[Bimmer_Engineer]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

How?

Catless DPs, intake and intercooler on stage 2+ only get you around 360 to 370 whp from what I read.

Agreed...I think you need to go to methanol or E85 to get over 400...

[Spyro235]

Originally Posted by pjr710

hmmm, i have been doing a lot of reading even before this and I was going to go with MHD because everyone said it's "Smoother" plus it was cheaper.

I don't have any mods and was planning on just doing MHD stage 1 ... so if I stacked ... what maps would I run on JB4 and MHD for a bone stock set up?

That thread on N54tech was the only one that really caught my attention b/c I agree it's totally logical to have the safety features of JB4 .. I guess I just figured it was an old post and it didn't ring true today since mostly everyone just recommends going MHD.

I went MHD stage 1 with 125k miles. Be prepared for needing spark plugs/ coils, but only because they're already on their way out already. MHD stage 1 is SUPREMELY safe, dont worry about a thing. Really wakes the car up, you'll love it. I did Catless DP's and stage 2 after about another 5k miles, and I'm sitting here at 168k miles, still tuned stage 2 with catless downpipes, no issues. Tha'ts about 38k miles of stage 2. No reason to stack MHD with JB4 if you're not trying to make crazy power. If you start modding part just stage 2, it's time to think about MHD BEF with JB4 on top of it.

[mweisdorfer]

The only thing I would add is you should seriously consider installing new index 12 injectors, if you haven't already done so. Get a lifetime warranty on injectors, plugs & coils. Once you put a tune on it, the lifespan of those 3 parts gets cut in half.

Also, use 5w-40 oil and change it out every 7500 miles.

Last, make sure you tighten up the waste-gates on both turbos & replace all your vac lines with titanium cured ones. 3.5mm

[srey]

Alright. I'll take my lumps. I was wrong.

[pjr710]

Originally Posted by Spyro235

I went MHD stage 1 with 125k miles. Be prepared for needing spark plugs/ coils, but only because they're already on their way out already. MHD stage 1 is SUPREMELY safe, dont worry about a thing. Really wakes the car up, you'll love it. I did Catless DP's and stage 2 after about another 5k miles, and I'm sitting here at 168k miles, still tuned stage 2 with catless downpipes, no issues. Tha'ts about 38k miles of stage 2. No reason to stack MHD with JB4 if you're not trying to make crazy power. If you start modding part just stage 2, it's time to think about MHD BEF with JB4 on top of it.

sick .. i think u have the same exact car as me. My plugs/coils are new too .. i have like 10k on them maybe.

Originally Posted by mweisdorfer

The only thing I would add is you should seriously consider installing new index 12 injectors, if you haven't already done so. Get a lifetime warranty on injectors, plugs & coils. Once you put a tune on it, the lifespan of those 3 parts gets cut in half.

Also, use 5w-40 oil and change it out every 7500 miles.

Last, make sure you tighten up the waste-gates on both turbos & replace all your vac lines with titanium cured ones. 3.5mm

For the index 12s ... shouldn't I wait until mine go bad?

What's the reasoning behind 5w-40? I 've been using the pentosin kit 5w30 from FCP euro .. changing every 5k (all highway).

Wastegates - just did it, vac lines are also all new.

[Sgop335]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

How?

Catless DPs, intake and intercooler on stage 2+ only get you around 360 to 370 whp from what I read.

He forgot the "E". That's how.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Sgop335

He forgot the "E". That's how.

Ahhh ok, I thought he mainly meant FBO.

I'm so disappointed there is no E fuel here.

[pjr710]

FOR THE RECORD ... the n54 tech posts that JB4 has more safety features that the DME cannot do.

So this means that MHD and the basic DME have the same safety features correct?

The example that sticks out the most is the leaning out - the n54 tech posts states the DME will let you lean out and JB4 won't ... the DME would do that whether it was stock or MHD ... right?

So basically
MHD & stock ECU = same factory safety features
JB4 = additional safety features

Correct?

[feuer]

To add on top of lean/rich running conditions safety triggers on jb4:
-over boost
-AFR imbalance from bank to bank
-low fuel pressure
-issue with Meth flow
Hypothetically MDH/DME will kick the engine into limp mode when either from above reasons but will every end user know why? Maybe if they are enough inclined but with JB4 is super simple: last safety 1, 2.... and then you have discription.
Comes down to prefference I guess.

[9krpmrx8]

The DME is always in control when it comes to safety features, and if you are logging, you can figure out why. But yes I agree, it is totally personal preference. But with the improvements coming as MHD is constantly being developed, it will be hard to justify buying a JB4 first.

[pjr710]

Originally Posted by feuer

To add on top of lean/rich running conditions safety triggers on jb4:
-over boost
-AFR imbalance from bank to bank
-low fuel pressure
-issue with Meth flow
Hypothetically MDH/DME will kick the engine into limp mode when either from above reasons but will every end user know why? Maybe if they are enough inclined but with JB4 is super simple: last safety 1, 2.... and then you have discription.
Comes down to prefference I guess.

this clarifies it. the n54 post makes it sound like unless u have jb4 your car will let you blow it up

[mweisdorfer]

Originally Posted by pjr710

sick .. i think u have the same exact car as me. My plugs/coils are new too .. i have like 10k on them maybe.

