Wastegate Rattle On Acceleration?

kiteboy · 09-03-2014, 04:07 PM

in my case, today 160 000 km, both turbos had been replaced at 117 000km because too much rattle on deceleration from 4000 rpm to 650

after replacement by new oem turbos, noticed only a little rattle around only 3000rpm just on deceleration (between 3100 and 3000 rpm ) with oem program bmw.

from dealer bmw it could be normal....

335NJ · 09-03-2014, 05:59 PM

So, under Speedo 10, Tach should be 0-5 to adjust for WG rattle.

I guess starting at 1, and work my way up until WG rattle seems tamed as best as possible? I have never read how to properly use that function.

DuDai · 09-03-2014, 06:58 PM

No, slowly work your way down the rpm range until its no longer heard. Do note the lower you go, the more lag you will experience though. So you want to be the highest you can be without rattle so there is less lag. Also the Speedo on 12 adjusts wgdc which can also affect rattle and pulsating feeling on light throttle.

335NJ · 09-03-2014, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuDai

No, slowly work your way down the rpm range until its no longer heard. Do note the lower you go, the more lag you will experience though. So you want to be the highest you can be without rattle so there is less lag. Also the Speedo on 12 adjusts wgdc which can also affect rattle and pulsating feeling on light throttle.

It says "Selection 0-5 are multiplied by 2". I'm curious what they mean by this?

DuDai · 09-03-2014, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335NJ

It says "Selection 0-5 are multiplied by 2". I'm curious what they mean by this?

Wastegate values are from 0-100. So a setting at 1000rpm=wastegate setting of 20. 2000rpm=40 and so on and so forth. 4000rpm = stock which is 80.

335NJ · 09-03-2014, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuDai

Wastegate values are from 0-100. So a setting at 1000rpm=wastegate setting of 20. 2000rpm=40 and so on and so forth. 4000rpm = stock which is 80.

I played with the settings a bit. When I clicked into the settings they were set like this Speedo-10 Tach-3000 + Speedo-12 Tach-2800

Per a thread on N54Tech, I did what someone else did. Speedo-10 Tach-5000 + Speedo 12 Tach about 3300.

I notice significantly less raspy/rattling noise under low RPM. Right around 3000-3300 is where the rattle is still pretty bad. Any ideas for further tuning?

DuDai · 09-03-2014, 08:11 PM

That I think would be changed via the menu 12. I'd say adjust that one. I'm using a setting of 1400rpm for menu 10 and 2500rpm for menu 12.

335NJ · 09-03-2014, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuDai

That I think would be changed via the menu 12. I'd say adjust that one. I'm using a setting of 1400rpm for menu 10 and 2500rpm for menu 12.

I'll just have to tinker with it until it's a s good as it'll get. I've read that the lower they're set, the higher the lag, but more pronounced exhaust note too.

DuDai · 09-03-2014, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335NJ

I'll just have to tinker with it until it's a s good as it'll get. I've read that the lower they're set, the higher the lag, but more pronounced exhaust note too.

That would be correct.

BMW-SRT · 10-24-2014, 12:57 PM

Any of you guys try a manual adjustment of the wastegate rod? I've done it before for the "top" turbo and rattle went away but now my lower one is rattling really bad.
Anyone ever manually adjust the lower wastegate rod? or is their a "how-to" on how to do it?

ferocity02 · 10-24-2014, 01:34 PM

I have the same rattle on light-moderate acceleration, quiet on decel, and concluded that the JB4 was causing it. Without the JB4 it is dead silent. Something about how the JB4 controls the wastegates is causing the rattle.

I have adjusted menus 10 and 12 until my fingers bled and couldn't eliminate it. Even with brand new turbos I get the ratting, even worse than the old turbos.

Lux3m35i · 10-24-2014, 02:20 PM

I also have rattle on light acceleration. When looking at the boost level the rattle appears at no boost or just before, for example while driving up a small hill. I don't have that noise with OEM downpipes with cat, only with my catless AR DPs. I have a lot of clearance, so it's not hitting against the sub-frame etc.

