[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Bubbles

We never stop learning, but haven't you done +15 events by now? I expect you are going through street tires every other event. If I am incorrect on that assumption please ignore me.

I reduce corner entry speed i feel the tires starting to overheat so that I don't destroy them. the tires in those pics have 13k miles and about a dozen days. If I didn't back off, yea maybe i would be chewing thru tires that fast. Is that how fast I would be going through r compounds ?

Now i really don't feel the rush to take the $$$ and hassle that would come with r tires and supporting mods.

[Chowbow]

Mine looked similar after every autoX. A lot of guys recommended just going with a front bar to stay in stock class, and it actually helps because it reduces the front roll of the car, and with the severe lack of negative camber, it means the tires get a better contact patch. A little counter intuitive, but is an effective solution. On track without classification, I think camber plates is the better route to go with. Right now you are probably only running -0.6 or so degrees of camber and it would be nice to be able to run at least -1.5 on track.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Chowbow

Mine looked similar after every autoX. A lot of guys recommended just going with a front bar to stay in stock class, and it actually helps because it reduces the front roll of the car, and with the severe lack of negative camber, it means the tires get a better contact patch. A little counter intuitive, but is an effective solution. On track without classification, I think camber plates is the better route to go with. Right now you are probably only running -0.6 or so degrees of camber and it would be nice to be able to run at least -1.5 on track.

Yea thanks for the tip.. I'm a 'matched suspension kit' kind of guy since i don't have the tech to fully evaluate that kind of change to the system. I don't even have access to a camber curve diagram for the car.

the most i'd be comfortable with is changing the alignment to something a bit more performance oriented within the factory parameters, but it sounds like there isn't really much adjustability in the E90.

[Chowbow]

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

Yea thanks for the tip.. I'm a 'matched suspension kit' kind of guy since i don't have the tech to fully evaluate that kind of change to the system. I don't even have access to a camber curve diagram for the car.

the most i'd be comfortable with is changing the alignment to something a bit more performance oriented within the factory parameters, but it sounds like there isn't really much adjustability in the E90.

Nick, you can get a slightly more aggressive alignment. There's a pin on the strut tower that you can drill out and it'll give you an additional -0.1 degrees or so. I drilled mine out, and went to Roger Kraus Racing in Castro Valley to have my car aligned. Brandon Kraus is really good and is a serious racer himself so he can set you up right.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Chowbow

Roger Kraus Racing in Castro Valley to have my car aligned. Brandon Kraus is really good and is a serious racer himself so he can set you up right.

does he actually do it with ballast in the driver's seat? thanks for the referral!

EDIT: additional -0.1 and you have to drill to get it.. yup.. no adjustability here =)

[Chowbow]

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

does he actually do it with ballast in the driver's seat? thanks for the referral!

EDIT: additional -0.1 and you have to drill to get it.. yup.. no adjustability here =)

He can if you request. I didn't as I just wanted max negative camber. A whopping -0.8. When my friend corner balanced his Evo he got him to sit in it for a bit to get things right.

You should check out his THill crash video too, he'll be happy to show you. It's crazy stuff. And he's also got an E36 M3 running something like -5.5* of camber on the front.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Chowbow

max negative camber. A whopping -0.8.

dude. i'd rather pay for a DE than an alignment to get -0.2 more neg camber haha

I just googled those guys. I think I've been there once to get to get my car teched. they weren't that nice (maybe because I wasn't spending any money? and maybe i should give them another chance?) Right now I make the drive out to Novato to go to the Subie shop (LIC motorsports) I used to go to get my car's logbook signed etc

[Chowbow]

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

dude. i'd rather pay for a DE than an alignment to get -0.2 more neg camber haha

I just googled those guys. I think I've been there once to get to get my car teched. they weren't that nice (maybe because I wasn't spending any money? and maybe i should give them another chance?) Right now I make the drive out to Novato to go to the Subie shop (LIC motorsports) I used to go to get my car's logbook signed etc

Not sure, I guess I don't see them being real "nice guys" per se. They just get stuff done and move on. They're cool guys I think, and even offered to do my tech for me after my alignment (was going to THill the next day) but I had already done it. Definitely a more old school good ol' boys kinda shop I guess and while not the best customer handlers, they do a good job. Oh, and their dot matrix printers are blasts from the past.

[The HACK]

If you're on stock alignment, there maybe something else you can do to lessen the wear on the tires...Or at least make it wear a little bit more evenly.

Most of the time BMWs come from the factory with a slight toe-in up front. Toe-in combined with lack of negative camber results in unnecessary tire wear on the outside shoulder when driven aggressively. If you haven't had alignment done and have no plans for camber plates, make sure you get your alignment checked and max out your camber AND add a little bit of toe-out up front to see if you can get that tire wear fixed.

Do be aware, that slight toe-out will accelerate your inside tire wear faster than some negative camber. But if your car has toe-in AND little camber up front, expect to wear out tires just like your original picture(s).

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by The HACK

If you're on stock alignment, there maybe something else you can do to lessen the wear on the tires...Or at least make it wear a little bit more evenly.

