[hiscapness]

First of all, thanks to everyone who's participated in this thread. It's been very enlightening. I was literally on my way to the dealer today to buy a CPO 07 335xi 4D with 33k miles (premium, sport, nav, parking, jet black/terra). Now, I'm second-guessing. I've owned an Audi A6 '98 and '07 and other than some injector problems and an ungodly appetite for tie rod ends they've been amazingly dependable. This car will be my daily driver; I've also owned a Mazda Protege5 for years that in > 115k has never had ONE problem, ever. So my tolerance for BS factory defects is very low. I've always wanted a BMW and was excited to take the plunge.

So my questions:

[1] has anyone verified that replacement of the HPFP results in the door jamb sticker with code 518 stamped on it that was explained earlier in the post? I would like to check my (potential) new car for this before buying.

[2] how do you ask the SA for the service records? it seems like this is something I would *never* do through the sales person, correct? what should I do, just go to the service department and ask to see the service records? Do I need to do this only with the SA or can any worker bee on the floor help me out?

[3] is there any data on how ECU performance upgrades (JB3, PROCede, Dinan, etc.) affect the reliability of the HPFP?

[4] is there some way I can verify that the HPFP is covered for 120k no matter what the factory warranty is with the dealer before I purchase? no offense, but I've my share of a$$hole dealers that have refused to fix even service bulletin issues in the past and I don't want any surprises...

[5] has anyone pre-emptively had the HPFP replaced before buying as a condition of sale for a CPO?

[alloy]

Just happened yesterday to me. Coming home, got on the beltway and the orange motor came on the driver info center. My 08 E93 went into limp mode in rush hour traffic. Drove carefully in the right lane to BMW of Fairfax. Nice SA (Adrienne). Asked if it had any long cranks (yes). Told her about the rattling from the back end sounded like loose muffler shields. The loose passenger seat that rattles.

They gave me an 08E90 for a loaner. I got on the beltway headed home and noticed that it felt different. When I accelerated full throttle, it snapped and pushed me back into my seat! Whoa! Is this what this is supposed to feel like? My E93 feels ok, but nothing like this E90. Is that because of the added wait of the hard top? I really like acceleration (being a drag strip kind of guy) and the four door 335i felt so much faster than my E93.
My E93 is a nice car with ok acceleration, but this felt like a different animal altogether.

[alloy]

Well, they just called and they are replacing the hpfp. My bimmer will be ready next tuesday.

[jmbgator]

Hi Everyone-

Time for my story....I currently have a 2008 335i E90, stock, with about 30k miles.

1) In January, I started to get the long engine start up cranks which eventually led to the "Engine Malfunction - Reduced Power" light. I took it to the dealer and they replaced the HPFP (881 model)....Car drove like a champ since...

2) In June, I began to experience the long engine cranks again. Based on the symptoms and the posts that I have seen on this forum, I figured it was the HPFP failing again. I figured I would hold off on taking to the dealer until the "Engine Malfunction - Reduced Power" light would come on again. That way, there is proof....A few days later, as expected, the light came back on.

I took the car to the dealership and they kept it overnight. When I got the car back the next day, I was told that they updated the software and that the HPFP did not need to be replaced. This is what the invoice shows:

Job #1
PROBLEM A VEHICLE CRANKS FOR LONG PERIODS BEFORE STARTING
6100812 PROGRAMMING/ENCODING CONTROL UNIT( (N/C)
30649
SIB
INTERROGATED FAULT MEMORY FOUND FAULT FAULT 2FBF. CHECK LOW PRESSURE FUEL SYSTEM AS PER TEST PLAN FOUND OK. PROGRAMMED VEHICLE WITH CAS AS PER TEST PLAN. TEST DROVE AS PER TEST PLAN. CHECK VEHICLE AFTER SITING FOUND /OK CONCERN CORRECTED.

Job #2
PROBLEM B CK ENG LIGHT COMES ON INTERMITTENTLY
NC NO LABOR CHARGE (N/C)
30649
RELATED TO LINE A

After I picked up the car, the long engine cranks went away. There was still maybe a 1-3 second startup, but it was not as bad as it was before. The car drove like a beast...Car blazing fast on acceleration like I've grown to love.

