[09BMW335i]

Originally Posted by Presidio335xi

1 being stock

Noise - 7-8 with AC on / 4-5 AC off (but understand it is only when in neutral at a light or stop sign. My wife and mom both thought something was wrong with my car when they first heard it FWIW. Consider a 10 the worse waste gate rattle you have ever heard.

Vibrations 3-4 (reverse and 1st gear in the morning, not once warmed up then 1-2) Needs more throttle to engage but you will learn to like it better, especially when being aggressive/launching

Pedal Smoothness - 2 shorter engagement point near the top the peddle. It is quite firmer than stock but nothing major and again you will get use to it.

I will also add you will notice the steel SMFW will rev quicker and drop quicker in between shifts, thus allowing quicker shifts.

Like most people have said you hear a slight ticking at idle/neutral at a light without air on. If you doing like it push the clutch in. ( I would say around a 2-3 with out air/ 4-5 with air)

also the lwfw will make more noise then the SMFW and ALWAYS REPLACE your flywheel. doesnt matter if you have low miles on it.

as far as taking off you need to give it more pedal or ride the clutch a little more. You will get use to it after a week of driving. The clutch and the perfomace are second to none. very little pedal pushing needed when shifting

i dont notice any noise in reverse or 1st gear. I cant stress this enough though...BREAK IN THE CLUTCH....put as many miles on it as you can. Go through all the gears. the more miles the better the clutch will perform. You dont have to baby the clutch however, doing powershifts stc will not help you.

IMO if you are going to spend the money for a stage 2 plus you should spend the extra few hundred and get the SPEC 3 plus you will not regret it.

[Torgus]

You need to buy a new DMF anyways when you do a clutch.

If you ever think you might get to 500whp or more get the SSMFW. If you want a faster reving engine get the SSMFW

Otherwise buy the oem one. This seems pretty simple...

[RimasRS]

Originally Posted by 09BMW335i

Like most people have said you hear a slight ticking at idle/neutral at a light without air on. If you doing like it push the clutch in. ( I would say around a 2-3 with out air/ 4-5 with air)

also the lwfw will make more noise then the SMFW and ALWAYS REPLACE your flywheel. doesnt matter if you have low miles on it.

as far as taking off you need to give it more pedal or ride the clutch a little more. You will get use to it after a week of driving. The clutch and the perfomace are second to none. very little pedal pushing needed when shifting

i dont notice any noise in reverse or 1st gear. I cant stress this enough though...BREAK IN THE CLUTCH....put as many miles on it as you can. Go through all the gears. the more miles the better the clutch will perform. You dont have to baby the clutch however, doing powershifts stc will not help you.

IMO if you are going to spend the money for a stage 2 plus you should spend the extra few hundred and get the SPEC 3 plus you will not regret it.

Thank You guys very helpful. For taking on stg3+ I think it will be to expensive because. I will have to get clutch kit, oem DMF, transmission bolts etc + labor I dont want to do it by my self at least for the first time. So it is already big money.

[RimasRS]

Originally Posted by Torgus

You need to buy a new DMF anyways when you do a clutch.

If you ever think you might get to 500whp or more get the SSMFW. If you want a faster reving engine get the SSMFW

Otherwise buy the oem one. This seems pretty simple...

It would be simple if I would know that stock DMF will hold the power as my stock just died on 30000 km. But I really dont want to make it race car it is still my DD so only if I will have no other choice I will do SMF otherwise will keep the car quite.
You know that some of us cant stand even wastegate rattle so it would be difficult to live with SMF chatter.

[Tim603]

Old thread...I know, I am in the same debacle

I am considering the Spec Stage 2+ w/ steel flywheel, just a little concerned about chatter/driveablilty since this car is my DD through and through.

I plan on upgrading the turbos within a year or so, dont really feel like doing my clutch all over again at that point so thinking this may be the best route.

Thoughts are welcomed

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Tim603

Old thread...I know, I am in the same debacle

I am considering the Spec Stage 2+ w/ steel flywheel, just a little concerned about chatter/driveablilty since this car is my DD through and through.

