[amullo]

As we are talking lights, I did a test on my Golf with and without the auxillary lights on that.
The car is a -14 Golf GT with factory Xenons and two Hella FF200 Auxillary lights (like the ones behind my grill, except in white and xenon equipped 35w per light.

Here is what that car looks like with the two auxillary highbeams mounted


And the result
NOTE: The result in a picture isnt really representative. The added lenght and above all WIDTH of the beam including the auxlights is huge compared to factory highbeam.
Halvljus = Lowbeam
Helljus = Highbeam
Helljus + 2 = Highbeam + the two auxillary lights
The first tree on the left is about 150meters/165 yards away
The overgrown "hilly" dirt pile on the right is about 200-250 meters (220-260 yards) away
The side of the barn is roughly 400 meters or 440 yards away.

[Lotus99]

Originally Posted by amullo

1. Signal to turn on -> point 86 on relay
This one you splice into the brown/yellow wire on pin 5 off the headlights connector, any side. The wire is thin, only 0.35mm2/22 gauge. I stripped the insulation with a sharp knife and soldered the lead into place. Unsure of if the 5-series has the same wiring, but the Germans (being Germans) like their stuff "In Ordnüng" so it probably is. PIN 5 on the connector (Top right or bottom left, depends how you hold the connector)

But I have say that those LED pods look pretty big and chunky. If I went for something like a numberplate mount on my BMW, I´d probably opt for smaller round lights like the Hella compact 100 or similar. Maybe the Australian Lightforce 140 lance could work aswell (those are really good). Then again, Once you have the wiring done and the mount in place, its easy enough to fool around with diffrent lights and such. Maybe even install some quick connects for the electrics so you can take the lights off during the summer.

Great info again, thank you! The most important / trickiest will be the tapping of the signal wire for the high beam. If my setup isn't the same as yours, again, I assume the shop should be able to easily figure out which wire to use? Or I should research that ahead of time on the 5 series forums?

As far as the lights go, why do you say they are bulky? They are 3" by 3" (or about 8 cm by 8 cm). Which is about half the FF200's which have a 15 cm width?

Besides a license plate mount, I might even just get one like the Carr Light Wing, to get them higher up, as someone on a lighting forum suggested to me. Though it seems to suit an SUV more than my 535 wagon... Or do you think just above the license plate is high enough for what I want to do?

[Lotus99]

Originally Posted by amullo

The car is a -14 Golf GT with factory Xenons and two Hella FF200 Auxillary lights (like the ones behing my grill, except in white)

And the result
NOTE: The result in a picture isnt really representative. The added lenght and above all WIDTH of the beam including the auxlights is huge compared to factory highbeam.
Halvljus = Lowbeam
Helljus = Highbeam
Helljus + 2 = Highbeam + the two auxillary lights
The first tree on the left is about 150meters/165 yards away
The overgrown "hilly" dirt pile on the right is about 200-250 meters (220-260 yards) away
The side of the barn is roughly 400 meters or 440 yards away.

Wow, seriously??? That's a HUGE improvement! So these are just the 55W halogen bulbs in the FF200's?

And I'm surprised if you didn't get the blueish tint on your VW that they're as "white" colour as they are against your HID's. What Kelvin bulb colour is that? I thought halogens are like 3500?

You have got me thinking though maybe I should just go your route, and put them in my grills... Or on a light bar light in my pic above. In which case, it would totally open up my options in terms of which lights to get.

Remind me again why you didn't go HID on your aux lights?

[amullo]

Id stay with the numberplate mount if I where you, just like you indicate. Adds options to fool around with diffrent lighting systems. The LEDs seemed chunky, but maybe I misread the pic. I you like the look, Im sure they will fit well. On the electrical, it should be easy for the shop to detective their way to the right lead. It goes positive on highbeam.

The lights on the Golf are actually OEM 35w xenon equipped FF200's. Got them at a great price, sorry about misaing that in my description. The lights on the BMW have 2x100W halogen Osram rally bulbs, not colored since the bluish glas takes the light up to about 4300K. The output is roughly equal as it seems. Still havent had a chance to do pics on the bmw yet.

