[Serf27]

Originally Posted by CSBM5

As an addendum to my prior comment(s), one fact some buyers of E91s might find is that there are many of us who DIY the majority of repairs at a small fraction of what a dealer or indy would (has to, to stay in business) charge.

That creates a situation where one buyer who depends on outside entities for most repairs has a much different outlook versus a DIY buyer. Care in point: this E91 we bought four years ago -- if we took this someplace to fix all the stuff we've done ourselves, I'm guessing we would have spent close to what we paid for the car ($10k).

Shortly after buying the car I realized why the prior owner likely sold it -- three "repairs" that would have cost more than $2k or so that I did for less than $200. The radio screen repair was easy and cheap, and the squealing HVAC fan was $0 and a few minutes time, and a Xenon control unit. Following that was the other Xenon control unit. These run huge money at a dealer or indy, but with a $40 unit off Amazon (versus BMW OE part at $550) and an hour of time to pull a wheel, fender liner, remove bumper cover, pull out headlight unit, I'm in it for $40 versus a dealer total of near $1k. We've done this three times now (one of those cheap $40 units died after three years). We're also experts now at E9x window regulator repair (I say "we" since my wife and I work together on the cars) having done two on the E91 and two on her prior car, E90 330i. A dealer would charge $400+ for that repair which we can do for $30 (haven't had an Amazon/eBay supplier regulator fail yet; upon close inspection look exactly like the OE part just 85% cheaper).

Take brakes for instance -- I love to buy a used car that needs brakes soon. Most sellers have gotten quotes from a dealer, or indy, for huge money, and that can be used to lever the price down. Brakes are one of the simplest major component repairs you can do on a car, so a DIYer has free labor and parts from the right sources at 30+% off MSRP.

Some parts you do need to buy OE like a left rear door latch unit. I bought one from an Amazon supplier and upon inspection returned it right away (my background is mechanical engineering). It was super cheaply made, and that's a part I'll never take a risk on (door latch unit). So buying from FCP Euro, BMW Morristown online, or getbmwparts to the rescue for OE suff. As an aside, to those that need to replace a door latch mechanism, BMW sells the part with the bolt holes unthreaded, so have the proper size tap at hand -- I have no idea why they do that but have just been told that's the way it is.

None of this is news to DIYer's. Just wanted to point out that one additional reason why at this age some E91s have a bid under them that might not "make sense" to a traditional car owner is that DIY buyers are pricing repairs that are needed perhaps at 80% less or more than the typical buyer.

I second this. When I found the amazon window regulators, mainly rears, I was pretty happy. They’ve gotten them down to around $22 and they work just like OEM.

[SeattleLSB]

I bought a F31 M-Sport whole I continue to look for a E91! I continue to look as well!

[JupiterBMW]

Originally Posted by SeattleLSB

I bought a F31 M-Sport whole I continue to look for a E91! I continue to look as well!

Hah, its tempting to look at the F31s because they're so plentiful compared to the E91!!

Side note, you've got quite the stable... My M3 actually came out of Seattle. I'm in the area for work all the time, one of these days we should try and meet up! Another buddy of mine has an E90 as well.

[SeattleLSB]

Sure thing! I'm in the burbs but I get out to Seattle/Bellevue quite a bit.

I looked for a solid 9 months before I went and bought a F31. I'm not going to pay 25-35K for a E91 spec I want.

The F31 with M-Sport, Track Handling Package (THP), is a wonderful vehicle I and purchased a 2017 CPO for < $35k. I disdain black like you as well but It was the only color since it was CPO. I'm either going to XPEL Stealth it or perhaps do something different in the future.

The B46, 8 Speed ZF, EDC, THP is a wonderful combo with KW DDC Coilovers, HRE Wheels & Dinan tune to give it a little pep but keep it under wararnty. The seats are like memory foam and the car is better in every way to E90/E91.

I keep following F80 swaps on IG and that is likely the future because I want a F80 but want a Wagon!