For the index 12s ... shouldn't I wait until mine go bad?

What's the reasoning behind 5w-40? I 've been using the pentosin kit 5w30 from FCP euro .. changing every 5k (all highway).

Wastegates - just did it, vac lines are also all new.

You don't have to change the injectors, but if one goes bad at WOT, you'll know why. Hopefully, you won't do any damage to anything else when one or two do go.

5w-40 for more protection, especially for the older OEM turbos.

[mweisdorfer]

Originally Posted by mweisdorfer

You don't have to change the injectors, but if one goes bad at WOT, you'll know why. Hopefully, you won't do any damage to anything else when one or two do go.

5w-40 for more protection, especially for the older OEM turbos.

Another item to be on the watch for is seals. PCV & Crank Case Valve - get a new one like maybe a Rob Beck. Replace gaskets in your intake system. A tune will essentially double the amount of PSI your gonna run. That spells disaster for old seals and rubber gaskets.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by pjr710

this clarifies it. the n54 post makes it sound like unless u have jb4 your car will let you blow it up

Any engine can blow up at any time for various reasons. Even engine that isn't tuned at all. Reading here about stage 2 at 168k etc etc....Is all fine when you drive it to take kids to daycare :-) Take it to track and items will start failing at very fast rate. Depends how and for what you use the vehicle. Also how it was maintained. Mileage itself is the last factor.

[IllSic_Design]

I bought my car at 116k. Did almost all of the maintenance needed and went MHD stage 1+ at about 125k. Turbos finally went out at 148k and then I upgraded and also got downpipes and went Stage 2+. About 175k went with stage 2 lpfp, ethanol sensor, and MHD/Motiv flex-fuel setup pushing E50. I'm sitting at 181k and engine is still doing really well. We'll see how well when I get my oil analysis back that I just sent out although the last one I did at 164k showed phenomenal numbers. Only thing I've really had to replace since starting to tune in regards to the engine is vanos solenoids, coils/plugs, and just last week my first ever HPFP.

If you've kept up on maintenance and oil report is good I say go for it, and since you only want to run a light tune MHD will be more than fine enough.

Edit: I do track my car also and drive it pretty hard on the daily.

[pjr710]

Originally Posted by mweisdorfer

You don't have to change the injectors, but if one goes bad at WOT, you'll know why. Hopefully, you won't do any damage to anything else when one or two do go.

5w-40 for more protection, especially for the older OEM turbos.

Is there a way to tell if injectors are failing? I know misfires because they would "leak" but anything else? Also if they did die .. what kind of harm could that do?

How does the 40 weight offer more protection? I'm just not very knowledgeable on that subject.

Originally Posted by mweisdorfer

Another item to be on the watch for is seals. PCV & Crank Case Valve - get a new one like maybe a Rob Beck. Replace gaskets in your intake system. A tune will essentially double the amount of PSI your gonna run. That spells disaster for old seals and rubber gaskets.

Yea I just replaced my whole valve cover. I was likely going to do a walnut blast then after that install a catch can with that PCV valve.

I was actually wondering about my charge pipe ... I thought i read these can only handle like 10PSI ... which I believe mhd stage 1 is higher than that..

Originally Posted by feuer

Any engine can blow up at any time for various reasons. Even engine that isn't tuned at all. Reading here about stage 2 at 168k etc etc....Is all fine when you drive it to take kids to daycare :-) Take it to track and items will start failing at very fast rate. Depends how and for what you use the vehicle. Also how it was maintained. Mileage itself is the last factor.

AFAIK I've maintained my motor as good as I possibly could have. And I DD it highway to and from work about 90 miles a day.

I've also owned it since it had 20k on it which is something I'm starting to appreciate more and more since now I know it's exact history and usage.

Originally Posted by IllSic_Design

I bought my car at 116k. Did almost all of the maintenance needed and went MHD stage 1+ at about 125k. Turbos finally went out at 148k and then I upgraded and also got downpipes and went Stage 2+. About 175k went with stage 2 lpfp, ethanol sensor, and MHD/Motiv flex-fuel setup pushing E50. I'm sitting at 181k and engine is still doing really well. We'll see how well when I get my oil analysis back that I just sent out although the last one I did at 164k showed phenomenal numbers. Only thing I've really had to replace since starting to tune in regards to the engine is vanos solenoids, coils/plugs, and just last week my first ever HPFP.

If you've kept up on maintenance and oil report is good I say go for it, and since you only want to run a light tune MHD will be more than fine enough.

Edit: I do track my car also and drive it pretty hard on the daily.

This is awesome. I had BMW replace my HPFP at 48k under the warranty. (the old one was still fine) ... my plugs/coils are fresh, I also replaced my vanos solenoids a few k miles ago and my boost solenoids.

How did you know you're turbos were shot?