I'll take some pics off the bmw as soon as I can, but Ill say this.. The stock highbeam on the VW is worse then the bmw. It needed those auxlights badly.

[Lotus99]

I take it you mean the first number plate mount option by Rigid that's more discrete, and not the second one by Carr (it also mounts using the number plate screws).

If I don't go LED and maybe even mount them behind my kidney grills like you, any reason (besides cost) I shouldn't look at HID vs. halogens?

The light output of the Hella FF50 halogens seems amazing, in fact, better than the FF200's, strangely enough, where it looks like you're getting 3 lux at 250 m vs. around 200 m (where the light green colour changes to blue)? Why is that? I like them also because they're not as tall and would still work on the license plate mount maybe, if I don't put them in my grills.

These are taken from Hella:

FF50



FF200

[amullo]

Yeah, The rigid mount was the one I meant. I, being in europe, have wider licenseplates then in the US and Canada, that mount wouldnt work here. The mounts we can get at the local version of autozone are wider and are build to mount 2 or 3 auxlights like on the 5-series I linked to earlier.

I went with the grillmount because I felt it was a cool way to get the auxlights out of the way and also abit "cool to be diffrent". It will also make it harder for theifs to get at them, and they dont get crunched when some old lady cant parallel park. Ive always liked the beam that the FF200 lights put out, Long enough and still wide enough to be useful. Had I gone with larger lights, I would have put them on the outside on a numberplate mount.

HID, LED and Halogens are not so diffrent, but the characteristcs of each have an impact when the weather is extreme in the winter.
*Halogens
Pro: Cheap to buy, bulbs can be replaced, the emit heat, so in extreme snowstorms, the heat of the bulb will still melt the oncoming snow, leaving the light clear.
Con: They emit heat (for drivers in warm areas), not as much output watt for watt compared to LED and Xenon/HID

*Xenon/HID
Pro: Loads of light, emit enough heat to melt a "normal" amount of snow, great color temperature. only use about half the power of halogens.
Cons: costly when OEM fitted (like the FF200Xenon is x10 the price of the halogen model), Ballasts must be mounted and secured. bulbs are costly to replace.

*LED
Pro: Very energy efficient. Good temperature of light, sturdy, no ballasts
Con: Not very many manufacturers can actually make them "throw" the light. You see nice graphs, but how about a real life picture? The really good ones from Hella or Bosch cost alot! Like twice what a good factory HID aux.light costs. They dont emit heat, ecpect to stop and clear the auxlights from snow and ice in extreme weather.

Those pics from Hella doesnt make sense to me. The FF 50-75-100-200-300 series all debuted together about 10-15 years ago, so no diffrence in that.
The local website for the FF50 lists a range of 300 meters for x1 lux. The pic you put up seems to be for the Jumbo 320 auxlight, but maybe someone at Hella made a mistake? See the local version of Hella.com http://hella.se/Produkter/Extraljus/ Just click on a light to get size, look and outputThe diffrence is that while the FF200 uses H3 (and on the website is tested with 55ww, not 100W) the FF50 uses H7 bulbs.

Ive seen all Hellas auxlights in real life and it "does not compute" that the FF50 could be better then the FF200, simply because its about half the size. Its not uncommon to see cars here with 3 or 4 FF50 lights mounted on a lightbar (Extraljusramp) under the numberplate and tests by ViBilägare carmagazine shows those bars to give a wide spread of light out to about 250meters, when mounted as 4 side-by-side. Too bad the FF50 isnt large enough to accomodate a xenon bulb. Might be an option if you want it discreet.
http://hella.se/Produkter/Extraljus/...4FF-50-4-Blue/
Mounted

[Lotus99]

Yeah, I think you're right about the lights. Doesn't make sense the FF50's would put out more light.

As far as the license plate mount goes, another company sells one (VisionX) for half the price of Rigid, which I might go with:


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1 - But here's another idea someone on another forum told me, that I'd never even considered. Apparently, Philips makes these HID bulbs that are 50% more light? Can it be possible?