Good Luck on your search, I'm looking at a E91 RWD Black today in Seattle for 12k. Looks really rough but I continue to look and review!

Originally Posted by JupiterBMW

Hah, its tempting to look at the F31s because they're so plentiful compared to the E91!!

Side note, you've got quite the stable... My M3 actually came out of Seattle. I'm in the area for work all the time, one of these days we should try and meet up! Another buddy of mine has an E90 as well.

[NinetyEight740]

Originally Posted by SeattleLSB

Sure thing! I'm in the burbs but I get out to Seattle/Bellevue quite a bit.

I looked for a solid 9 months before I went and bought a F31. I'm not going to pay 25-35K for a E91 spec I want.

The F31 with M-Sport, Track Handling Package (THP), is a wonderful vehicle I and purchased a 2017 CPO for < $35k. I disdain black like you as well but It was the only color since it was CPO. I'm either going to XPEL Stealth it or perhaps do something different in the future.

The B46, 8 Speed ZF, EDC, THP is a wonderful combo with KW DDC Coilovers, HRE Wheels & Dinan tune to give it a little pep but keep it under wararnty. The seats are like memory foam and the car is better in every way to E90/E91.

I keep following F80 swaps on IG and that is likely the future because I want a F80 but want a Wagon!

Good Luck on your search, I'm looking at a E91 RWD Black today in Seattle for 12k. Looks really rough but I continue to look and review!

Just be careful with the dinan. It’s a misconception that it doesn’t mess with your warranty. this was true many years ago, but dinan product has been horrible in recent years and nothing but junk. Dinan is supposed to stand up for the client and pay repair bills if a failure occurs under the warranty period, but they fight tooth and nail and it’s not worth the headache.

[CSBM5]

I too switched from E91 to F31 hunting over the past year. Almost all F31s have things like comfort access, heated seats, nav, etc, so that makes hunting easier. Almost none of them have adaptive-M suspension and brakes; however there are a sprinkling of Msport package cars, but more of those are just the cosmetic M-sport package without the suspension and brake upgrades. It is nice to have blacked out window trim on those at least.

You still have to be ready to buy from anywhere, but the market is still depreciating fairly strongly, so there isn't a rush to buy a specific car like the E91 market can show. The 2017 F31 330i has dropped about $8-10k in depreciation in the past 12 months, so there is plenty of supply in the mid to upper 20s now.

I've also started looking at one specific SUV/SAV/SAC whatever -- the Porsche Macan as a wagon replacement. After driving an M-sport X1 and being greatly disappointed with it, the switch to thinking we could just replace the E91 with a small SUV and succumb to that cliff jump is at hand.

However, a Macan GTS drives nothing like a typical SUV. With PSAM, lower ride height adjustable suspension, torque vectoring diff, it's a beast of a car/truck/SUV/SAV/dunnowhat. The steering is excellent, PDK outstanding, etc. A far more enjoyable mountain drive experience than an F31 including a 0-100mph time faster than my old E39 M5. Granted, a 2017 GTS costs a bit less than twice what a nice 2017 F31 would cost ($55k vs $32k). So there's that...

Here's an example F31 with asking price $31,498. It is a "sport line" with nice level of options. No cosmetic M-sport package, but it does have the Track Handling package and M sport brakes. Like so many F31s, it's black though.

[SeattleLSB]

Agree with all of your statements. I do find the Macan smaller on the inside vs a E91 or F31. The back seat is definitely smaller for leg room.

It's going to be the same thing for the F31 in a couple years as there is a small percentage with M-Sport, Adaptive, M-Brakes. Most M-Sports are naked just the bumpers.

Originally Posted by CSBM5

I too switched from E91 to F31 hunting over the past year. Almost all F31s have things like comfort access, heated seats, nav, etc, so that makes hunting easier. Almost none of them have adaptive-M suspension and brakes; however there are a sprinkling of Msport package cars, but more of those are just the cosmetic M-sport package without the suspension and brake upgrades. It is nice to have blacked out window trim on those at least.

