[Wedge1967]

Originally Posted by tofu-

yeah, so what's your cut?

Why would it matter? Shiv has provided a lot of valuable information to this project. So if he gets something out the time he has put into the project then he deserves it.

[klipseracer]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Will these points shield Rombinhood

Here you go, taking points, which are simply a potential compliment to you, and yes you need them... and you somehow use this subject of YOU getting points and spin it into an intro for justifying a profit margin added to the price of this open source product. If there needs to be a cost, so be it. But chances are, many flashing functions can be done with an ordinary cable that wont be supported.

It appears that some people expect nothing less than everything, for free and right now.

And who is this? Ill assume your not talking to me. But I think we all agree that is a silly claim for anyone to demand, but keep the sympathy, pitty party going to convince people whst your about to say is true too. So you can justify this price, that yet again nobody is objecting to. Seems your compensating for the fact that your charging for this open source software. Ever been to github? Percentage wise, how many cost money? Xdadevs? How much time do those guys spend without charging? Theres a whole lot more of them than rombinhoods, charging money for an open source project would be abnormal. If your aiming for finished and packaged products, this isn't an open source project. We will very unlikely see squat on github or the code to the flashing software used. Perhaps the maps will be wide open, but thats not my interest here.

Few developers can support such an expectation when they are shelling out their own resources, time and skill to make a product.

Look on the above websites I mentioned. Theres lots of them and you must be blind. Im one of them.

People should take an honest assessment of their own contributions before being so quick to judge those of others. I hope I'm not coming off harsh here as that is not my intention. I've just seen firsthand what has been involved in getting this project to its near-release state. It's probably not something I would have attempted to do alone so I'm quick to give credit to where it is due.

So you are basically saying I have no contributions to the community and have no basis to criticize someone making a profit..

First off, I'm not criticizing anything hes doing, why so defensive? When did I ask it for free or now? You are twisting my simple request into a way to justify a price I'm not objecting. I think there are many tuners who are quick to do whats best for themselves rather than their customers. You are a business not a charity. I get it. But clinging onto open source is shaky ground when your selling a package. Thats like saying your pocede firmware is free and open source but the hardware will cost you money. Oh wait, that's basically how it works without the open source firmware. We can only hope it is in fact open and not baked too deeply into another piece of hardware. If you were actively involved with open source communities, you would realize many developers do donate their time. Extensive time. They take donations for their efforts. So don't twist open source "normalities" into something it normally isn't. Im not against charging for ones efforts. I am against stating something is open source when its really not. I also dislike the fact that youve tried to make my post into something its not and use it as some kind of justification for something im not objecting. Not to be harsh, but you go too far, too often, and certainly not for free.

Just my .02c

[klipseracer]

Maybe some people should judge how ethical their own marketing practices are before they go and try promoting another individuals cause that they are apparently not partners on. Rombinhood, having shiv do any verbal promoting here is going to get you backlash. You were doing a great job without mr mouthpiece. I'm interested to know your prices.

[Dark9T]

Originally Posted by klipseracer

Here you go, taking points, which are simply a potential compliment to you, and yes you need them... and you somehow use this subject of YOU getting points and spin it into an intro for justifying a profit margin added to the price of this open source product. If there needs to be a cost, so be it. But chances are, many flashing functions can be done with an ordinary cable that wont be supported.


And who is this? Ill assume your not talking to me. But I think we all agree that is a silly claim for anyone to demand, but keep the sympathy, pitty party going to convince people whst your about to say is true too. So you can justify this price, that yet again nobody is objecting to. Seems your compensating for the fact that your charging for this open source software. Ever been to github? Percentage wise, how many cost money? Xdadevs? How much time do those guys spend without charging? Theres a whole lot more of them than rombinhoods, charging money for an open source project would be abnormal. If your aiming for finished and packaged products, this isn't an open source project. We will very unlikely see squat on github or the code to the flashing software used. Perhaps the maps will be wide open, but thats not my interest here.


Look on the above websites I mentioned. Theres lots of them and you must be blind. Im one of them.



So you are basically saying I have no contributions to the community and have no basis to criticize someone making a profit..

First off, I'm not criticizing anything hes doing, why so defensive? When did I ask it for free or now? You are twisting my simple request into a way to justify a price I'm not objecting. I think there are many tuners who are quick to do whats best for themselves rather than their customers. You are a business not a charity. I get it. But clinging onto open source is shaky ground when your selling a package. Thats like saying your pocede firmware is free and open source but the hardware will cost you money. Oh wait, that's basically how it works without the open source firmware. We can only hope it is in fact open and not baked too deeply into another piece of hardware. If you were actively involved with open source communities, you would realize many developers do donate their time. Extensive time. They take donations for their efforts. So don't twist open source "normalities" into something it normally isn't. Im not against charging for ones efforts. I am against stating something is open source when its really not. I also dislike the fact that youve tried to make my post into something its not and use it as some kind of justification for something im not objecting. Not to be harsh, but you go too far, too often, and certainly not for free.

Just my .02c

[Lunatic Fringe]

The only thing holding this platform back are self-righteous blowhards like Klipedpenis and Tofunuts. Quit trolling guys. Shiv tunes for a living. When people start demanding you do your job for free, please come back and let us know how you feel then.

FYI, forum superstars like yourselves inspired my screen name.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by Lunatic Fringe

The only thing holding this platform back are self-righteous blowhards like Klipedpenis and Tofunuts. Quit trolling guys. Shiv tunes for a living. When people start demanding you do your job for free, please come back and let us know how you feel then.

