost pressure, and present alarms if the flow is too low (or high=leak) above boost threshold. This in combination with the boost meter and low on fluid indication and automatic map switching in case of faults makes it a versatile solution. Not to mention the upcoming v.1.07 that will send a linear control signal to piggyback’s for flow rate enabling them to adjust boost accordingly.

So you switched over to Procede from JB? Is the meth system any different in terms of controlling it compared to the JB system?

[R1000K3]

Agree, but I'm not convinced a progressive flow is needed at all within the narrow boost window that the N54 operates in tuned applications above stock boost levels. The boost window on top of stock is only 10 PSI, about 8 to 18 PSI. The fast reaction time of the flow sensor is a disadvantage in pulsed applications (i.e. in the progressive phase), and the CMGS software to avoid the need for calibration about where the sensor is located should filter (dampen) peak variations. The only need for flow sensor calibration should be if you change the flow sensor to another type with a different pulse rate vs. actual flow.

[R1000K3]

Originally Posted by cn555ic

So you switched over to Procede from JB? Is the meth system any different in terms of controlling it compared to the JB system?

I've never used a true JB(3), just the JB+ before buying the Procede, which I'm very pleased with. The current control of meth vs. tune is about the same for JB and the Procede, i.e. using an aggressive map for meth, and automatic return to conventional map if meth fails. Vishnu has progressive boost vs. meth flow in pipe, but I guess JB will move in this direction to, so I cant say one will be better than the other until both are available in new releases.