[BMWILUVU]

The ride and the engine will not be a bimmer but I saw the car in person too and it looks good. The grill has been worked to a point where it actually looks not too shabby.

[Kimchiguy79]

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

The ride and the engine will not be a bimmer but I saw the car in person too and it looks good. The grill has been worked to a point where it actually looks not too shabby.

Oh for sure, it's nowhere near the performance capabilities against a BMW. But I think the Japanese have long since given up the fight with Germany on performance credentials. Instead, they focus on other elements that could appeal to customers, like design, craftsmanship, etc. It's funny how the spindle grill was hated by so many 9 years ago when it debuted. Now BMW has stolen that mantle with their newer grills. But I'm sure they will eventually be accepted just the same.

[BMWILUVU]

Originally Posted by Kimchiguy79

Oh for sure, it's nowhere near the performance capabilities against a BMW. But I think the Japanese have long since given up the fight with Germany on performance credentials. Instead, they focus on other elements that could appeal to customers, like design, craftsmanship, etc. It's funny how the spindle grill was hated by so many 9 years ago when it debuted. Now BMW has stolen that mantle with their newer grills. But I'm sure they will eventually be accepted just the same.

I won't lie, it looked more solidly built than an M3/M4. It shined quality.

[RM7]

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

I won't lie, it looked more solidly built than an M3/M4. It shined quality.

How does one determine how solid a car is by looks?

[BMWILUVU]

Originally Posted by RM7

How does one determine how solid a car is by looks?

Take a class.

[RM7]

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

Take a class.

What class determines how solid a car is built by looks?

[heavyD^2]

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

I won't lie, it looked more solidly built than an M3/M4. It shined quality.

Hmm. When I saw the car on display it shined slow even compared to an M340i at least by my eyes. I took a class on estimating speed based on the appearance of a car.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by Kimchiguy79

Oh for sure, it's nowhere near the performance capabilities against a BMW. But I think the Japanese have long since given up the fight with Germany on performance credentials. Instead, they focus on other elements that could appeal to customers, like design, craftsmanship, etc. It's funny how the spindle grill was hated by so many 9 years ago when it debuted. Now BMW has stolen that mantle with their newer grills. But I'm sure they will eventually be accepted just the same.

Lexus likes to market its "craftsmanship" but except for the LC/LS their interior materials and overall quality have always been inferior to the BMWs and Audis of the world. And I'm no Lexus hater, I drove one for 6 years. Nice car, but it was without a doubt not built to the same standard as my BMW of a comparable generation. Material quality, panel fitment, paint quality, brakes, suspension/ride, handling, etc. were all inferior and much of this remains the case even today.

Now when it comes to long-term reliability, cost of ownership, and dealership service experience it is a different story altogether. That is why Lexus has such strong customer loyalty and overall success, not because their cars are any better (because they aren't).

[Kimchiguy79]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

Lexus likes to market its "craftsmanship" but except for the LC/LS their interior materials and overall quality have always been inferior to the BMWs and Audis of the world. And I'm no Lexus hater, I drove one for 6 years. Nice car, but it was without a doubt not built to the same standard as my BMW of a comparable generation. Material quality, panel fitment, paint quality, brakes, suspension/ride, handling, etc. were all inferior and much of this remains the case even today.

Now when it comes to long-term reliability, cost of ownership, and dealership service experience it is a different story altogether. That is why Lexus has such strong customer loyalty and overall success, not because their cars are any better (because they aren't).

I don't think that there is any one clear "winner" in the market and no one brand can be considered the best of the best. It's far too subjective with different factors influencing journalistic or owner lead satisfaction. I tend to reject fanboyism (I'm not implying you are displaying any of this) and feel that there is a choice that is right for different people. Every brand will have its advantages and disadvantages but in the in end we as consumers win. We get amazing choices that can lead to enjoyable driving and ownership experiences.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by Kimchiguy79

I don't think that there is any one clear "winner" in the market and no one brand can be considered the best of the best. It's far too subjective with different factors influencing journalistic or owner lead satisfaction. I tend to reject fanboyism (I'm not implying you are displaying any of this) and feel that there is a choice that is right for different people. Every brand will have its advantages and disadvantages but in the in end we as consumers win. We get amazing choices that can lead to enjoyable driving and ownership experiences.

[supra93]

[Kimchiguy79]

Originally Posted by supra93

Great review - also like the one from ThrottleHouse.