I plan on upgrading the turbos within a year or so, dont really feel like doing my clutch all over again at that point so thinking this may be the best route.

Thoughts are welcomed

I get this a lot "Plan on upgrading turbo's"....

Are you 1000% sure you plan on upgrading turbo's because 9/10 of those guys that say that, dont.

I always push customers to stay with the DMFW but if you really really really plan on going well over 500WHP then you should just get the SMFW now.

The chatter when you first get the clutch installed will be at it's worst, so it does get better over time.

Although its mentioned in many other forum threads, 500WHP is not a magical number for the DMFW. It's possible a DMFW (IF BRAND NEW) can hold well into the 550WHP range without a hitch.

But most guys have over 50K or even 75K+ miles on their stock DMFW so that's why it cant handle anything over 500WHP usually. It internally becomes imbalanced and what I'm trying to say is nobody has found that magic number that a brand new fresh DMFW can't handle.

[Tim603]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

I get this a lot "Plan on upgrading turbo's"....

Are you 1000% sure you plan on upgrading turbo's because 9/10 of those guys that say that, dont.

I always push customers to stay with the DMFW but if you really really really plan on going well over 500WHP then you should just get the SMFW now.

The chatter when you first get the clutch installed will be at it's worst, so it does get better over time.

Although its mentioned in many other forum threads, 500WHP is not a magical number for the DMFW. It's possible a DMFW (IF BRAND NEW) can hold well into the 550WHP range without a hitch.

But most guys have over 50K or even 75K+ miles on their stock DMFW so that's why it cant handle anything over 500WHP usually. It internally becomes imbalanced and what I'm trying to say is nobody has found that magic number that a brand new fresh DMFW can't handle.

Thanks for the reply Jeff! To answer your question, I am at 100k miles and my turbos aren't going to last forever...When they do fail I will be upgrading to a hybrid turbo.

That being said, I will soon be adding cattless dps, methanol and possibly some fuel mods to accommodate e85. At that point I will need a clutch regardless and just don't feel like doing the job twice if my turbos fail this season, or even next season for that matter.

Turbos are a pricey job in itself and would rather not have to shell out another $1500 in parts for a clutch just to accommodate them

How bad is the chatter you mention, do you get a lot of complaints?

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Tim603

Thanks for the reply Jeff! To answer your question, I am at 100k miles and my turbos aren't going to last forever...When they do fail I will be upgrading to a hybrid turbo.

That being said, I will soon be adding cattless dps, methanol and possibly some fuel mods to accommodate e85. At that point I will need a clutch regardless and just don't feel like doing the job twice if my turbos fail this season, or even next season for that matter.

Turbos are a pricey job in itself and would rather not have to shell out another $1500 in parts for a clutch just to accommodate them

How bad is the chatter you mention, do you get a lot of complaints?

10/10 people know the chatter is coming cause they've done their research.

So as far as complaints, no.

Keep in mind this guy is a full exhaust which drowns out a lot of noise.

[Tim603]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

10/10 people know the chatter is coming cause they've done their research.

So as far as complaints, no.


Keep in mind this guy is a full exhaust which drowns out a lot of noise.

This gives me an excellent idea of what to expect and I think I can handle the noise after hearing it. Thanks for all the help Jeff!!

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Tim603

This gives me an excellent idea of what to expect and I think I can handle the noise after hearing it. Thanks for all the help Jeff!!

No problem. The 2+ clutches and flywheels are stocked readily and available for same day shipment.

[logicc]

is it expected that even with a spec stage 2+ clutch with a new oem dmfw the car should be almost as quiet as stock?

[DR-JEKL]

Is there any differences between the spec or Mfactory SMF? Does one have any advantage over the other?

[Ozzie335i]

Is the Spec 2+ stronger than the 335iS clutch? If so, by how much?