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http://www.mea.philips.com/c/car-lam...specifications

They put out 3200 ±450 lumens or so, and they claim to have 50% more light.

I wonder what my OEM bulbs put out? On Philips site, they only sell 3 D1S bulbs. The "replacement" ones, which I presume are OEM spec, seem to have the same lumens though?

http://www.mea.philips.com/c/car-lam...specifications
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2 - Also, just to understand, You put 100W bulbs in a 55W housing of your FF200's? And you've got no issues? So if the specs you quoted above are for 55W bulbs (3 lux at 280 meters), then what would they be with 100W bulbs???

3 - Also, can you put a link to your 100W bulbs?

4 - Lastly, I called my local audio shop thinking it would be easy, as we discussed, but they said they don’t want to touch it, even by tapping the signal wire for the relay, it can trip the CANBUS... Really? You've got no issues with that I take it.

5 - Oh, and I'm wondering, the wire you tapped, is it like this one? I think you said it's super small.... I found this pic on the 5 series forum, though I think the owner has a 2008 5 series, but these look like regular wires to me...
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[Yozh]

I wonder if Black Magics would fit behind the grilles. Probably not.
Ultimately, though, I would be retrofitting these 50mm modules instead of a cornering light and then rewire fog lights to act as such. If cracking headlight is not in favour, then ditch the fog lights (especially if you have m-tech front) and swap with these or just hook these up right beside. And actually H9s would be great as Xenon needs warm up time and H9 is already at 2100lm.

[amullo]

Originally Posted by Lotus99

Yeah, I think you're right about the lights. Doesn't make sense the FF50's would put out more light.

As far as the license plate mount goes, another company sells one (VisionX) for half the price of Rigid, which I might go with:


.
.
.
1 - But here's another idea someone on another forum told me, that I'd never even considered. Apparently, Philips makes these HID bulbs that are 50% more light? Can it be possible?


.
.
.
http://www.mea.philips.com/c/car-lam...specifications

They put out 3200 ±450 lumens or so, and they claim to have 50% more light.

I wonder what my OEM bulbs put out? On Philips site, they only sell 3 D1S bulbs. The "replacement" ones, which I presume are OEM spec, seem to have the same lumens though?

http://www.mea.philips.com/c/car-lam...specifications
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.
.
2 - Also, just to understand, You put 100W bulbs in a 55W housing of your FF200's? And you've got no issues? So if the specs you quoted above are for 55W bulbs (3 lux at 280 meters), then what would they be with 100W bulbs???

3 - Also, can you put a link to your 100W bulbs?

4 - Lastly, I called my local audio shop thinking it would be easy, as we discussed, but they said they don’t want to touch it, even by tapping the signal wire for the relay, it can trip the CANBUS... Really? You've got no issues with that I take it.

5 - Oh, and I'm wondering, the wire you tapped, is it like this one? I think you said it's super small.... I found this pic on the 5 series forum, though I think the owner has a 2008 5 series, but these look like regular wires to me...
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1. Those vision X ledbars are alright for near car illumination, not as good for +200meters. The mount itself looks solid indeed! You could hang some lightforce blitz or Hella Luminator lamps on that!
Those upgraded xenonbulbs look REAL intresting! I found a local supplier. BMW uses d1s lamps dont they? Im going to get some. Looks like upgraded bulbs finally made it to xenon. Halogens have long had osram Nightbreaker or Sylvania silverstars. Thanks for that!

2. The FF200 is rated for 100w bulbs. The meassured 284meters your referencing is using 100w bulbs. 55w gets 241 meters and only 9meters wide at 150 meters.

3. Got them off ebay. Just Search for 100w H3 Osram
Ill see if I can link the seller. Make sure to buy Osram or Phillips.

4. CANBUS is on our cars, but not for this. I had no issues and several other boardmembers on the Swedish version of bimmerforums havent had any problems. The only ones who couldnt make it work where F30 owners with the lightassist active beam that cancels highbeam automatically.

