[_TB_]

Originally Posted by bradsm87

You said earlier you're making 560Nm or was that just an example number?

Nope that is true - 560Nm. But think about how you can limit the torque - even full throttle

[bradsm87]

Originally Posted by _TB_

Nope that is true - 560Nm. But think about how you can limit the torque - even full throttle

Aaaah you tested the torque limit per gear table?

I was a bit slow to get the hint!

Let me know if it is the table we thought it was and I'll pass it on to unclejoe to put in the github XDF!

[_TB_]

Originally Posted by bradsm87

Aaaah you tested the torque limit per gear table?

I was a bit slow to get the hint!

Let me know if it is the table we thought it was and I'll pass it on to unclejoe to put in the github XDF!

53DA8 8x1.

[bradsm87]

Originally Posted by _TB_

53DA8 8x1.

That's the one! Thanks heaps for testing it!

[bradsm87]

I just realised the last cell is probably reverse. Like this:

N 1 2 3 4 5 6 R

Are there axis labels for this table on either of those OLS files?

[Twisted Tuning]

Originally Posted by DWR

Sorry everyone, in the excitement I forgot to add these.
You'll need to remove the ".PDF" and ".txt" for the attached filenames in this and the previous post, respectively.

What I have done here is highly irregular and probably not appreciated by some who could profit from selling this information. I bought the information without stipulation by the seller. So, it is mine and I give it to you all freely.

definitely not appreciated considering you didn't buy anything. you donated a portion of the cost that i foot the bill for. had i known you were simply going to turn around and give it to everyone i would have donated instead footing the entire bill. Moreso principal than cost.

Definitely won't be doing that again. Good luck gents.

[bradsm87]

Originally Posted by Justin@MHD

definitely not appreciated considering you didn't buy anything. you donated a portion of the cost that i foot the bill for. had i known you were simply going to turn around and give it to everyone i would have donated instead footing the entire bill. Moreso principal than cost.

Definitely won't be doing that again. Good luck gents.

I just flicked you an email. This was definitely just a misunderstanding. I'm looking forward to making a special mention for your contribution in the XDF notes and changelog plus once you're ready to do TCU tunes, I'll be sure to always recommend you as I do now for DME tuner recommendations. I love your work. Keep pumping out great tunes!

[Twisted Tuning]

Originally Posted by bradsm87

I just flicked you an email. This was definitely just a misunderstanding. I'm looking forward to making a special mention for your contribution in the XDF notes and changelog plus once you're ready to do TCU tunes, I'll be sure to always recommend you as I do now for DME tuner recommendations. I love your work. Keep pumping out great tunes!

hey, no worries man. hopefully some progress is made due to the files. and thanks, much appreciated.

[335dsleeper]

Originally Posted by Justin@MHD

definitely not appreciated considering you didn't buy anything. you donated a portion of the cost that i foot the bill for. had i known you were simply going to turn around and give it to everyone i would have donated instead footing the entire bill. Moreso principal than cost.

Definitely won't be doing that again. Good luck gents.

[bradsm87]

As we suspected, the EDS tables are per circuit state rather than per physical valve. They are (in order):

Clutch A
Clutch B in Drive
Clutch B in R, N & P
Clutch C
Clutch D
Clutch E
System Pressure
TCC Pressure

[bradsm87]

It seems a large amount of pressure-related tables are all very close to each other.

There are 17 "Mindestsystemdruck waehrend Schaltungen" ("Minimum system pressure during circuits") tables, most of which have values of 7000 in the Alpina B3 calibration. Neither the BMW 8HP nor the VAG 6HP map lists detail which individual table is for which purpose.

This 7000 figure is the lowest of any "minimum pressure" type tables I've seen. I'm thinking that the upshift pressure tables more than likely work up to at least 7 bar which is plenty enough for a faster shift than you probably should run.

I've linked to my OLS file for the new tables so far below. I left them in German for now. There are some tables that aren't useful in any way for tuning in there. They're just defined to rule out the addresses they use so I'm not looking over the same useless areas all the time. It's created with the demo and will open with the demo.

Of course, none of this would be possible without Justin at Twisted Tuning purchasing the files or _TB_ exporting various stuff out of them. Cheers guys!

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7g...ew?usp=sharing

[wardpa]

Originally Posted by bradsm87

There are 17 "Mindestsystemdruck waehrend Schaltungen" ("Minimum system pressure during circuits") tables,

This should translate "minimum system pressure during shifting"

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by bradsm87

It seems a large amount of pressure-related tables are all very close to each other.

There are 17 "Mindestsystemdruck waehrend Schaltungen" ("Minimum system pressure during circuits") tables, most of which have values of 7000 in the Alpina B3 calibration. Neither the BMW 8HP nor the VAG 6HP map lists detail which individual table is for which purpose.

This 7000 figure is the lowest of any "minimum pressure" type tables I've seen. I'm thinking that the upshift pressure tables more than likely work up to at least 7 bar which is plenty enough for a faster shift than you probably should run.

I've linked to my OLS file for the new tables so far below. I left them in German for now. There are some tables that aren't useful in any way for tuning in there. They're just defined to rule out the addresses they use so I'm not looking over the same useless areas all the time. It's created with the demo and will open with the demo.

Of course, none of this would be possible without Justin at Twisted Tuning purchasing the files or _TB_ exporting various stuff out of them. Cheers guys!

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7g...ew?usp=sharing

These are cool, thanks. Some of them clearly match with an offset, to my GKE211 project.