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Originally Posted by rdeterman

SMFW if you planning on making any more power... which im sure if your planning on spending 2k on clutch/flywheel and install you are

and get it in steel.. Something like the SPEC steel or Factory steel are great.. If its a track car you can try an aluminum one.

Mike

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Originally Posted by DR-JEKL

Is there any differences between the spec or Mfactory SMF? Does one have any advantage over the other?

The Factory one is OEM mated so if you are pairing with a SPEC clutch you need to get the OEM version of the clutch, while the SPEC flywheel is paired with a special version of the clutch.

Mike

[Lshaw]

Originally Posted by Tim603

This gives me an excellent idea of what to expect and I think I can handle the noise after hearing it. Thanks for all the help Jeff!!

Its honestly not bad at all. For the performance aspect alone, it is worth it.

I let a local guy check out my car and he was completely surprised on how quiet it was and decided on the spot her was going smfw route.

[Sered]

This is an old thread. But definitely illustrates e90post utter cluelessness to what clutch chatter actually means lol

[Ozzie335i]

Originally Posted by Sered

This is an old thread. But definitely illustrates e90post utter cluelessness to what clutch chatter actually means lol

I think not. Many of us want more power, but are on the fence about this. Do I pour on even more power and have people think my precious BMW sounds like a diesel while picking up my car at the valet? I have an N55, so the MHD will not help me. Others may be in the same boat. BTW, it may be called "clutch chatter," but if you want to be all tech snooty about it, actually it is the gears in the transmission rattling as the the vibration buffer the dmfw provides no longer exists.

[Sered]

Originally Posted by Ozzie335i

I think not. Many of us want more power, but are on the fence about this. Do I pour on even more power and have people think my precious BMW sounds like a diesel while picking up my car at the valet? I have an N55, so the MHD will not help me. Others may be in the same boat. BTW, it may be called "clutch chatter," but if you want to be all tech snooty about it, actually it is the gears in the transmission rattling as the the vibration buffer the dmfw provides no longer exists.

It's not called clutch chatter. That's drivetrain noises. Usually a combination of the TOB and gears. In the BMW case, the DMFW helped mute some of it.

But that's not clutch chatter. Go try and slip a pucked clutch. That's clutch chatter. I have to take every review of every clutch setup on this site now. People complain about clutch chatter and don't even know what it is.

[Ozzie335i]

So Sered, Jeff of TGS is wrong, and 10 out of 10 people discussing it have not actually seen the videos he reposted, and have no idea what they are talking about? Clutch chatter, flywheel chatter. Call it whatever you will, some of us are shying away from the sound when going with a smfw. Happy trolling.

[MFactory]

Actually, he is correct. In the clutch industry, clutch "chatter" is not what what most people here are referring to. What most people here think as "chatter" is actually gear noise/rattle from the transmission.

The DMFW has a dampener that effectively "mutes" the sound. With a SMFW, this removes the dampener, hence the sound gets transmitted through the flywheel. This "rattle" is a completely different thing from "chatter", which is more to do with engagement. Semantics, yes, but if you are in the drivetrain industry, it is what it is.

I still know what you are talking about though

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Ozzie335i

So Sered, Jeff of TGS is wrong, and 10 out of 10 people discussing it have not actually seen the videos he reposted, and have no idea what they are talking about? Clutch chatter, flywheel chatter. Call it whatever you will, some of us are shying away from the sound when going with a smfw. Happy trolling.

Hmm, thanks for the remark but I'll kindly disagree.

In this platform the term "CHATTER" has been taken and used as a direct translation to the "NOISE" created by the use of the SMFW.

In the clutch industry as a whole, chatter typically was related to the engagement of the clutch and the shake or chatter during engagement, typically with 4 puck or 6 puck clutches, depending.

So, no I'm not wrong but thanks for your insight.

Oh and by the way, I didn't make up the term, it's just been widely used in this platform. To me, it sounds like a can of marbles shaking but to repeat that remark across the boards would get tiring, so for now, it's been widely said to be "chatter" for the sake of ease.