3) About a week later, during a cold start-up one morning, the car rumbled a bit after startup. The engine revs were bouncing up and down between about 700 and 1200 rpms. Then the dreaded "Engine Malfunction - Reduced Power" light came back on again! I scheduled an appointment and spoke to my SA that I had just had the car in 1 week before and that I wanted it fixed. I told my SA that I have been reading plenty of stories online about this problem. The dealership kept the car overnight.

The next day I was advised that I got the HPFP replaced with the 943 version. The invoice states the following:

Job #1
PROBLEM A CK ENG LIGHT COMES ON INTERMITTENTLY & REDUCED POWER - SEE HIST
0058272 SIB (N/C)
1 13-51-7-594-943 HIGH-PRESSURE PUMP:13 (N/C)
30816
HIGH PRESSURE FUEL PUMP
INTERROGATED FAULT MEMROY FOUND FAULT 2FBF IN VEHICLE. PERFORMED SIB
12 PERFORMED LOWER PRESSURE FUEL SYSTEM TEST PLAN FOUND /OK NO
Job #2
PROBLEM FOUND. PERFORMED HIGH PRESSURE TEST PLAN B1214_DI_KDR.
REPLACED HIGH PRESSURE FUEL PUMP. DIAGCODE1350_00000000_02_002. TEST DROVE FOUND /OK CONCERN CORRECTED. ADMIN PAYMENT APPROVED.

The car starts up fine now, but the car definitely does not accelerate like it used to. I barely notice a difference now between D and DS modes....1st and 2nd gear acceleration sucks now. I don't get that "kickback feeling" where my head flies back against the headrest when I am accelerating anymore. I feel like I'm driving an oldsmobile now rather than a turbo charged BMW 335i.

Was this due to the software update? Or due to the 943 pump? When I took it in early June (visit #2) and they just did the software update, the car still accelerated like a monster.

What can I do now to get that acceleration back and power? Any ideas?

Would a JB3 give me that power back?

[John 070]

Originally Posted by TrackRat

Very typical experience. The software update is a bandaid for a failing HPFP as you observed firsthand. Installing a new 943 or 933 HPFP won't cause a loss of power but the software will. Quite a few people with software updates have reported a power loss. This will likely result in another class action lawsuit against BMW like the prior software update that dropped the boost to try and prevent wastegate rattle.

What's amazing is the fuel pump is what, a part that lists for under $300 (933), but they're unwilling to fix it to set a car straight once and for all. Part of the BMW service routine is to make the customer basically experience two reduced power faults before fixing the issue with hardware. Isn't that stupid? The typical 3 driver is compensated in the neighborhood of $70/hr., certainly BMW could respect that their customers don't have all this time to run back and forth 2-3X for one issue.

I'm curious what the reasoning behind the 37.2 software reducing boost was. I thought they goofed on 29.2 and fixed it by 33.1, only to goof again?

[ALLLRIGHTYTHEN]

Originally Posted by alloy

Just happened yesterday to me. Coming home, got on the beltway and the orange motor came on the driver info center. My 08 E93 went into limp mode in rush hour traffic. Drove carefully in the right lane to BMW of Fairfax. Nice SA (Adrienne). Asked if it had any long cranks (yes). Told her about the rattling from the back end sounded like loose muffler shields. The loose passenger seat that rattles.

They gave me an 08E90 for a loaner. I got on the beltway headed home and noticed that it felt different. When I accelerated full throttle, it snapped and pushed me back into my seat! Whoa! Is this what this is supposed to feel like? My E93 feels ok, but nothing like this E90. Is that because of the added wait of the hard top? I really like acceleration (being a drag strip kind of guy) and the four door 335i felt so much faster than my E93.
My E93 is a nice car with ok acceleration, but this felt like a different animal altogether.

That is what is happened to me as well. I owned an 2007 E93, then traded it in for and 207 E90. The E93 had too many issues with the top, which I prefer not to discuss in this thread.

As for quickness, the E90 is lighter, does not have the flex in the body roll that the E93 had, and in IMHO is faster. I noticed it right away. I noticed this upon the test drive. Now, once I owned the E90, I too had to replace the HPFP in the first week of ownership. The E90 seems to be quicker since replacing that as well. I am not sure if it would make a difference on the E93, as I did not have to replace it on the E93 during ownership of that car.