Do you have shift timing maps like the GKE211? I found those a while back?

[bradsm87]

Originally Posted by rjahl

These are cool, thanks. Some of them clearly match with an offset, to my GKE211 project.

Do you have shift timing maps like the GKE211? I found those a while back?

Yeah upshift timing maps were included in the XDF provided by RBT Tuning.

Is yours a first generation 6HP? What WinOLS file(s) are you using for reference? The E60 GS19 one? Would it be possible to get a copy just to add another potentially handy OLS to the collection?

Cheers,

Brad

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by bradsm87

Yeah upshift timing maps were included in the XDF provided by RBT Tuning.

Is yours a first generation 6HP? What WinOLS file(s) are you using for reference? The E60 GS19 one? Would it be possible to get a copy just to add another potentially handy OLS to the collection?

Cheers,

Brad

Yes, I've been tuning the first gen ZF6HP19. I don't have a Winols file for reference. I've been watching this thread for a really, really long time and taking notes. My TCU bin was one of the first, if not the first posted on this thread. Since then, I have been just building a database of information and slowly building my own Mappack, The XDF from the Xhp helped but there is a bunch of stuff that took a lot more work to locate. This latest OLS from the 8HP has also helped. I'd love a version that my older Winols could read.
a little here a little there.

I don't see the shift times on the XHp XDF, where did you find them?

BTY, I have no support from Xhp. I have friends that helped crack the RSA (512 bit) for the GKE211 and I just simply sign my modified bins and create a custom 0da file. Flash with Winfkp. Not an option for you guys.

I'd love to swap notes and files, just need a common platform to work from.

[bradsm87]

Originally Posted by rjahl

I don't have a Winols file for reference.

What do you get your table names from?

Originally Posted by rjahl

I'd love a version that my older Winols could read.

Originally Posted by rjahl

I'd love to swap notes and files, just need a common platform to work from.

We'll likely have a solution for both of these issues very soon

Originally Posted by rjahl

I don't see the shift times on the XHp XDF, where did you find them?

I was referring to the timespan ongoing clutch tables. What specifically do you think those tables you found do? Could they be a fill time table for the fill phase? As we know, shift time targets vary based on load/torque and those ones don't have a load/torque axis so maybe they're a delay time before shift or a fill phase time. What do you think?

I can find that same 5x1 axis data in my bin once, but no similar table values nearby or even any values that decrease in a way that would be similar to that.

Originally Posted by rjahl

I have friends that helped crack the RSA (512 bit) for the GKE211 and I just simply sign my modified bins and create a custom 0da file. Flash with Winfkp.

That's awesome! Well done!

[bradsm87]

Originally Posted by wardpa

This should translate "minimum system pressure during shifting"

Excellent! That's now a pretty clear answer for the useable range for the upshift shift pressure tables. 7000mbar is more than enough and for those with upgraded input shafts wanting extremely fast shifts, they can raise these minimum system pressure during shift values.

[rjahl]

Quick message to keep the conversation going.

Shift times on the GKE211 are horrible, so it's no surprise that you can not find similar data. Advertised times are something like 800 milliseconds. I've logged torque reduction request periods for about that length of them.

Frankly, I don't have a full understanding of this gearbox so I can only theorize that these are part of the shift target times. I'm guessing there are some inertial + toque correction factors or limit someplace as well.


I thought the maps on Xhp show clutch pressure vs. torque and where not related to time?

I tried to look at your winols file again last night but my PC at home is running the older software and I could not open your file. So now, I'm looking at some files at home and others at the office during lunch.

More latter

[bradsm87]

Originally Posted by rjahl

I thought the maps on Xhp show clutch pressure vs. torque and where not related to time?

There are both ongoing clutch pressure tables and ongoing clutch ramp timespan tables. They are inter-related. To make a shift faster at a particular RPM and torque point, you need to increase pressure in the pressure table and reduce the timespan in the timespan table.

[bradsm87]

I just found a really cool function in Google Sheets - Language translation as a cell formula!

Here is the VAG 6HP28 map list with the addresses in both decimal and hex and names in both German and machine-translated English. So handy!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

I'll do the BMW 8HP one tomorrow.

[_TB_]

Originally Posted by bradsm87

I just realised the last cell is probably reverse. Like this:

N 1 2 3 4 5 6 R

Are there axis labels for this table on either of those OLS files?

I do not think it is per gear. IIRC std has 465nm in the second last value. This is the torque limit @4000 we see when remapping 325d with auto. If we are to go higher we need to cheat..

I'll investigate..

[bradsm87]

Originally Posted by _TB_

I do not think it is per gear. IIRC std has 465nm in the second last value. This is the torque limit @4000 we see when remapping 325d with auto. If we are to go higher we need to cheat..

I'll investigate..

Stock 335i flash gets "torque limit 4" in 5th gear only at around 80-100Nm below that of any other gear. Its values are:

560 560 560 560 560 465 560 340

Alpina B3 does not get that torque limit in 5th. Its values are:

560 560 560 560 560 560 560 340

Clemens at xHP also mentioned those rough figures for stock and Alpina values for torque limit per gear. Searching the binaries (with an allowed variance) was how I found that address, before I even had a map list and nothing else comes close.

The 6HP being a 8x1 and the 8HP being a 10x1 for the same table name is another thing that fits with it being per gear.

As soon as I get my car back, if someone hasn't already, I'll test a random gear for torque limit just in case.