[stressdoc]

Originally Posted by lndshrk

I did not know that having a Gallardo was now considered some über-metric of business success.

Maybe you can convince Mrs. lndshrk of that?!?

(Better yet, convince her on the Enzo for me - mkay? )

Steve has a company with (approx) 70 employees - that seems like it's
pretty "successful" to me.

No doubt Steve is highly successful and has no need for a Lambo to show it.

We all have a good time poking fun at Shiv: his Gallardo, the swarms of babes, the coalition of the worthy Beta testers -- his overall enviable life style. What could be more fun than a job making BMWs go fast? You guys seem to have a lot of green grass from this side of the fence...

[radgator1]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

I wonder what the engineers at FIZ think of all this. At some point in the future it will be fun to compare the 'tunes' of Vishnu, Dinan, et al with the 'tunes' that BMW have developed in house.

Why all the fuss when there are several key facts:
(1) Dinan thought enough of Shiv and piggybacks to try and market his tune.

I've never seen any evidence of this what-so-ever. You can continue to state it as fact if you want to though

[astris]

Originally Posted by smdandb2

While you are spouting off bits and pieces, why don't we put that ALL into context.

Here is the information from EAS (where you got that from):



Co-developed could mean anything, but right there it says OFF ROAD. It is not Mr. Conforti's job to ensure that who he "co-develops" with only sells to race teams. If you are using the car for sanctioned race events and it is not used on public streets you can do whatever the hell you want with it.

He isnt willingly selling the Shark Injector with the o2 feedback turned off for catless cars. The Shark Injector is made for people who street drive their cars.

Oh, I completely agree.

My qualm is that lndshrk made a statement about adding meth in this thread saying "methanol injection isn't legal for street cars anywhere in the USA where I hang my hat. This is the law I have to deal with."

Basically alluding that no meth because it's not carb compliant and a tuner could get in trouble. Yet he has made non carb tunes already under the "race" guise. Can't meth injection be "race" only too? Or is it an issue of not being able to seemless integrate it with a flash, not carb? I don't know.

I don't really care that much. It just piqued my interest that meth no, catless yes, but only for "race" when both aren't carb compliant.

[sales@ESSTuning]

Originally Posted by Nikolas

Seriously the fines for selling a race tune for the street is huge. That's why just about every performance product you buy that affects the emmissions will clearly state "for off-road use only". Vishnu's products state this as well.

It is also illegal to sell an "emission-tampering" product or service to a customer you know will use it on public roads. Like a shop cutting the cats out of a registered, plated car and watching the customer drive it away. Just as illegal. HPF also comes to mind with every turbo kit they sell.

People, including most of the market, just don't care is all. However, the businesses should.

[astris]

Originally Posted by Nikolas

Seriously the fines for selling a race tune for the street is huge. That's why just about every performance product you buy that affects the emmissions will clearly state "for off-road use only". Vishnu's products state this as well.

LOL, obviously.

You do realize though that the "race" tune is sold to anyone, right? Most all use it for street. That's not even my point. The tuner is just the enabler, the customer the user. That's fine with me.

My point was he cited reasons for not using meth because of CARB, yet creates tunes for "race." What's the difference? Both are not for street use, yet he has problem with one, not the other. That's all. Jeez.

[astris]

Originally Posted by MarvelPhx

It is also illegal to sell an "emission-tampering" product or service to a customer you know will use it on public roads.

People, including most of the market, just don't care is all. However, the businesses should.

Would a shop selling a tune that bypasses O2 sensors for catless operation to registered and licensed street car fall under that category?

Again, I don't care that the tunes are out there or people use them. I've heard great things about some.

[sirploppy]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

No doubt Steve is highly successful and has no need for a Lambo to show it.

We all have a good time poking fun at Shiv: his Gallardo, the swarms of babes, the coalition of the worthy Beta testers -- his overall enviable life style. What could be more fun than a job making BMWs go fast? You guys seem to have a lot of green grass from this side of the fence...

