Misfires on auto with Procede. Found possible cause!

badass335 · 10-31-2009, 03:51 PM

On stage 1, i seemed to work just fine. I tried it out for a couple of days and no issues. The issue happened more on stage 2 and 3. Since i have the supporting mods, i want to run the higher performance maps. JB3 has been on the car for a day so far and no issues yet. I'm going to give her a better run tonight and see how she holds up. But to be fair, i would change maps, do an adaptation and within 6 - 7 runs, i would limp the car and on JB3 it hasn't yet.

You are right in mentioning all the different factors with these cars. It's hard to go through all of them. My issue is that where I am, its hard to find good tuners or people that are really up on things. In the US, places like Cali, there are all these guys that run out there with similar mods etc so it seems easier to figure things out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick.CBR

Hey Man,

I had this exact same issue running the 10-9 6MT-6AT map - put it to the rug and lit the CEL. This only happened when the car would downshift and the revs would be very high (like a downshift from 2nd to first). Per Shiv, I put the 6AT specific map (stage 1) on my car and all issues went away. I just had the car on the dyno as well and it would run all the way up to the factory shift point with zero issues - I think in two of the pulls the operator let off a split second after the change to fifth (that's what it sounds like in the video's - the car was in DS and we changed gears using the paddles but it still wanted to shift to 5th - I'd have to datalog to see 100% though).

Bottom line is I'm glad you got your car running solid again; nothing worse than a 50K car that's limping around. To be fair, there are so many damn variables when running [these cars] on tunes that just can't be 100% accounted for (air temp, barometric pres., humidity, fuel quality, hardware, etc.) It sounds like you exhausted all of these and found that the JB just works better with your specific setup right out of the box. My guess is with a few hundered bucks in dyno time, you could have gotten it sorted out with the PROcede - comes down to do you want to dick around with the numbers or spend the same cash and try a totally different tune.

Again nice work - I think this is a great example of how these are dynamic vehicles and no two cars will perform exactly the same given identical hardware.

Later,

Nick

Kelvin1000 · 11-01-2009, 10:12 AM

I keep having misfire issues at starup as well... did not have them with the JB3...

dzenno · 11-01-2009, 10:39 AM

Wonder what'll happen with my car tomorrow. I've got stage 3 upgrades + procede v3 canbus and MSD80 currently pre-29.2 and going to the dealership for some service work...I know the service rep and warranty won't be the issue, but I wonder what'll happen when they update the progman to latest...

How many of you are running MSD80 with post 29.2?

badass335 · 11-01-2009, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dzenno

Wonder what'll happen with my car tomorrow. I've got stage 3 upgrades + procede v3 canbus and MSD80 currently pre-29.2 and going to the dealership for some service work...I know the service rep and warranty won't be the issue, but I wonder what'll happen when they update the progman to latest...

How many of you are running MSD80 with post 29.2?

Are you auto? Are you 29.2 or 28.x etc? Take her in and see how it goes. The manuals don't seem to have an issue. I know a few myself and no problem. On my car, curse my luck, the moons all aligned just right so the conditions met perfectly and limp.

kentgbr · 11-01-2009, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelvin1000

I keep having misfire issues at starup as well... did not have them with the JB3...

Your car has started misfiring at startup and you are running a PROcede. It didn't misfire before at startup with the JB3 installed. To logically conclude the PROcede is the problem you need to re-install the JB3 and see if the problem goes away. Otherwise you're just guessing.

harry$ · 11-01-2009, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by badass335

I ran stage 2 and stage 3 and limp on both! Running default settings. I'm trying to convince my SA to get the car software upgraded. Once that happens, I'll re-test the procede and see if it resolved it.

What dealer did you take your car to and who was your SA? Do you still have factory warranty on your engine or did they void it awhile back?

badass335 · 11-01-2009, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kentgbr

Your car has started misfiring at startup and you are running a PROcede. It didn't misfire before at startup with the JB3 installed. To logically conclude the PROcede is the problem you need to re-install the JB3 and see if the problem goes away. Otherwise you're just guessing.