[Theruleslawyer]

I think the IS500 is a fairly good deal price wise. Its just a very Lexus car. Sort of lazy transmission, auto only and a bit outdated feeling. I’m kinda left wonder who is this car is for.? Most of the Lexus crowd probably wouldn’t care if this were a turbo 6. Honestly a turbo 6 would give you a better performing car. So the audience probably really wants a v8.

Someone who really specifically wants a v8 probably isn’t going to be put off by dated tech, but they’re going to have more than a passing interest in performance. You can get a mustang mach 1 or a base ZL1 around the same price. Those are going to be much sharper cars even in auto.

I’d think most of the people moving from older german cars with an aversion to the newer turbos would be put off by the dated tech for a new car.

I think it’ll do fine. Its just a bit of an odd duckling.

[kyriian]

Originally Posted by Theruleslawyer

I think the IS500 is a fairly good deal price wise. Its just a very Lexus car. Sort of lazy transmission, auto only and a bit outdated feeling. I’m kinda left wonder who is this car is for.? Most of the Lexus crowd probably wouldn’t care if this were a turbo 6. Honestly a turbo 6 would give you a better performing car. So the audience probably really wants a v8.

Someone who really specifically wants a v8 probably isn’t going to be put off by dated tech, but they’re going to have more than a passing interest in performance. You can get a mustang mach 1 or a base ZL1 around the same price. Those are going to be much sharper cars even in auto.

I’d think most of the people moving from older german cars with an aversion to the newer turbos would be put off by the dated tech for a new car.

I think it’ll do fine. Its just a bit of an odd duckling.

You partially described the person most likely to buy it

-Those who wants a V8, but has to have 4 doors and be more anonymous and subtle. Mustang/Camaro will never have 4 doors, nor be subtle.
-Less Tech, those currently being put off by most other car manufacturers effort to cram more and more tech into their cars.
-A comfortable cruiser
-RWD
-Something a bit left-field from the standard European offerings
-Toyota/Lexus level of reliability and dealer service quality, myth or otherwise

Honestly, its a small market but most F Lexus cars is. I'd love to have it for the commute, but its way out of my price range.

[Kimchiguy79]

Originally Posted by Theruleslawyer

I think the IS500 is a fairly good deal price wise. Its just a very Lexus car. Sort of lazy transmission, auto only and a bit outdated feeling. I’m kinda left wonder who is this car is for.? Most of the Lexus crowd probably wouldn’t care if this were a turbo 6. Honestly a turbo 6 would give you a better performing car. So the audience probably really wants a v8.

Someone who really specifically wants a v8 probably isn’t going to be put off by dated tech, but they’re going to have more than a passing interest in performance. You can get a mustang mach 1 or a base ZL1 around the same price. Those are going to be much sharper cars even in auto.

I’d think most of the people moving from older german cars with an aversion to the newer turbos would be put off by the dated tech for a new car.

I think it’ll do fine. Its just a bit of an odd duckling.

Well turns out that I'm the type of buyer for this car. I'm not like other Lexus buyers since I feel I'm much more enthusiast driven (which is what lead me to BMW) but have accepted the more analog and less high tech experience this car provides. It really is 90% the normally aspirated V8 that makes the car what it is. This car is the definition of niche and that's fine because they won't be making many of them.
As much as I'm annoyed with waiting over 10 months and counting for my M3 xDrive, the IS500 has found a home in our household as the second vehicle that we'd likely keep long term.

[arentz07]

Originally Posted by Kimchiguy79

Well turns out that I'm the type of buyer for this car. I'm not like other Lexus buyers since I feel I'm much more enthusiast driven (which is what lead me to BMW) but have accepted the more analog and less high tech experience this car provides. It really is 90% the normally aspirated V8 that makes the car what it is. This car is the definition of niche and that's fine because they won't be making many of them.
As much as I'm annoyed with waiting over 10 months and counting for my M3 xDrive, the IS500 has found a home in our household as the second vehicle that we'd likely keep long term.

Time to bump an old thread, cause I have some... thoughts, and am curious what you guys think.

I've also got an IS 500. Mine is a 2023 Premium in the Infrared color.





I've had it about 5 months and put around 4100 miles on it in that time. Even though I work from home, I am out here driving it whenever I can think up an excuse to. "I want some fresh air, but I want to drive to the park instead of just walking around the neighborhood." "I think we need some more eggs." "The gas tank is getting low. I could take it to the pump on the way to somewhere else, but I'll do it now while it's not busy." The list goes on.