Most of the time BMWs come from the factory with a slight toe-in up front. Toe-in combined with lack of negative camber results in unnecessary tire wear on the outside shoulder when driven aggressively. If you haven't had alignment done and have no plans for camber plates, make sure you get your alignment checked and max out your camber AND add a little bit of toe-out up front to see if you can get that tire wear fixed.

Do be aware, that slight toe-out will accelerate your inside tire wear faster than some negative camber. But if your car has toe-in AND little camber up front, expect to wear out tires just like your original picture(s).

I use to run slight toe out on the rear of my WRX to help rotation, along with -1 front and -1.7 rear camber. I definitely here you about the faster wear on the inside. that was ok when tires were $100 each (Azenis RT615 ftw) but now that they are closer to $300 each and my mileage is 90% street I'm not so sure I can stomach it

Thanks for the feedback!

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

I reduce corner entry speed i feel the tires starting to overheat so that I don't destroy them. the tires in those pics have 13k miles and about a dozen days. If I didn't back off, yea maybe i would be chewing thru tires that fast. Is that how fast I would be going through r compounds ?

Now i really don't feel the rush to take the $$$ and hassle that would come with r tires and supporting mods.

R comps should last you at least 6-7 days.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by Bubbles

R comps should last you at least 6-7 days.

Not with stock camber and toe. R comps would last 2 weekends and the outside would be corded and the inside will still have 75% rubber left. If you can't get some additional camber going R comps are just a waste of $$$.

Here's a pretty long discussion by a bunch of guys that know a lot about track...And my esteemed colleagues all seems to think that camber plate is priority one before R comps (although R comps ultimately will give you better track time).

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1207797

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by The HACK

Not with stock camber and toe. R comps would last 2 weekends and the outside would be corded and the inside will still have 75% rubber left. If you can't get some additional camber going R comps are just a waste of $$$.

Here's a pretty long discussion by a bunch of guys that know a lot about track...And my esteemed colleagues all seems to think that camber plate is priority one before R comps (although R comps ultimately will give you better track time).

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1207797

Of course more camber is ideal, but I can get -.9 LF and -.8 RF camber on stock suspension. Running Nittos at 38psi the wear was good (not great). If you run a square setup and swap front to back you should be good. If you flip the tires on the rim, you may get even more out of the tires.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by Bubbles

Of course more camber is ideal, but I can get -.9 LF and -.8 RF camber on stock suspension. Running Nittos at 38psi the wear was good (not great). If you run a square setup and swap front to back you should be good. If you flip the tires on the rim, you may get even more out of the tires.

My "school" of thinking is, a good camber plate will set you back $500. A set of R-Comps cost around $1,000. Might as well spend money on the "cheaper" components to protect and prolong your expensive tires.

Plus the right camber and right pressure on R-comps make a HUGE difference in available grip. And if you have to flip the tires on the rim regularly and if you don't have access to a friendly shop, you're looking at spending camber plate type money within a handful of events anyway.

Just offering a different perspective.

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by The HACK

My "school" of thinking is, a good camber plate will set you back $500. A set of R-Comps cost around $1,000. Might as well spend money on the "cheaper" components to protect and prolong your expensive tires.

Plus the right camber and right pressure on R-comps make a HUGE difference in available grip. And if you have to flip the tires on the rim regularly and if you don't have access to a friendly shop, you're looking at spending camber plate type money within a handful of events anyway.

Just offering a different perspective.

I pay $600 for Nittos installed

$500, not taking into account labor. You may as well install a full suspension while the front is pulled off.

For some of us, camber plates have negative warranty implications and are not an option.

What were we talking about?

[Kbueno]

Ah yes, outer edge tire wear. I cringed when I began to see signs on 1 side. I've since increased tire pressure and did the pin drill out technique to get max camber. It actually moved quite a bit. For some reason, I had no negative camber on the driver side..all fixed now and the wear has definitely lessened.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by Bubbles

What were we talking about?

I think we're talking about the need to agree to disagree.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by 335lvr

I've since increased tire pressure

I think all that does is decrease your grip by reducing the size of the contact patch

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by The HACK

I think we're talking about the need to agree to disagree.

Agreed

[Kbueno]

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

I think all that does is decrease your grip by reducing the size of the contact patch

Yep...

Slightly decreased grip vs. chewing up $300 PS2

Even an over-inflated PS2 has so much more grip than the stocky.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by 335lvr

Even an over-inflated PS2 has so much more grip than the stocky.

what were your stock tires?

I tried an E36 M3 with michelin PS2 and it didn't feel like there was more grip than my WRX with falken RT615 (the Ps2 also felt like it had softer sidewalls). My E90 with stock RE050A II feel close to my old RT615. I guess i'm personally not convinced about the PS2 but my experience wasn't apples to apples on the same car

[Kbueno]

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

what were your stock tires?

I tried an E36 M3 with michelin PS2 and it didn't feel like there was more grip than my WRX with falken RT615 (the Ps2 also felt like it had softer sidewalls). My E90 with stock RE050A II feel close to my old RT615. I guess i'm personally not convinced about the PS2 but my experience wasn't apples to apples on the same car

runflats RE050...absolutely hated them. I was so frustrated with them I scrubbed them to oblivion at the track.