People give Shiv crap about his Lambo not over envy, but in MY OPINION, people see that as funds that could have been put back into the company (i.e. improving customer service). I am sure Steve and Jim coulda afforded one a long time ago...

I Know.. Way OT.

[radgator1]

Originally Posted by astris

Would a shop selling a tune that bypasses O2 sensors for catless operation to registered and licensed street car fall under that category?

Again, I don't care that the tunes are out there or people use them. I've heard great things about some.

Give it a effing break. Six posts on the subject seems like about 5 too many. No shark injector product removes CELs secondary to missing cats PERIOD. He co-developed a product that does under the understanding that it is a RACE ONLY PRODUCT and he is not the one marketing or selling it. That seems to be good enough explanation for pretty much everyone on here but you.

Personally I'm thrilled to see one of the most respected and knowledgable BMW tuners here on this forum. You made your point, do we really have to read it again to understand your opinion on it?

[MacDutchski]

Pure entertainment.

[ween0t]

this is a good thread

[Amir87]

[sales@ESSTuning]

Originally Posted by astris

Would a shop selling a tune that bypasses O2 sensors for catless operation to registered and licensed street car fall under that category?

Again, I don't care that the tunes are out there or people use them. I've heard great things about some.

You know there is a way to deactivate the function and the resulting CEL lamp for "cat monitoring failure or not ready" for aesthetics sake (which is what most people want when they change or remove the cats for race purposes - NO CEL). However, the car will NOT pass emissions inspection. This method doesn't disable the OBD and federal EPA mandated functions for OBD emissions-related operation at all.

But by doing so, the OBD readiness checks will not complete and is therefore unregisterable for street use. If the customer uses that type of software on a street car, he won't pass OBD emission inspections and therefore no tags. You don't know if thats what JC did, and if he did, it is well within the limits off the EPA "Off Road Use" exception. AKA, legal RACE tune.

Your question is valid: If a shop installs software like this on a car that is known to be street driven, it is in violation. But if someone states in writing the car is race only and sends in a DME for the race file, it is not the responsibility of the shop to follow up and verify that. Otherwise, you would *never* see any homegrown race cars with any software at all from the great tuners.

[coaster]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Please tell me what I "don't get"?

Yeeesh...Since when does hp envy manifest itself in e-grumpiness?

Shiv

Shiv,

Do us all a favor and stop responding to the haters and engineer-pretenders on these forums and focus your energy on getting 2.1 ready in a stand-alone package (get rid of that annoying two-step process). I am getting a new 335 in March and I hope you have 2.1 out shortly after.

Success will always attract haters, it's a simple fact of life. Scanning threads for usefull info is getting harder and harder nowdays.

Onward ...

[lawdude]

Originally Posted by sirploppy

People give Shiv crap about his Lambo not over envy, but in MY OPINION, people see that as funds that could have been put back into the company (i.e. improving customer service). I am sure Steve and Jim coulda afforded one a long time ago...

I Know.. Way OT.

It's a conspiracy.

[Garrett]

Originally Posted by astris

LOL, obviously.

You do realize though that the "race" tune is sold to anyone, right? Most all use it for street. That's not even my point. The tuner is just the enabler, the customer the user. That's fine with me.

My point was he cited reasons for not using meth because of CARB, yet creates tunes for "race." What's the difference? Both are not for street use, yet he has problem with one, not the other. That's all. Jeez.

Race tune wasn't a "shark injecter"..? Was it?

[WilyB]

Originally Posted by sirploppy

...people see that as funds that could have been put back into the company ...

The Gallardo purchase is part of an extensive R&D effort to open new markets for VISHNU TUNING.

I know that for a fact as I have myself attempted to get Shiv to buy a 2008 Porsche Cayenne Turbo so that he could produce a nice tune for my wife's car. I must say that Shiv has been resisting my efforts. I guess the Lambo guy must have been more convincing than I was.