The engine is just an addictive thing to use. It sounds good, is smooth, is responsive, and has, as a friend put it, "torque for days". While it may not be as torquey as a B58 or something similar, it always has more than enough oomph and responds immediately - no turbo lag, as there is no turbo. And, finding opportunities to hit the 7300-RPM rev limiter is rewarding. It sounds great up high in the revs.

However, all this personality to the engine somewhat belies the personality of the IS 500 as a whole. This car feels right at home being driven sedately. I can keep up with traffic just fine with the engine rumbling away at less than 2000 RPM, and the transmission seems to shift most smoothly when driven like that. The ride is soft, and it doesn't corner particularly flat. It's very comfortable.

When I do drive it hard, it's not exactly a visceral experience, either. Other than the mechanical scream of the engine, there's not a lot going on, aurally. Distant, too, is the steering - though well-weighted and accurate, it's not brimming with information about the road surface. This car is fun to drive, but I don't know I'd say it's imminently thrilling, necessarily. It is more a car that feels confident and composed than outright rowdy. So, you really have to come into this car with expectations that it's merely a fast Lexus IS, not a sports car.

Compared to our G20 330i, the IS 500 can seem a bit dull on initial impressions. Well, it can seem dull if you ignore the cold start sound, that is. What I mean is that the 330i feels a bit more zippy and darty, like a puppy trying to go sniff every random scent they encounter while on a walk. It feels like it wants to go. However, I don't know if the actual experience of driving our 330i M Sport hard on a back road ever really felt super thrilling, either - after all, the IS and 3er are in essentially the same class of vehicle. The 330i is, as a friend put it, a "luxury sedan that will get up and go" - just, in a slightly lower performance tier than the IS 500 - but I could make the same comparison to my departed IS 350.

So, as I wrestle with this conclusion that the IS 500 isn't really super exciting, even if it does put a smile on my face, it makes me wonder if the BMW M340i would have been more exciting or not. I've heard mixed reviews on it, but most seem very positive. Or, would I like something even more sporty, like a Supra, instead? Most of the time, my wife and I don't use the back seats of the IS - I guess you could say buying four-doors is just a habit of mine, by now, whether we need the rear ones or not.

Still, I do love the IS 500. It feels like the V-8 always should have been here. It gives the car that little extra personality it needed to make it more unique and special. I can accept that it's not an IS F, cause really, even when I do take this car up to the mountains, it performs beautifully for my driving style. However, I think I may not be holding onto it forever - but hey, I may just have wandering eyes.

[Burrcold]

Given that you already have a G20 330i, I very much doubt moving to the M340i is going to solve anything. If anything, the M340i feels less darty and light on its feet vs the 330i (it's way more powerful but feels heavier and the steering isn't as good). I would say to stick with your current setup (kind of the best of both worlds going from one car to the other). Or level up and get something very exciting (G80 M3, Supra is a good thought, Giulia Quad?).

[Theruleslawyer]

I can't imagine paying to switch from a is500 to a m340. They are very much the same class of car. I would have picked the m340 to start though. I'd probably be looking for trans tunes if I owned a IS

[nick3753]

Ever consider an e9x M3? I know that opens up some realizability/maintenance cost concerns, but it doesn’t sound like your driving much.

[pbonsalb]

I had an E90 M3 for 10 years. Modded it. Lots of fun from 5500-8500 rpm. Mine was a manual so it took some riding if the gears to extract the performance. The short gearing helped offset the weaker low end torque compared to a larger displacement motor. Lots of personality. But the last E90M3 was made an about decade before the last IS500 and not everyone wants a 10 year old car. I sold mine and bought an F90 M5. It’s a great all around combination of size, luxury, performance, and has decent handling and the AWD puts the power down.

[arentz07]

Originally Posted by Burrcold

Given that you already have a G20 330i, I very much doubt moving to the M340i is going to solve anything. If anything, the M340i feels less darty and light on its feet vs the 330i (it's way more powerful but feels heavier and the steering isn't as good). I would say to stick with your current setup (kind of the best of both worlds going from one car to the other). Or level up and get something very exciting (G80 M3, Supra is a good thought, Giulia Quad?).

The 330i is gone, by the way. My wife wanted an X3, so we traded on one. Personally, I think the X3 made more sense, since she was getting tired of the firm ride in the 330i and wanted something with more cargo space. We've already taken advantage of that by helping her mother move some furniture.

I don't know... a couple days after posting this I already feel like maybe it's best to just invest in modding this IS instead. I can't expect Lexus to make this car rowdy out of the box - but I heard a friend's IS 500 with a custom exhaust a couple days ago, and wow! It's very good to listen to indeed, perhaps a bit loud for my taste.

[supra93]