[ALLLRIGHTYTHEN]

Originally Posted by John 070

What's amazing is the fuel pump is what, a part that lists for under $300 (933), but they're unwilling to fix it to set a car straight once and for all. Part of the BMW service routine is to make the customer basically experience two reduced power faults before fixing the issue with hardware. Isn't that stupid? The typical 3 driver is compensated in the neighborhood of $70/hr., certainly BMW could respect that their customers don't have all this time to run back and forth 2-3X for one issue.

I'm curious what the reasoning behind the 37.2 software reducing boost was. I thought they goofed on 29.2 and fixed it by 33.1, only to goof again?

Here is my experience with the S/W upgrade and newer (refurbed) 933 HPFP. It's awesome all around! With both the S/W upgrade, which BMW had to do first according to BMW N/A process, then with the 933 HPFP installed, I noticed increased HP and quickness all around. My experience may not be what others are having, but I do know that with both the S/W upgrade and the newer HPFP, I had better power all around.

Now, please take note, I am not saying whichever one is causing the increased power performance. I am simply saying I had both done, and so far I am happy. The increased power could simply be the 933 vs the S/W upgrade.

[ALLLRIGHTYTHEN]

Originally Posted by jmbgator

Hi Everyone-

Time for my story....I currently have a 2008 335i E90, stock, with about 30k miles.

1) In January, I started to get the long engine start up cranks which eventually led to the "Engine Malfunction - Reduced Power" light. I took it to the dealer and they replaced the HPFP (881 model)....Car drove like a champ since...

2) In June, I began to experience the long engine cranks again. Based on the symptoms and the posts that I have seen on this forum, I figured it was the HPFP failing again. I figured I would hold off on taking to the dealer until the "Engine Malfunction - Reduced Power" light would come on again. That way, there is proof....A few days later, as expected, the light came back on.

I took the car to the dealership and they kept it overnight. When I got the car back the next day, I was told that they updated the software and that the HPFP did not need to be replaced. This is what the invoice shows:



After I picked up the car, the long engine cranks went away. There was still maybe a 1-3 second startup, but it was not as bad as it was before. The car drove like a beast...Car blazing fast on acceleration like I've grown to love.

3) About a week later, during a cold start-up one morning, the car rumbled a bit after startup. The engine revs were bouncing up and down between about 700 and 1200 rpms. Then the dreaded "Engine Malfunction - Reduced Power" light came back on again! I scheduled an appointment and spoke to my SA that I had just had the car in 1 week before and that I wanted it fixed. I told my SA that I have been reading plenty of stories online about this problem. The dealership kept the car overnight.

The next day I was advised that I got the HPFP replaced with the 943 version. The invoice states the following:



The car starts up fine now, but the car definitely does not accelerate like it used to. I barely notice a difference now between D and DS modes....1st and 2nd gear acceleration sucks now. I don't get that "kickback feeling" where my head flies back against the headrest when I am accelerating anymore. I feel like I'm driving an oldsmobile now rather than a turbo charged BMW 335i.

Was this due to the software update? Or due to the 943 pump? When I took it in early June (visit #2) and they just did the software update, the car still accelerated like a monster.

What can I do now to get that acceleration back and power? Any ideas?

Would a JB3 give me that power back?

You need to take it back to the dealer. I just had the S/W upgrade and nwer (refurbed) 933 HPFP installed and I am experiencing way better performance. Switching from D to D/S is night and day better performance.

[saeyedoc]

Update:
Got a call yesterday morning that my car was ready. I asked ft the HPFP had been replaced and they told me they did the software upgrade, test drove if for 15 minutes and all was good. I laughed and told the SA that would most likely only be a bandaid but that's I'd pick it up. After 15 minutes, I gunned it up a hill and it went into limp mode again.
Went right back, showed them the code before turning it off and got back in the same loaner I had just dropped off. Was a different SA that day, it was already late Sat morning and he told me they'd call Monday.
What should my approach be if they don't just replace the HPFP this time? (Although I'd be surprised and very disappointed if they don't).

[chromisdesigns]

Originally Posted by saeyedoc

Update:
What should my approach be if they don't just replace the HPFP this time? (Although I'd be surprised and very disappointed if they don't).

Have them get with the regional BMW engineer to authorize the repair. If you are getting pump failure codes, you should get a new pump. End of discussion. If no pump-specific codes, at least they should pressure-test the pump and replace it if it fails the testing.