You still have to be ready to buy from anywhere, but the market is still depreciating fairly strongly, so there isn't a rush to buy a specific car like the E91 market can show. The 2017 F31 330i has dropped about $8-10k in depreciation in the past 12 months, so there is plenty of supply in the mid to upper 20s now.

I've also started looking at one specific SUV/SAV/SAC whatever -- the Porsche Macan as a wagon replacement. After driving an M-sport X1 and being greatly disappointed with it, the switch to thinking we could just replace the E91 with a small SUV and succumb to that cliff jump is at hand.

However, a Macan GTS drives nothing like a typical SUV. With PSAM, lower ride height adjustable suspension, torque vectoring diff, it's a beast of a car/truck/SUV/SAV/dunnowhat. The steering is excellent, PDK outstanding, etc. A far more enjoyable mountain drive experience than an F31 including a 0-100mph time faster than my old E39 M5. Granted, a 2017 GTS costs a bit less than twice what a nice 2017 F31 would cost ($55k vs $32k). So there's that...

Here's an example F31 with asking price $31,498. It is a "sport line" with nice level of options. No cosmetic M-sport package, but it does have the Track Handling package and M sport brakes. Like so many F31s, it's black though.

[4 Doors]

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...CALERTSEMLSRCH

Too far away for me, unfortunately. Someone buy this! It is in California.

E91 w/ sport package, shadowline, comfort access, HiFi speakers, sun visors, space grey over saddle brown. $6500 daily driver!

[rothwem]

Originally Posted by CSBM5

I too switched from E91 to F31 hunting over the past year.

I too was briefly looking since I like the size of the F31 a lot (right between E91 and E61), but the F31s have an alarmingly high transfer case failure rate. The part that fails is the rear output bearing, so doing "xDelete" programming won't help either.

If only they had brought the F31 to the USA in RWD.

[JupiterBMW]

Well, I was watching a perfect car online, but it disappeared today... It was an '11, RWD, 6AT, blue water over grey leather. The car looked great and was listed at $11.3k for 75K miles... So bummed...

I emailed the owner of the '09 Sport package car listed by 4 Doors above, but who knows if I'll hear back. The difficulty I'm having right now is that I'm stuck at work (I'm a marine engineer, on a ship) and won't be off of here until mid February... So many potential cars and I can't do anything right now but wait until I'm done work!

Great stuff though, I'm super excited to get one of these cars... Really going to hunt for Bluewater or Space Grey... Haven't owned either of these colors...

[CSBM5]

Originally Posted by rothwem

I too was briefly looking since I like the size of the F31 a lot (right between E91 and E61), but the F31s have an alarmingly high transfer case failure rate. The part that fails is the rear output bearing, so doing "xDelete" programming won't help either.

If only they had brought the F31 to the USA in RWD.

Yeah, no kidding. RWD and 6MT F31 would be nice. Price-wise it doesn't make sense (yet, give it 5 years) to do a conversion using a wrecked F30.

[JupiterBMW]

Originally Posted by 4 Doors

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...CALERTSEMLSRCH

Too far away for me, unfortunately. Someone buy this! It is in California.

E91 w/ sport package, shadowline, comfort access, HiFi speakers, sun visors, space grey over saddle brown. $6500 daily driver!

Been chatting with the owner of this car today, hoping we can chat more this evening. Seems like a nice guy at least. Curious more about the car.

Wife has granted permission.

[4 Doors]

Originally Posted by JupiterBMW

Been chatting with the owner of this car today, hoping we can chat more this evening. Seems like a nice guy at least. Curious more about the car.

Wife has granted permission.

Sweet! Hoping it would go to a fellow member.

[JupiterBMW]

RANT post...

So I got on the phone with Mike this evening, the owner of the CA sport package space/grey E91 that was linked above... SUPER nice guy, instantly feel comfortable buying from a long time enthusiast like myself... Ironically enough, he says he's a member here but just doesn't post much. I speak to him just now, and he admits he just got a deposit from a local guy (also a forum member... who are you dammit!) on the car...