I checked the wastegates with a vacuum pump, the wastegate should be fully closed at 5,9Hg but mine don't close at all, even at 7-8Hg ( I stopped at this point because it didn't move anymore). I suppose that the wastegate fully closes when backpressure builds up and helps closing the wastegate. It's also how the car feels.. on low RPM you feel kind of lag.

I will try 2 things to fix the problem. I bought an other set of OEM DPs and removed the cat. If this set of catless DPs will eliminate the noise, the noise is caused by the AR DPs, probably because of the missing flex pipe.
Secondly I will try to adjust the wastegate actuator, when I manage to turn the nut in that tiny space..

jeeve.x · 10-24-2014, 02:23 PM

I tried adjusting the values in menus 10 and 12 as recommended earlier in this thread.

Worked to bring down the rattle, but it's still there. Funny thing is, I set the values really low one time, I actually had rattle on deceleration as well.

ferocity02 · 10-24-2014, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeeve.x

I tried adjusting the values in menus 10 and 12 as recommended earlier in this thread.

Worked to bring down the rattle, but it's still there. Funny thing is, I set the values really low one time, I actually had rattle on deceleration as well.

Burger is really cryptic about how Menus 10 and 12 actually work. Part of me thinks that even they don't know, or they are too lazy to explain it. Knowing how they work would certainly help us to dial in each setting for our particular rattle.

But, from what little information they provide, it sounds like Menu 10 helps to reduce decel rattle, while menu 12 helps reduce accel rattle. And I think both settings are coupled to some degree, so if you change one, you can expect the effect of the other to change as well. Furthermore, the limits of one menu depend on the other. I haven't figured this part out yet.

But I'm thinking of switching to COBB because the rattle that the JB4 is causing is embarrassing. I constantly get people asking if there is something wrong with my car.

EscapeYourMind · 10-24-2014, 05:52 PM

I'm having the same problem. I previously had the wastegate rattle problem where they would rattle really bad on deceleration (based on the SIB this is one of the things the dealer looks for when replacing turbos). I got both turbos replaced about 4 months ago under the extended warranty.

Now I am getting a similar rattle on acceleration only (nothing on deceleration). Boost seems to build fine, but like everyone else, it is really annoying/embarrassing.

I have a JB4 and have tried messing with menu 10 but haven't had any luck. Would love to be able to find a solution to this problem.

09-03-2014, 04:07 PM	#23
kiteboy Lieutenant 13 Rep 423 Posts Drives: E92 Stage 2 BR Performance Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: France iTrader: (0)	in my case, today 160 000 km, both turbos had been replaced at 117 000km because too much rattle on deceleration from 4000 rpm to 650 after replacement by new oem turbos, noticed only a little rattle around only 3000rpm just on deceleration (between 3100 and 3000 rpm ) with oem program bmw. from dealer bmw it could be normal.... __________________ 335i Pack M Stage 2 BR Performance 403,5 hp 582n.m/Bilstein B14 pss/R&B PVC2 valve/K&N air filter/Spearco FMIC/pre cata empty/EBC Redstuff,aviation hose, BMW Performance exhaust, Charge pipe Evolution Racewerks, Forge DVs
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09-03-2014, 05:59 PM	#24
335NJ Colonel 535 Rep 2,872 Posts Drives: 2008 335i 6MT E90 Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: NJ/Philadelphia Suburbs iTrader: (1)	So, under Speedo 10, Tach should be 0-5 to adjust for WG rattle. I guess starting at 1, and work my way up until WG rattle seems tamed as best as possible? I have never read how to properly use that function. __________________ *BSM E90 6MT*-JB4 G5 ISO-BMS DCI-Golf-Tee Mod-Hankook S1N2 Non-RFT-ER Chargepipe/TiAL BOV-E40 blend-VRSF V2's-M3 CDV-MHD/JB4 FLASH-VRSF 5" STEPPED FMIC
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09-03-2014, 06:58 PM	#25
DuDai Second Lieutenant 2 Rep 277 Posts Drives: 2007 BMW 335i Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Calgary, AB iTrader: (0)	No, slowly work your way down the rpm range until its no longer heard. Do note the lower you go, the more lag you will experience though. So you want to be the highest you can be without rattle so there is less lag. Also the Speedo on 12 adjusts wgdc which can also affect rattle and pulsating feeling on light throttle. __________________ ---------------- Stacked BMS Flash & JB4, Dinan CAI, ER Chargepipe, 7" VRSF Intercooler, VRSF Catless DP's, ER Sport Oil Cooler w/Steel lines, Gunmetal 19" VMR V710's, 335is clutch
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09-03-2014, 08:11 PM	#29
DuDai Second Lieutenant 2 Rep 277 Posts Drives: 2007 BMW 335i Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Calgary, AB iTrader: (0)	That I think would be changed via the menu 12. I'd say adjust that one. I'm using a setting of 1400rpm for menu 10 and 2500rpm for menu 12. __________________ ---------------- Stacked BMS Flash & JB4, Dinan CAI, ER Chargepipe, 7" VRSF Intercooler, VRSF Catless DP's, ER Sport Oil Cooler w/Steel lines, Gunmetal 19" VMR V710's, 335is clutch
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10-24-2014, 12:57 PM	#32
BMW-SRT First Lieutenant 182 Rep 346 Posts Drives: C63sAMG, GLC63sAMG, x5m, 335i Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Cen-Cal iTrader: (0)	Any of you guys try a manual adjustment of the wastegate rod? I've done it before for the "top" turbo and rattle went away but now my lower one is rattling really bad. Anyone ever manually adjust the lower wastegate rod? or is their a "how-to" on how to do it?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

