[tc535i]

Originally Posted by doughboy

The pin is the main device that holds the strut top in position, the 3 small stud nuts are not meant to stop it moving around.

huh. I hurl my e36 m3 around a track, along with most of my friends, at ridiculous suspension load levels... with only those 3 nuts (well, plus 2 of our own, not including the infamous "nut behind the wheel")

wonder what made them decide it wasn't enough

[Jat]

OK so had the alignment done, and was out by anything major really. They set it to Sport Suspension with lower ride height (rather than Performance Sport Suspension), but the values pretty much mach exactly with what was posted in the printout early in this thread.

Rear camber went from around the -2 mark to around -1.58 (Left) and -1.52 (Right).

[Alex.J]

Originally Posted by Jat

OK so had the alignment done, and was out by anything major really. They set it to Sport Suspension with lower ride height (rather than Performance Sport Suspension), but the values pretty much mach exactly with what was posted in the printout early in this thread.

Rear camber went from around the -2 mark to around -1.58 (Left) and -1.52 (Right).

Great stuff mate!

Let's see if it stops them tyres edges wearing!

Haha

[Jat]

Originally Posted by Alex.J

Great stuff mate!

Let's see if it stops them tyres edges wearing!

Haha

Cheers, bit of toe reduction too, but nothing too major.

Problem next on the list if the rear arch liners rubbing on the tyres. I moved from 255 to 265 and changed brand. bugger to sort now.

[tc535i]

Originally Posted by Jat

Cheers, bit of toe reduction too, but nothing too major.

Problem next on the list if the rear arch liners rubbing on the tyres. I moved from 255 to 265 and changed brand. bugger to sort now.

even the slightest change in toe is signifigant

I like to set my front to 1/16" total toe in, under rolling load the control arm bushing deflects rearward and you get a little toe out, taking it to about neutral

1/8" or so in the back is nice for high speed stability and trying to put power down

[idnan]

Originally Posted by tc535i

huh. I hurl my e36 m3 around a track, along with most of my friends, at ridiculous suspension load levels... with only those 3 nuts (well, plus 2 of our own, not including the infamous "nut behind the wheel")

wonder what made them decide it wasn't enough

I was wondering this too, all aftermarket camber plates don't have the locating holes and they seem to be fine. I have them up front and never had any problems with them moving.

[tc535i]

Originally Posted by idnan

I was wondering this too, all aftermarket camber plates don't have the locating holes and they seem to find. I have them up front and never had any problems with them moving.

I'm thinking it's one of those "somebody said" forum rumor things

[Jat]

Originally Posted by tc535i

even the slightest change in toe is signifigant

I like to set my front to 1/16" total toe in, under rolling load the control arm bushing deflects rearward and you get a little toe out, taking it to about neutral

1/8" or so in the back is nice for high speed stability and trying to put power down

Fair point, and it changed from around 0'11" to 0'09" if my annotations are right.

[doughboy]

Originally Posted by idnan

I was wondering this too, all aftermarket camber plates don't have the locating holes and they seem to be fine. I have them up front and never had any problems with them moving.

Get your point Idnan, but Camber plates are different mechanism altogether and have much stonger clamping sliders and bolts etc, with control of the movement direction, taking the pin out just leaves the strut top floating around in the bolt hole clearances.

Originally Posted by tc535i

I'm thinking it's one of those "somebody said" forum rumor things

Some very competent and experienced 3rd parties said, buy hey you and your "race buddies" know better than the combined $billions of BMW expertise.

That's Cool

[doughboy]

Originally Posted by Jat

Fair point, and it changed from around 0'11" to 0'09" if my annotations are right.

That's still quite neutral Jat.

The standard M3 settings of 0'05" all round give a much more lively feel.

This is easily settable on non M3 models.

We tried various on my 335i and that worked best and really changed the way the car drove just with a tiny change.

[idnan]

Originally Posted by doughboy

Get your point Idnan, but Camber plates are different mechanism altogether and have much stonger clamping sliders and bolts etc, with control of the movement direction, taking the pin out just leaves the strut top floating around in the bolt hole clearances.

Yep saying that I tightened them with far more torque than the originals as they have a completely different design and the studs are much stronger than the oem style top mounts.

I wonder if the m3 strutbrace makes a difference on how much movement there might be once the pins are pulled

[Alex.J]

Originally Posted by doughboy

Alex,

You can't adjust front camber without knocking out the strut top locating pins, which isn't advised. So front camber is was it is, and being lowered it may increase a little which is fine.

Go for M3 settings, I had this on my 335i and it transformed the car.

Standard tourers have a lot of rear neg camber anyway, same as M3 IIRC (-1.5deg?)

Standard tourers also have a lot of rear toe IN which makes the car stable (i.e not want to turn) you want to decrease to M3 toe in which is about 0deg5' IIRC (i.e. 5 minutes or 5/60 of a degree)

The M3 has the same front and rear toe in.

So to summarise:

M3 front toe in
M3 rear toe in
M3 rear camber

We're only talking about fractions of a degree between standard and M3 but it makes a big difference.

Make sure your alignment place gets in spot on, not just in the tolerance band as the bands are so wide.

Thats your lot

Thanks for that mate, Really appreciate that!

Going this week to do it.

[Alex.J]

So if i went for rear camebr of -1.5 both sides, rear toe odeg7 toe both sides

Then front camber as is, and toe of 0deg7 toe both side front.

I will be somewhere between zsp and m3 settings?

Not too lively, but not a total bus?

Thanks

[Alex.J]

Setup complete and drives like a beaut!

I went with -1.5deg camber rear and 0deg7 toe all round.

Thanks all for your help