We start chatting a bit and I explain the reason for the car for me is to replace a Mini Cooper and have something that (a) allows me to keep my M3 in the garage and (b) is big enough for wife to feel safe with kids inside...

He inquires about the M3 and I mention it being a 2011 Lemans Blue E90... Apparently the guy that put the deposit down also has a 2011 E90 M3... in Lemans Blue...


So yeah, apparently that car is gone now too.

[E91WAG3N]

Welcome to the E91 hunt, enjoy your stay.

[ekimp]

Boy, what a small world. Thanks for the repost, @4 Doors!

Rumors are true...that wagon is (was) mine. I posted it here a few months ago after I lowered it on Bilstein/H&R sport. Looks like I priced it a little too aggressively! A lot more hungry fish in the pond than I anticipated.

I think it’s going to a good home though. The coincidence of the two Johns w/ Lemans Blue E90 M3s back to back is still blowing my mind.

@JupiterBMW is next in line if it happens to fall through.

[JupiterBMW]

Originally Posted by E91WAG3N

Welcome to the E91 hunt, enjoy your stay.

Yeah I'm seeing that. Honestly, the hardest part is that I'm not home right now. I'm at sea on a ship, working, and I can't as easily look at/call on cars that I find... By the time I get home, there will most likely be a whole new set of E91s out there...

Originally Posted by ekimp

Boy, what a small world. Thanks for the repost, @4 Doors!

Rumors are true...that wagon is (was) mine. I posted it here a few months ago after I lowered it on Bilstein/H&R sport. Looks like I priced it a little too aggressively! A lot more hungry fish in the pond than I anticipated.

I think it’s going to a good home though. The coincidence of the two Johns w/ Lemans Blue E90 M3s back to back is still blowing my mind.

@JupiterBMW is next in line if it happens to fall through.

Great chatting with you ekimp, look forward to the other John falling off the face of the earth or something like that...

[86Zed]

Lots of F31 platform discussion here without mention of the N20 engine, off-warranty turbo or transfer case concerns. I dig the looks but aesthetics alone is not enough to lose hydraulic steering and a manual transmission. Building a rainy day fund if BMW decides to drop the G31 platform stateside.

The E91 is more than a wagon as it is a prime example of the best of modern BMW - naturally aspirated, hydraulic steering and easy to work on yourself.

[vilord]

So, how many of us would need to participate for the importation cost of a G31 to be worth it?
If 50 people wanted one, and the import crash tests needed ten examples, it would be a 10-15k import surcharge. Hmm.

[86Zed]

Originally Posted by vilord

So, how many of us would need to participate for the importation cost of a G31 to be worth it?
If 50 people wanted one, and the import crash tests needed ten examples, it would be a 10-15k import surcharge. Hmm.

There has been a comment that offering it as custom order only (a la Volvo V90) could be an option to avoid dead inventory. BMW could also take a page out of Tesla's book and take deposits, I wager there are a lot more than 50 people genuinely interested. It seems BMW is committed to offering/forcing Americans into X platform cars...

[tailendcharlie]

I wonder are they forcing or reacting to demand? Because Americans seem only to want trucks (cause sitting higher is safer don’t you know.)

Go to Europe.....hatchbacks, wagons, manuals abound. BWW is importing/building the vehicles Americans want, it would appear.

[ppointer]

Originally Posted by tailendcharlie

I wonder are they forcing or reacting to demand? Because Americans seem only to want trucks (cause sitting higher is safer don’t you know.)

Go to Europe.....hatchbacks, wagons, manuals abound. BWW is importing/building the vehicles Americans want, it would appear.

I agree with all you say here. BMW somewhat created their own problem by giving us an F31 that was woefully inadequate - numb steering, x-drive only, 4-cylinder only, and AT only. They shouldn't be surprised it sold so poorly.

All that said, add me to the list of people that would jump into a group buy of a G21 as long as I could get an M340i version. Would prefer MT and RWD, but I wouldn't let either of those get in the way.