10-24-2014, 01:34 PM	#33
ferocity02 Colonel 553 Rep 2,085 Posts Drives: 2013 135is Join Date: May 2014 Location: USA iTrader: (8)	I have the same rattle on light-moderate acceleration, quiet on decel, and concluded that the JB4 was causing it. Without the JB4 it is dead silent. Something about how the JB4 controls the wastegates is causing the rattle. I have adjusted menus 10 and 12 until my fingers bled and couldn't eliminate it. Even with brand new turbos I get the ratting, even worse than the old turbos. __________________ 2013 135is DCT Carbon Black Metallic
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10-24-2014, 02:20 PM	#34
Lux3m35i Private First Class 15 Rep 117 Posts Drives: E92 335i Coupe Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Luxemburg iTrader: (0)	I also have rattle on light acceleration. When looking at the boost level the rattle appears at no boost or just before, for example while driving up a small hill. I don't have that noise with OEM downpipes with cat, only with my catless AR DPs. I have a lot of clearance, so it's not hitting against the sub-frame etc. I checked the wastegates with a vacuum pump, the wastegate should be fully closed at 5,9Hg but mine don't close at all, even at 7-8Hg ( I stopped at this point because it didn't move anymore). I suppose that the wastegate fully closes when backpressure builds up and helps closing the wastegate. It's also how the car feels.. on low RPM you feel kind of lag. I will try 2 things to fix the problem. I bought an other set of OEM DPs and removed the cat. If this set of catless DPs will eliminate the noise, the noise is caused by the AR DPs, probably because of the missing flex pipe. Secondly I will try to adjust the wastegate actuator, when I manage to turn the nut in that tiny space..
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10-24-2014, 02:23 PM	#35
jeeve.x Lieutenant 20 Rep 425 Posts Drives: E90 335i Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: San Diego iTrader: (1)	I tried adjusting the values in menus 10 and 12 as recommended earlier in this thread. Worked to bring down the rattle, but it's still there. Funny thing is, I set the values really low one time, I actually had rattle on deceleration as well.
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10-24-2014, 05:52 PM	#37
EscapeYourMind Private 7 Rep 61 Posts Drives: 08 BMW 135i Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Dallas, TX iTrader: (1)	I'm having the same problem. I previously had the wastegate rattle problem where they would rattle really bad on deceleration (based on the SIB this is one of the things the dealer looks for when replacing turbos). I got both turbos replaced about 4 months ago under the extended warranty. Now I am getting a similar rattle on acceleration only (nothing on deceleration). Boost seems to build fine, but like everyone else, it is really annoying/embarrassing. I have a JB4 and have tried messing with menu 10 but haven't had any luck. Would love to be able to find a solution to this problem.
	Appreciate 0 Quote