+1. Switching between tunes didn't cause me any issues on startup and or normal driving. Mine only happens when i go WOT and let the car change gears above the 6000RPM engine stress it seems.

dzenno · 11-01-2009, 04:36 PM

I'm pre-29.2 don't know what version, original progman since I got the car never been to service since I got it. This is first time.

I've got a manual.

Quote:

Originally Posted by badass335

Are you auto? Are you 29.2 or 28.x etc? Take her in and see how it goes. The manuals don't seem to have an issue. I know a few myself and no problem. On my car, curse my luck, the moons all aligned just right so the conditions met perfectly and limp.

dzenno · 11-01-2009, 05:25 PM

Throgh bavtech tool I only see production date on ecu Dec. 2007 and that it's MSD80

gian335 · 11-01-2009, 06:43 PM

ive had proceede running for a 9 months now, and iam running the new canbus software. i have an 08 msd80, pre-29.2 335i, ive had no issues yet, running as smooth as usual.

dzenno · 11-01-2009, 07:32 PM

Stage 3?

Quote:

Originally Posted by gian335

ive had proceede running for a 9 months now, and iam running the new canbus software. i have an 08 msd80, pre-29.2 335i, ive had no issues yet, running as smooth as usual.

Terrance28 · 11-01-2009, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelvin1000

I keep having misfire issues at starup as well... did not have them with the JB3...

K you are using the procede? Badass i'm glad you got your car running right.

Kelvin1000 · 11-01-2009, 08:15 PM

Got both the JB3 and the Procede and will be doing another one of my lenghty comparisons but I have to fine tune the Procede to induce as little ignition correction as possible without knocking to try to match map7 on the JB3...

gian335 · 11-02-2009, 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dzenno

Stage 3?

yup stg.3 ign.corr set at 80%. I only run this with sunnoco 94, but my daily driver map is stg.1 as my map# 1. I have gone 2 the track as well and have no issues with it either. The only small problem i get is a little oscilation from 3000- 3300.

badass335 · 11-02-2009, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gian335

ive had proceede running for a 9 months now, and iam running the new canbus software. i have an 08 msd80, pre-29.2 335i, ive had no issues yet, running as smooth as usual.

Auto?

badass335 · 11-02-2009, 02:07 AM

So an update! Ran jb3 hard tonight! Map 6 and after multiple pulls ripping down the highway, it did limp once! Cyl 6 misfire! But only once. It was a wierd combo though. Had my test pilot running the car. He geared down mashed the throttle which caused the car to gear down further for WOT and limp. After that, we couldn't limp it.

jpsimon · 11-02-2009, 02:14 AM

so the problem is still there

badass335 · 11-02-2009, 02:22 AM

Possible since it did happen once. This is why I say it's more the dme software. It seems on jb3, it's a lot less pronounced! To give you an idea, probably 25-30 WOT runs, we limped once. With procede, 25-30 runs, limped 25-26 times!

dzenno · 11-02-2009, 07:34 AM

oscillation in power when WOT-ing?

I feel that as well..sort of a hesitation or many hesitations right around 3000 - 3500 rpm... What could that be?

This seems to be there only on stage 3 map for me...

Quote:

Originally Posted by gian335

yup stg.3 ign.corr set at 80%. I only run this with sunnoco 94, but my daily driver map is stg.1 as my map# 1. I have gone 2 the track as well and have no issues with it either. The only small problem i get is a little oscilation from 3000- 3300.

dzenno · 11-02-2009, 09:03 AM

What did u end up backing off on??

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick.CBR

I can't remember but have you tried throwing a tank (or at least running yours waaaaay down then filling up half) of 100+ oct unleaded or whatever you have near you?

Just from my experience with the PROcede on 10-9 (beta) maps, the tune was simply too aggressive for the conditions and hardware I was running. As soon as I backed it off (just to 10-9 6AT beta) my cyl6 misfires were gone. Been fine since.

Not sure how the JB maps work (like if stepping down to 5 is less demanding) but what happens if you just go to a less agressive map or back out (or "in" depending how you look at it) user tq and ign corr. (or whatever JB calls it) and see what happens?

Just a thought...