FYI, forum superstars like yourselves inspired my screen name.

Lol... It's ok. Their shtick had gotten pretty predictable. And if I weren't driving through the French Alps right now, I might even take the time to correct klipseracer's misplaced assumptions. But like the rest of us, he will have to wait for several more days before spazzing out again

[sA x sKy]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Lol... It's ok. Their shtick had gotten pretty predictable. And if I weren't driving through the French Alps right now, I might even take the time to correct klipseracer's misplaced assumptions. But like the rest of us, he will have to wait for several more days before spazzing out again

I saw your facebook posts..I'm jealous!

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by sA x sKy

I saw your facebook posts..I'm jealous!

Just posted up new pics. I have never seem a more beautiful region! Now driving back to northern Italy which isn't so bad either

[vladster]

You have to continue to Slovenia and to Adriatic coast. Here's really nice

[A418t81]

Originally Posted by klipseracer

And who is this? Ill assume your not talking to me. But I think we all agree that is a silly claim for anyone to demand, but keep the sympathy, pitty party going to convince people whst your about to say is true too. So you can justify this price, that yet again nobody is objecting to. Seems your compensating for the fact that your charging for this open source software. Ever been to github? Percentage wise, how many cost money? Xdadevs? How much time do those guys spend without charging? Theres a whole lot more of them than rombinhoods, charging money for an open source project would be abnormal. If your aiming for finished and packaged products, this isn't an open source project. We will very unlikely see squat on github or the code to the flashing software used. Perhaps the maps will be wide open, but thats not my interest here.


Look on the above websites I mentioned. Theres lots of them and you must be blind. Im one of them.

While I can understand where you are coming from on a few of your points, the fact remains that the open source ECU tuning market really started with the Evo about 7 or 8 years ago and it wasn't done your way. Back then the software, ROM definitions, and flashing capabilities were all included, but you had to purchase a specific cable for around $100. It was not truly "open source" as the flashing routine, etc were all closed source, but it allowed anybody to flash anything....and people with the skills and time to discover, define, and integrate any other maps in the ROM that they wanted to on their own time.

While Rombinhood's software may not be truly open source, that doesn't mean that it isn't going to revolutionize the flashing community here, just like it did in other markets. Stop bitching about it and be glad that there is another option which will allow you and me infinitely more freedom than the ATR. I guarantee you that Cobb will keep a close eye on the open source scene and make improvements to their own software based on what all is discovered and implemented once this thing is up and rolling over here. The collective might of a lot of smart people donating time to the project always eclipses anything a couple of over-worked, and underpaid engineers put together in some back room.

[AYF80]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Just posted up new pics. I have never seem a more beautiful region! Now driving back to northern Italy which isn't so bad either

Nice man, When are you expected back? i think my car needs you.

[Dave W.]

I just want to tune my car, I couldn't care less about reinventing the program that makes it happen as long as it works right.

[Wedge1967]

Originally Posted by Lunatic Fringe

Klipedpenis
Tofunuts

[tofu-]

Originally Posted by Lunatic Fringe

The only thing holding this platform back are self-righteous blowhards like Klipedpenis and Tofunuts. Quit trolling guys. Shiv tunes for a living. When people start demanding you do your job for free, please come back and let us know how you feel then.

FYI, forum superstars like yourselves inspired my screen name.

really? the guy writes a well thought out reply regarding what open source really is, and how shiv's involvement seems a bit fishy, and all you can come up with are penis jokes?


people like you are the reason why this guy is still even in business.

[Rombinhood@OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by tofu-

really? the guy writes a well thought out reply regarding what open source really is, and how shiv's involvement seems a bit fishy, and all you can come up with are penis jokes?


people like you are the reason why this guy is still even in business.

May I add something here? When I first started this project, I needed help with everything BUT the read/write protocol. Not one single vendor, except Shiv@vishnu, offered to help me. In fact, a few of them actively tried to halt this project in ways that aren't worth mentioning. On the other hand, Shiv provided me with a complete list of map definitions for every DME software version he collected over the past 2 years. Without that information, this project wouldn't have gotten very far. Nor would the final product be very useful to most people. So how exactly is his involvement "fishy"? So I'm not sure what axe you have to grind against him and frankly, I don't care. It's the internet and everyone is entitled to their opinions, as illogical as they may be. I don't like to get involved in interpersonal debates as they are almost always a waste of everyone's time. But in this case, I'm politely requesting that you and klipseracer take your beef elsewhere. They aren't welcome here.

As for everyone else who has encouraged this project, I appreciate your support

[black335i]

I think the project is cool

[Lunatic Fringe]

Originally Posted by tofu-

really? the guy writes a well thought out reply regarding what open source really is, and how shiv's involvement seems a bit fishy, and all you can come up with are penis jokes?


people like you are the reason why this guy is still even in business.

Wishing the demise of someone's business is narcissism exemplified. You clearly have some larger issues to deal with sir.

P(enis)S: Genatalia jokes make the world go round . Now lets get this thread back on track. Look forward to hearing updates from Rombinhood. Thanks for all the awesome work you're doing!

[themyst]

I am withholding my unbiased opinion for when the pricing and hardware are released.

[_ink]

Bring on July 4th launch!

[maxwell600]

Originally Posted by black335i

I think the project is cool

Oh youuuu

[paulguma]

while it may not be truly open source. It looks like it might be a cheaper alternative to cobb ap and accesstuner.

[Continue5]

Open source does not necessarily have to mean free, more of a 'nothing is hidden' solution that people can experiment with. Even if there is a price i'm certain it's going to be no-where near 700$ like cobb is.