Darn Italians...

[stressdoc]

Originally Posted by WilyB

The Gallardo purchase is part of an extensive R&D effort to open new markets for VISHNU TUNING.

I know that for a fact as I have myself attempted to get Shiv to buy a 2008 Porsche Cayenne Turbo so that he could produce a nice tune for my wife's car. I must say that Shiv has been resisting my efforts. I guess the Lambo guy must have been more convincing than I was.

Darn Italians...

So what new extensive R&D effort are the swarms of babes for?

And you wanted Shiv working on a nice tune for your wife?

Piss, I have a crappy sense of humor. Whatever happened to some of the really clever posters? The guys with 325s and 330s. They're to blame for my E90Post addiction, and now that we need them to lighten up the tuner wars, they're gone. We 335 owners are a humorless bunch of Vogons and fire ants, and we bullied the other hapless E9x owners off these forums.

[WilyB]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

So what new extensive R&D effort are the swarms of babes for?

I could tell you, but then I would have to kill you...

[stillclaimndp]

Originally Posted by WilyB

The Gallardo purchase is part of an extensive R&D effort to open new markets for VISHNU TUNING.

I know that for a fact as I have myself attempted to get Shiv to buy a 2008 Porsche Cayenne Turbo so that he could produce a nice tune for my wife's car. I must say that Shiv has been resisting my efforts. I guess the Lambo guy must have been more convincing than I was.

Darn Italians...

he already had a TT porsche... gotta keep a diverse garage, driveway, guest parking... HOA must love SP

[lndshrk]

Originally Posted by astris

You do realize though that the "race" tune is sold to anyone, right?

It is?

Astris, let me give you a word: libel

I have never sold a "race tune" to ANYONE that I do not personally know is
a racer (with minimum BMW CCA or SCCA ticket) and that I do not personally
know is using said tune for a dedicated racing BMW.

Unless you have direct, first-hand knowledge that I have.. and I can assure
everyone that you DO NOT because I don't sell such tunes.. I'd ZIP IT.

US Law is such that I cannot control what another business does. If I find out
that anyone is selling race tunes for street-operated vehicles. And I find that
out with a high level of provability.. I would dial my friends at CARB and the USEPA myself.

Yeah, FRIENDS.

I explain the law (as best I can) to all of the dealers who sell my products and
to all of the businesses I do "co-development" work with as succinctly as I can.

They can follow the advice and the law, or they can become the next "consent decree".

For better or worse - that is NOT my decision.

When you come to me with a modified 335i, on a trailer, with an SCCA ticket in hand
and a nomex suit - and I'll be HAPPY to add methanol injection.

Until that time, you (and anyone else) get NO nachos.

[stressdoc]

I really need to get out to NCal more often.

[stressdoc]

Originally Posted by lndshrk

It is?

Astris, let me give you a word: libel

I have never sold a "race tune" to ANYONE that I do not personally know is
a racer (with minimum BMW CCA or SCCA ticket) and that I do not personally
know is using said tune for a dedicated racing BMW.

Unless you have direct, first-hand knowledge that I have.. and I can assure
everyone that you DO NOT because I don't sell such tunes.. I'd ZIP IT.

US Law is such that I cannot control what another business does. If I find out
that anyone is selling race tunes for street-operated vehicles. And I find that
out with a high level of provability.. I would dial my friends at CARB and the USEPA myself.

Yeah, FRIENDS.

I explain the law (as best I can) to all of the dealers who sell my products and
to all of the businesses I do "co-development" work with as succinctly as I can.

They can follow the advice and the law, or they can become the next "consent decree".

For better or worse - that is NOT my decision.

When you come to me with a modified 335i, on a trailer, with an SCCA ticket in hand
and a nomex suit - and I'll be HAPPY to add methanol injection.

Until that time, you (and anyone else) get NO nachos.

Ouch! Case closed. There still are honest people out there.