PWG to EWG Conversion

ceedawg · 04-03-2018, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enemigo13

there is no point converting pwg to ewg. stage1 turbo will give 250-300mbar (4-4.5psi) more after 5500rpms where stock pwg turbo is going down quickly, you will be able to have 15.5-16psi @ 6000rpm while you can have only 11-12psi there now. If that is not enough you should go for a stage2 turbo.

Exactly!

IK6SPEED · 04-03-2018, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enemigo13

there is no point converting pwg to ewg. stage1 turbo will give 250-300mbar (4-4.5psi) more after 5500rpms where stock pwg turbo is going down quickly, you will be able to have 15.5-16psi @ 6000rpm while you can have only 11-12psi there now. If that is not enough you should go for a stage2 turbo.

bradsm87

Quote:

Originally Posted by ceedawg

Exactly!

Putting in real world terms that everyone can understand, a stock early 2014 335i PWG and an identical stock late model 2014 335i EWG line up at the track (a comical real world scenario as I don’t track cars or intend to).

As close as can be guesstimated in this scenario, what is the real world difference in the times and speed going to be?

0-60 and Quarter Mile?

ceedawg · 04-03-2018, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IK6SPEED

bradsm87

Putting in real world terms that everyone can understand, a stock early 2014 335i PWG and an identical stock late model 2014 335i EWG line up at the track (a comical real world scenario as I don’t track cars or intend to).

As close as can be guesstimated in this scenario, what is the real world difference in the times and speed going to be?

0-60 and Quarter Mile?

That I would search the forums for but the EWG is supposed to be an improvement driveability wise,tune wise so that would be the no brainer for me. Question should be which has more tuning and power potential on pump gas!I think you already know by now!!!

IK6SPEED · 04-03-2018, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ceedawg

That I would search the forums for but the EWG is supposed to be an improvement driveability wise,tune wise so that would be the no brainer for me. Question should be which has more tuning and power potential on pump gas!I think you already know by now!!!

No direct comparisons.

EWG is obviously better, but trying to quantify it in real world results.

Would it shave a tenth of a second off time (or more) or give you 2 mph difference (or more)?

I seriously do not know which is why I am asking.

Moving from theory to reality, what is the end result in the real world?

ceedawg · 04-03-2018, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IK6SPEED

No direct comparisons.

EWG is obviously better, but trying to quantify it in real world results.

Would it shave a tenth of a second off time (or more) or give you 2 mph difference (or more)?

I seriously do not know which is why I am asking.

Moving from theory to reality, what is the end result in the real world?

I would search it man as I have no real world 0-60 nor 1/4 mile results off the top of my head. I'm still glad I have an EWG car for the many positive reasons discussed.

Eldaes · 04-03-2018, 10:21 AM

Dont wanna hijack, but I figured I would ask here. would PWG/EWG matter if I'm going PS2?

IK6SPEED · 04-03-2018, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eldaes

Dont wanna hijack, but I figured I would ask here. would PWG/EWG matter if I'm going PS2?

Yes as EWG has better/quicker control over boost.

Just like in boxing, one can win a round (or the title) with precision or doing it sloppy. End result is the same.

That is why I am trying to understand is how much real world difference there is in EWG v PWG.

Eldaes · 04-03-2018, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IK6SPEED

Yes as EWG has better/quicker control over boost.

Just like in boxing, one can win a round (or the title) with precision or doing it sloppy. End result is the same.

That is why I am trying to understand is how much real world difference there is in EWG v PWG.

so would it be worth it to do a PWG to EWG swap while upgrading turbos?

enemigo13 · 04-03-2018, 10:50 AM

look at F30 328i. It has exactly same turbos just from year 2013 is EWG, while year 2012 is PWG. Is there any difference in performance? Don't think so. BTW F10 M5 both turbos are PWG. So?

Quote:

Originally Posted by IK6SPEED

Yes as EWG has better/quicker control over boost.

Just like in boxing, one can win a round (or the title) with precision or doing it sloppy. End result is the same.

That is why I am trying to understand is how much real world difference there is in EWG v PWG.

cookiesowns · 04-05-2018, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enemigo13

vacuum pump is different also, pwg has extra vacuum lines as they're needed for turbocharger control, solenoid for control. about hpfp - everyone is talking that pwg hpfp holds better than ewg hpfp, ok no go to realoem and check part number. the same hpfp pump goes to late E series (when pump changed from n54 style), and the same hpfp goes to M2

) why it holds e85 better on pwg then? because pwg turbo cannot make boost similar to ewg so way less fuel flow needed, so you can add lots of e85 and still not crash your pump.

Thank you, finally someone who gets it! The EU6 injectors also have different flow characteristics

Mike@N54Tuning.com · 04-05-2018, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ceedawg

That I would search the forums for but the EWG is supposed to be an improvement driveability wise,tune wise so that would be the no brainer for me. Question should be which has more tuning and power potential on pump gas!I think you already know by now!!!

EWG also responds to tuning better.. But not sure the real world differences are that great..

Mike

ceedawg · 04-05-2018, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

EWG also responds to tuning better.. But not sure the real world differences are that great..

Mike

I agree!

Duperstar · 04-05-2018, 08:58 PM

.5 inch larger down pipe on ewg is part of the ewg vs pwg power comparison as well.

enemigo13 · 04-06-2018, 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duperstar

.5 inch larger down pipe on ewg is part of the ewg vs pwg power comparison as well.

not sure it adds noticeable power.

bradsm87 · 04-06-2018, 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duperstar

.5 inch larger down pipe on ewg is part of the ewg vs pwg power comparison as well.