Nick

pellinore · 11-02-2009, 10:01 AM

Had the misfires also, happened only when the car shifted down to 1st at higher RPMs and than shifting into 2nd. I had the 10-9 MT-AT maps Stage 1, switched the the 10-9 AT Stage 1 and so far so good.

gian335 · 11-02-2009, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dzenno

oscillation in power when WOT-ing?

I feel that as well..sort of a hesitation or many hesitations right around 3000 - 3500 rpm... What could that be?

This seems to be there only on stage 3 map for me...

Yes I am AT aswell.

I only get oscilation at half peddle around 3000 rpm. With stg1 and a little with stg.3 .... At WOT, I never get any oscilation or hesitation. Stg.3 mapping in my opinion is jus 2much boost for everyday driving.. Even with supporting mods.. It's like if I pass someone on the road I'll hit 12 psi in half a second...stg.3 is great for racing and when u really wanna hammer the peddle. Going from cruising 2 WOT is really a huge kickback in ur seat. Really fun.... 2bad I just put my winters on

.... The nokian winter tires cannot handle any map I'm on LOL

11-01-2009, 10:12 AM	#24
Kelvin1000 Major 254 Rep 1,297 Posts Drives: 2019 BMW M2 Competition MT Hoc Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Miami, FL iTrader: (4)	I keep having misfire issues at starup as well... did not have them with the JB3...
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11-01-2009, 10:39 AM	#25
dzenno Banned 286 Rep 5,876 Posts Drives: Join Date: Feb 2006 iTrader: (1)	Wonder what'll happen with my car tomorrow. I've got stage 3 upgrades + procede v3 canbus and MSD80 currently pre-29.2 and going to the dealership for some service work...I know the service rep and warranty won't be the issue, but I wonder what'll happen when they update the progman to latest... How many of you are running MSD80 with post 29.2?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-01-2009, 05:25 PM	#31
dzenno Banned 286 Rep 5,876 Posts Drives: Join Date: Feb 2006 iTrader: (1)	Throgh bavtech tool I only see production date on ecu Dec. 2007 and that it's MSD80
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11-01-2009, 06:43 PM	#32
gian335 Major 37 Rep 1,031 Posts Drives: e92 335 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: uknown iTrader: (1)	ive had proceede running for a 9 months now, and iam running the new canbus software. i have an 08 msd80, pre-29.2 335i, ive had no issues yet, running as smooth as usual.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-01-2009, 08:15 PM	#35
Kelvin1000 Major 254 Rep 1,297 Posts Drives: 2019 BMW M2 Competition MT Hoc Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Miami, FL iTrader: (4)	Got both the JB3 and the Procede and will be doing another one of my lenghty comparisons but I have to fine tune the Procede to induce as little ignition correction as possible without knocking to try to match map7 on the JB3...
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-02-2009, 02:07 AM	#38
badass335 Lieutenant Colonel 116 Rep 1,948 Posts Drives: 2017 540i Xdrive Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Surrey, BC iTrader: (10)	So an update! Ran jb3 hard tonight! Map 6 and after multiple pulls ripping down the highway, it did limp once! Cyl 6 misfire! But only once. It was a wierd combo though. Had my test pilot running the car. He geared down mashed the throttle which caused the car to gear down further for WOT and limp. After that, we couldn't limp it.
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11-02-2009, 02:14 AM	#39
jpsimon Team Zissou 3154 Rep 10,200 Posts Drives: 2022 AWD M3 Comp - SMB Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: CT iTrader: (7)	so the problem is still there
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11-02-2009, 02:22 AM	#40
badass335 Lieutenant Colonel 116 Rep 1,948 Posts Drives: 2017 540i Xdrive Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Surrey, BC iTrader: (10)	Possible since it did happen once. This is why I say it's more the dme software. It seems on jb3, it's a lot less pronounced! To give you an idea, probably 25-30 WOT runs, we limped once. With procede, 25-30 runs, limped 25-26 times!
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11-02-2009, 10:01 AM	#43
pellinore Private 0 Rep 57 Posts Drives: 2008 335xi Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Anytown iTrader: (0)	Had the misfires also, happened only when the car shifted down to 1st at higher RPMs and than shifting into 2nd. I had the 10-9 MT-AT maps Stage 1, switched the the 10-9 AT Stage 1 and so far so good.
	Appreciate 0 Quote