5. Nope, mine did NOT look like that. The thin signalwire is about double that Gauge at around 22 Gauge. That connector seems to be for a car with halogen headlights, not Xenons. I will take a pic of my connector tomorrow and post it..

[Lotus99]

Thanks for the reply again. The more I think about it, the more I'm now leaning towards trying these X-treme Vision bulbs. Simple, since I don't have to monkey about with more wiring and finding a shop to do them for me, and although it's just as expensive as the standalone FF200 route (cheaper probably if I take into account the few hours of labour for putting in FF200's), it's a nice clean setup, and I get to enjoy longer beams with my adaptive headlights too.

I just hope they live up to their claims! I'll report back when I do.

I've got to find out now how hard it is to replace bulbs in the E60... I read somewhere you need to take the headlights out.
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PS Did I read correctly that on your VW, you used the HID version of the FF200's, that you took these comparison pics from?

[amullo]

Yeah, Im looking at adding either the Phillips Xtreme vision OR the Osram Nightbreaker unlimited Xenarc upgrade xenon bulbs on mine aswell! It will help both lowbeam and highbeam. Its intresting that Phillips says the bulb will add 20meters. I guess that has to be on highbeam? Thats not THAT much, but still good for just a bulb upgrade.

And YES the pic is taken using the Hella HID FF200 Auxillary light version. Hella still offers them, but FF200 in halogen cost me $70 US for a pair and a pair of FF200 in HID/xenon are $700US!
The HID version uses 35w ballasts and bulbs and the ones I have on the VW I won on the local version off ebay for ~$200.

I certainly understand you going for the upgraded bulbs if your not comfortable doing the electrics. Just be assured that doing it isnt actually hard, anyone who has installed an aftermarket electrical item like lights or an amp could handle it. And the light you get on highbeam is.. Intoxicating. Ive had aux lights on all my cars so far and you get really addicted to having a whole lot of light.

Ill post pic of the connector and wiring anyhow, forgot to take a pic today. Let me know how the bulbs work out! Im looking at them aswell.. Looks like ~$330 for a pair of either. I might opt for nightbreakers. Had Osrams before and they kick ass.

[Lotus99]

Yeah, it's interesting. For value, you can't beat the FF200's like you've got them set up. I'd be spending a similar amount of money, and getting a 10-20% bump, vs. your 50%+ bump...

On this other forum I was asking about this project (candlepowerforums.com), the mod there was saying the Philips are the best.

But as I started reading up on the Philips Xtreme Vision bulbs, I came across this testing done. I don't know how much faith to put into the tester's results (he seems to own a website called Retrofit Source), but the Nightbreaker bulbs have a significant advantage over the Xtreme ones.

http://www.hidplanet.com/forums/show...-D2S-Bulb-Test

Osram 66240 Standard - 785 lux
Osram 66240 CBI - 805 lux
Osram 66240XNB (Nightbreaker) - 863 lux

Philips 85122 Standard - 698 lux
Philips 85122WX - 586 lux
Philips 85122XV (Xtreme Vision) - Picture Unavailable - 763 lux
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I found the Xtremes on Amazon US (but a different seller) at a really good price - $200, which seems too good to be true, so I was a bit worried, though the seller says they're originals. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00MU37OEA

Powerbulbs.com and Amazon UK (the seller) both have them listed for about $150 US each.

[amullo]

Originally Posted by Lotus99

Yeah, it's interesting. For value, you can't beat the FF200's like you've got them set up. I'd be spending a similar amount of money, and getting a 10-20% bump, vs. your 50%+ bump...

On this other forum I was asking about this project (candlepowerforums.com), the mod there was saying the Philips are the best.