[mweisdorfer]

Originally Posted by pjr710

Is there a way to tell if injectors are failing? I know misfires because they would "leak" but anything else? Also if they did die .. what kind of harm could that do?

How does the 40 weight offer more protection? I'm just not very knowledgeable on that subject.

Yea I just replaced my whole valve cover. I was likely going to do a walnut blast then after that install a catch can with that PCV valve.

I was actually wondering about my charge pipe ... I thought i read these can only handle like 10PSI ... which I believe mhd stage 1 is higher than that..

AFAIK I've maintained my motor as good as I possibly could have. And I DD it highway to and from work about 90 miles a day.

I've also owned it since it had 20k on it which is something I'm starting to appreciate more and more since now I know it's exact history and usage.

This is awesome. I had BMW replace my HPFP at 48k under the warranty. (the old one was still fine) ... my plugs/coils are fresh, I also replaced my vanos solenoids a few k miles ago and my boost solenoids.

How did you know you're turbos were shot?

30 weight vs 40 weight. 40 weight is thicker and will protect better as a result. Also, don't go cheap on the oil. Use a QUALITY oil that is LL-01 APPROVED. An N54 Motor gets REALLY hot. This is due to it having not one but two turbo chargers. Personally, I use Amsoil 5w-40. I have a membership, and I get 25% off on every purchase. Their oil is top shelf. I also use Mann filters.

Mishimoto makes a really good catch can that will mount near the front of the engine. Look into that.

A walnut blasting of the intake valves is a must, on an N54 engine, every 30-36,000 miles. Especially a tuned one.

Rob Beck sells the PCV valve, cap & PCV breather hose you need.

Charge pipe - I really like my Cobb Charge pipe. Order it directly from Cobb though or you may get a fitment issue. They redesigned them in April of 17. You don't know if a vendor has an old one sitting in their inventory or not. Cobb won't. Since April of 17' no one has yet to complain about the fitment of a Cobb Charge pipe they ordered directly from Cobb.

It's probably the best charge pipe IMO, under $200.00 for the N54, if you are using traditional or after Mkt blow off valves. Until you get over say 20psi, you don't have to get forge or turbo smart blow off valves.

I would replace the gaskets around the FMIC. I'd also look at the connections of your stock turbos where each inlet reaches the turbos. The OEM connections are a little flimsy IMO.

Most people don't get much more than 150,000 miles on an original set of injectors. That being said, your injectors with 120,000 miles are near the end of their lifespan.

[Spyro235]

Originally Posted by feuer

Any engine can blow up at any time for various reasons. Even engine that isn't tuned at all. Reading here about stage 2 at 168k etc etc....Is all fine when you drive it to take kids to daycare :-) Take it to track and items will start failing at very fast rate. Depends how and for what you use the vehicle. Also how it was maintained. Mileage itself is the last factor.

I agree that mileage is the least factor of all, as I take great care of my car.
However, I'm 25 years old, no kids or silly responsibilities like that. I boost the car hard every day that it runs, and it regularly sees triple digits. I just take care of it, so it continues to do so. I didn't mod and tune my car to take any kids to the daycare, I did it to boost around and hear those turbos spinning!
Redline in 3rd comes up really quickly, and I try not slam 4th and continue to take off, because I get caught doing that and I'm spending the rest of the day in cuffs!

I agree, that my car probably isn't up to the task of tracking it. It functions wonderfully as a crazy quick daily that will pass just about anything with a little nudge to the pedal in 6th. To track it, I'd want to do a full refresh of the suspension.

[pjr710]

Originally Posted by Spyro235

I agree that mileage is the least factor of all, as I take great care of my car.
However, I'm 25 years old, no kids or silly responsibilities like that. I boost the car hard every day that it runs, and it regularly sees triple digits. I just take care of it, so it continues to do so. I didn't mod and tune my car to take any kids to the daycare, I did it to boost around and hear those turbos spinning!
Redline in 3rd comes up really quickly, and I try not slam 4th and continue to take off, because I get caught doing that and I'm spending the rest of the day in cuffs!

I agree, that my car probably isn't up to the task of tracking it. It functions wonderfully as a crazy quick daily that will pass just about anything with a little nudge to the pedal in 6th. To track it, I'd want to do a full refresh of the suspension.

well said ... i pretty much want my car to feel as fast as it should ... i feel like right now its as if BMW de-tuned it. it's fast IMO even stock .. so MHD stage 1 should be a treat.

[IllSic_Design]

Originally Posted by pjr710

How did you know you're turbos were shot?

Well they still worked fine and didn't have much shaft play, but they both had wastegate rattle and then one finally had a wastegate get stuck open.

[pjr710]

Originally Posted by IllSic_Design

Well they still worked fine and didn't have much shaft play, but they both had wastegate rattle and then one finally had a wastegate get stuck open.

interesting .. i just had to adjust mine

did you do the job yourself?

I really dig the appeal of this kit if I ever needed to do a replacement and had the cash https://www.speedtech.com/bmw-n54/

[IllSic_Design]

Yes, all work done on my car is performed by me.

And yeah that speedtech kit looks to be the business!