Haha maybe if it was making 900hp. For anything under that, 3.5" is heaps. The EWG turbo has a 4" outlet to better match to the bigger, closer Euro 6 catalytic converter. That's the only reason.

Mike@N54Tuning.com · 04-06-2018, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enemigo13

not sure it adds noticeable power.

When tuned it would.. Its a substantial increase in volume..

Mike

IK6SPEED · 04-06-2018, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

EWG also responds to tuning better.. But not sure the real world differences are that great..

Mike

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

When tuned it would.. Its a substantial increase in volume..

Mike

bimmer ///man · 11-22-2018, 09:31 PM

Want to bump this to the top.

I have read there is an additional pin on the EWG dme that can be activated by a tuner allowing the S55 dual fuel pumps to be used.

I will be doing a PS2 upgrade at some point in the next couple months and if I’m going to spend that much for the turbo and supporting mods, I would spend the additional money for a used EWG dme and have it aligned (I currently have PWG).

My understanding of the switch.
1. Source used EWG dme, have aligned to vehicle
2. Change to ewg wiring harness (may only need part of it from looking at realoem)
3. Install ewg PS2 with matching downpipe, cap pwg vacuum line

That should be the basics. I’d also be interested in more info on EU5 vs EU6 injectors

ronanz · 11-22-2018, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bimmer ///man

Want to bump this to the top.

I have read there is an additional pin on the EWG dme that can be activated by a tuner allowing the S55 dual fuel pumps to be used.

I will be doing a PS2 upgrade at some point in the next couple months and if I’m going to spend that much for the turbo and supporting mods, I would spend the additional money for a used EWG dme and have it aligned (I currently have PWG).

My understanding of the switch.
1. Source used EWG dme, have aligned to vehicle
2. Change to ewg wiring harness (may only need part of it from looking at realoem)
3. Install ewg PS2 with matching downpipe, cap pwg vacuum line

That should be the basics. I’d also be interested in more info on EU5 vs EU6 injectors

Could you please share where you read this?

.

bimmer ///man · 11-22-2018, 10:51 PM

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1517911

Like I said, I can’t confirm first hand. If it is used on the Alpina B3, it would be a good place to start.

IK6SPEED · 11-23-2018, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bimmer ///man

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1517911

Like I said, I can’t confirm first hand. If it is used on the Alpina B3, it would be a good place to start.

But the M87 is EWG, not PWG.

So the kit would work with a EWG, but where is proof of concept that a car can be retrofitted to EWG from PWG?

bimmer ///man · 11-23-2018, 01:38 AM

Why would a car not be able to be ewg if the dme and supporting hardware are used? The biggest hurdle is aligning the used ewg dme to a pwg car. I have not found anything that points to ewg extending into other control systems past the dme. The simple hardware/software change is probably why some people that have a build date that falls in the ewg cutoff are sometimes surprised to find pwg, assembly line used what was available.

A new dme may not even be required, I was looking at the newer version for the ability to run the s55 fueling.

04-03-2018, 10:21 AM	#28
Eldaes Private First Class 29 Rep 114 Posts Drives: 2016 BMW F80 M3 Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Layton, Utah iTrader: (0)	Dont wanna hijack, but I figured I would ask here. would PWG/EWG matter if I'm going PS2? __________________ 2013 F30 335i - Totaled 2016 F80 M3 - PS2+ \| MHD \| Wedge Performance \|
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04-05-2018, 08:58 PM	#35
Duperstar Private First Class 24 Rep 113 Posts Drives: G30 540 Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: NYC iTrader: (1)	.5 inch larger down pipe on ewg is part of the ewg vs pwg power comparison as well.
	Appreciate 2 ceedawg467.50 FSociety3816.50 Quote

11-22-2018, 09:31 PM	#40
bimmer ///man Captain 101 Rep 691 Posts Drives: M Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: 805 iTrader: (0)	Want to bump this to the top. I have read there is an additional pin on the EWG dme that can be activated by a tuner allowing the S55 dual fuel pumps to be used. I will be doing a PS2 upgrade at some point in the next couple months and if I’m going to spend that much for the turbo and supporting mods, I would spend the additional money for a used EWG dme and have it aligned (I currently have PWG). My understanding of the switch. 1. Source used EWG dme, have aligned to vehicle 2. Change to ewg wiring harness (may only need part of it from looking at realoem) 3. Install ewg PS2 with matching downpipe, cap pwg vacuum line That should be the basics. I’d also be interested in more info on EU5 vs EU6 injectors
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-22-2018, 10:51 PM	#42
bimmer ///man Captain 101 Rep 691 Posts Drives: M Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: 805 iTrader: (0)	https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1517911 Like I said, I can’t confirm first hand. If it is used on the Alpina B3, it would be a good place to start.
	Appreciate 1 ronanz1822.50 Quote

11-23-2018, 01:38 AM	#44
bimmer ///man Captain 101 Rep 691 Posts Drives: M Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: 805 iTrader: (0)	Why would a car not be able to be ewg if the dme and supporting hardware are used? The biggest hurdle is aligning the used ewg dme to a pwg car. I have not found anything that points to ewg extending into other control systems past the dme. The simple hardware/software change is probably why some people that have a build date that falls in the ewg cutoff are sometimes surprised to find pwg, assembly line used what was available. A new dme may not even be required, I was looking at the newer version for the ability to run the s55 fueling.
	Appreciate 0 Quote