But as I started reading up on the Philips Xtreme Vision bulbs, I came across this testing done. I don't know how much faith to put into the tester's results (he seems to own a website called Retrofit Source), but the Nightbreaker bulbs have a significant advantage over the Xtreme ones.

http://www.hidplanet.com/forums/show...-D2S-Bulb-Test

Osram 66240 Standard - 785 lux
Osram 66240 CBI - 805 lux
Osram 66240XNB (Nightbreaker) - 863 lux

Philips 85122 Standard - 698 lux
Philips 85122WX - 586 lux
Philips 85122XV (Xtreme Vision) - Picture Unavailable - 763 lux
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.
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I found the Xtremes on Amazon US (but a different seller) at a really good price - $200, which seems too good to be true, so I was a bit worried, though the seller says they're originals. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00MU37OEA

Powerbulbs.com and Amazon UK (the seller) both have them listed for about $150 US each.

Well.. Id be careful if the price seems very low.
Givven the labour involved in changing the bulbs and the actual lifespan of the bulbs themselves, ~$100 more isnt that big a deal counted over the years the bulb lives in the car.
Im going with nighbreakers givven your findings. On both my cars.

I wonder how much diffrence it will be compared to "stock" lighting. Im guessing it´ll be a darn sight better!

[amullo]

Originally Posted by Yozh

I wonder if Black Magics would fit behind the grilles. Probably not.
Ultimately, though, I would be retrofitting these 50mm modules instead of a cornering light and then rewire fog lights to act as such. If cracking headlight is not in favour, then ditch the fog lights (especially if you have m-tech front) and swap with these or just hook these up right beside. And actually H9s would be great as Xenon needs warm up time and H9 is already at 2100lm.

Attachment 1090023

Not sure about what "Black magics" your talking about.
Hella´s 1000 blackmagic? Those would work, but require abit more job.

http://www.myhellalights.com/index.p...-magic-series/

Here are a pair of NBB 175 as reference. A friend of mine´s E90

[amullo]

This was pretty cool..
http://www.hella.com/MicroSite/elive...x.html?lang=se

[Lotus99]

Originally Posted by amullo

Well.. Id be careful if the price seems very low.
Givven the labour involved in changing the bulbs and the actual lifespan of the bulbs themselves, ~$100 more isnt that big a deal counted over the years the bulb lives in the car.
Im going with nighbreakers givven your findings. On both my cars.

I wonder how much diffrence it will be compared to "stock" lighting. Im guessing it´ll be a darn sight better!

If you do find any testing done comparing those two bulbs, do you mind sharing it? The moderator on the forum I posted those results on didn't have much faith in the guy doing the testing, so he didn't think the difference would be as high... He seems to prefer Philips to Osram brand he says, but I'd prefer to see some objective results before deciding.

[335iNavyGuy]

This is interesting but i dont know how i feel about it.

What about an LED strip in each side?

[amullo]

Here is where I spliced in to get the signal to the relay.

Far right, top row. You can just about make out the black shrinkwrap.

[Lotus99]

Thanks, how did you determine that was the wire? Do you have to strip it a bit to test to see if voltage goes thru it when you use the high beams if I have to isolate the wire myself?

[amullo]

I had actually asked on a swedish bmw forum if anyone knew which wire it was and got multiple replies that THIS was the right one.

To confirm, I stripped the insulation slightly and, while the plug was plugged in, tested it with a voltmeter (didnt want to trip any bulb fault). Sure enough the volt meter jumped and held at 12V when i flipped the highbeam on. So the lead turns "on" with highbeam and "off" on low/park/off.

[amullo]

Originally Posted by Lotus99

If you do find any testing done comparing those two bulbs, do you mind sharing it? The moderator on the forum I posted those results on didn't have much faith in the guy doing the testing, so he didn't think the difference would be as high... He seems to prefer Philips to Osram brand he says, but I'd prefer to see some objective results before deciding.

Got some today.

[Lotus99]

Hot diggity, you're fast! Are you going to put one in and test it against the OEM bulb?

I was thinking of doing that, and maybe covering one headlight, seeing how one bulb is, and then covering the other headlight, to compare one bulb to another, but I don't know if that'll work.

Worst case, I'll do a before / after comparison hopefully somehow.

Let us know how it goes!