[IN54NITY]

The song remains the same, it's a good Led Zepplin song, but a bad BMW one.

[jmbgator]

Originally Posted by TrackRat

Very typical experience. The software update is a bandaid for a failing HPFP as you observed firsthand. Installing a new 943 or 933 HPFP won't cause a loss of power but the software will. Quite a few people with software updates have reported a power loss. This will likely result in another class action lawsuit against BMW like the prior software update that dropped the boost to try and prevent wastegate rattle.

Strange that after they did the software update the first time I took it in June, my car was still accelerating fine and had plenty of power. But when I took it the second time where they replaced the fuel pump, I noticed the lack in acceleration.

Does anyone know if they update the software again the second time you take it in and they actually replace the pump?

[Quisp]

Had a bad rattling for some time and reduced acceleeration. Took it in and was told wastegates need to be replaced. While waiting for the parts I had two limp modes in one day while attempting to pass in the high speed lane and had reduced acceleration and long cranks prior to that. Thought that it was the HPFP as did several other knowledgeable people. Dealership told me that the limp and lomng cranks were from the wastegates also and that should be gone when those get replaced. Did not know that HPFP and wastegates had that many common symptoms. Has anyone else heard this from the SA also?

[fuzion23]

Just great my fuel pump finally ate it at 4k miles.... It's only 6 month old. Waiting for Roadside Assistance. If I was in the freeway I would be in trouble. Sigh. Hope the new pump solve the problem.

[q8-tii]

Got an 09 335i first HPFP failed at 14,000 Miles through rough shaking and the car suddenly stopping on the highway (29DC and 2FbF Codes). Second HPFP replaced at 23,000 Miles with the same symptoms as the first. Now on my Third HPFP with the new software update, but been getting long cranks 2 weeks and 500 Miles after the install, my SA told me they replaced it with the new HPFP but i refuse to believe him for some reason >.<. Ill will try replacing Sparkplugs and Injectors to see if the problems and the new 2FBE code gets thrown away. Really a PITA taking some mods off going to the dealer and acting stupid in front of them. Ill most certainly be the first to invest in that aftermarket fuel pump when it get into production.

Sorry guys i just got to vent about this problem, really love the car and its potential.

[gizmo335i]

There's an aftermarket fuel pump? Did I miss something trackrat?

Damn, you live in Kuwait? Are you American? I've been there three times....Kuwait city is alright..but damn it's hot there..

I'm starting to think that there's something that the factory workers are doing on the line to cause this...since it's so random...it just doesn't make sense. I just think there's some little thing that's done in production that isn't done on others....that's just part of the routine....or it's not done right or something.....

I'm ranting now too...sorry....

[q8-tii]

Originally Posted by gizmo335i

There's an aftermarket fuel pump? Did I miss something trackrat?

Damn, you live in Kuwait? Are you American? I've been there three times....Kuwait city is alright..but damn it's hot there..

I'm starting to think that there's something that the factory workers are doing on the line to cause this...since it's so random...it just doesn't make sense. I just think there's some little thing that's done in production that isn't done on others....that's just part of the routine....or it's not done right or something.....

I'm ranting now too...sorry....

The aftermarket pump is still in the making, i would patiently wait but 2 years is my limit .

Sorry but i dont want to go off topic so ill PM you the rest.

[zeenon53]

This is ridiculous that BMW can't figure out what is up with these pumps after so many years.

[MeanMangoMan]

Why no just bypass it and hook the fuel line direct to the turbo?

[IN54NITY]

Originally Posted by MeanMangoMan

Why no just bypass it and hook the fuel line direct to the turbo?

Good one. You mean the exhaust system ~after~ the turbos, right? In turbine talk those are called afterburners. I want your exhaust system! Would this pass in CA though?

[MeanMangoMan]

Originally Posted by aleckzandr

Good one. You mean the exhaust system ~after~ the turbos, right? In turbine talk those are called afterburners. I want your exhaust system! Would this pass in CA though?

I love my exhaust system! Yes, afterburners is what I meant
I think it would be fine in Cali, its just loud. Still passes, no engine lights

[itsgotime]

why cant the use the fuel pumps from the m3 or the 550?? wouldnt that do the trick? dont flame me for the question either =/