[Sleeper]

Manual because it’s becoming a rarity, not because it’s better.

In my F95 X5M daily, I have the xHP transmission tune (obtain a license to flash your TCU) to make things snappier on the 8-speed AT. Stage 3 OTS is damn near as snappy and aggressive as my old F80 DCT with GTS TCU flash. For the auto M2 guys, I highly recommend - you’ll be fooled into thinking BMW snuck a DCT into the car.

But even with that positive experience with xHP, I still went with the manual M2 for my summer/track car without a second thought - a RWD manual in an enthusiast-friendly platform is a special thing. We won’t have them in pure ICE format for much longer, so I’ll enjoy them while I can.

[TiresAlwaysFlat]

I just finished driving a 3 hour bumper to bumper traffic.. I still wouldn't trade in my manual for an auto.

[DBV]

Last M car with a manual. /thread


Jokes aside, while it would be nice to have another gear up top (spend a good amount of time on the autobahn), I just love the involvement of the manual shifter. Get a clutch stop, and you'll have so much fun, even just driving around town. If you're not looking to break 1/4 mile records, and win stop light races, it should be a no-brainer if you like the connection a manual provides. No regrets.

[Resoelg]

Had enough of AT.

[kyrix1st]

Note my comments are all in connection with manual shifting. I don't like cars that shift for the highest fuel economy, something every AT does quite frequently.

No, the ZF8 slushbox can't match the M-DCT let alone 8PDK from even the base 992. ZF8's downshifts in particular are so slow I can do better with 6MT.
On the other hand, M-DCT in competition+ models remain some of the fastest shifting models I've experienced to date. Shame on BMW for not offering it.

[mh4k]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

Note my comments are all in connection with manual shifting. I don't like cars that shift for the highest fuel economy, something every AT does quite frequently.

No, the ZF8 slushbox can't match the M-DCT let alone 8PDK from even the base 992. ZF8's downshifts in particular are so slow I can do better with 6MT.
On the other hand, M-DCT in competition+ models remain some of the fastest shifting models I've experienced to date. Shame on BMW for not offering it.

Transmission in S never shifts by itself except to avoid a stall. And again in mode 3 shifts are violently quick. Maybe not objectively as quick as the DCT. But it’s not a big deal.

[BroDoze]

Is the upcoming auto-only G87 M2CS the same ZF8 as the normal G87?

[iifymbro]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

....ZF8's downshifts in particular are so slow I can do better with 6MT.....

[MMMGuy60]

99% of manual driver will not want an automatic unless they have medical condition. It is always the other way around, auto driver regret not getting manual. Never the other way around. Even a DCT can't tempt manual driver away, why would a slush box will now?

[kyrix1st]

Originally Posted by iifymbro

Trust me, I do.

[islandfalconer]

Well I can say after having an M4 Competition in the garage with the Auto in it, I’ll be very happy to get my Manual M2 back. The Auto is a nice transmission. It’s quick, it shifts well. It takes 100% of the fun out of driving a sports car.

[iifymbro]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

Trust me, I do.

....you don't. Also your driving needs a lot of work but we won't go into that here cause it seems like you think highly of it.

[kyrix1st]

Originally Posted by iifymbro

....you don't. Also your driving needs a lot of work but we won't go into that here cause it seems like you think highly of it.

This was at a festival where we tooled around with students interested in cars. (powersliding on heated RS4s isn't easy I tell you)

I was only talking about the shifts itself. Go compare your zf8 downshifts.

[sebaflex]

Manual for sure. If I wanted an auto I would’ve probably just bought a 240.

[MineralGreyMetallic]

Not for a second.

[iifymbro]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

This was at a festival where we tooled around with students interested in cars. (powersliding on heated RS4s isn't easy I tell you)

I was only talking about the shifts itself. Go compare your zf8 downshifts.

yeah the downshifts with ZF8 are faster, you do know that it has 3 settings on it right... 3rd setting is faster then anyone can downshift a manual. I drove manuals for 15 years straight before this

[Mark_17]

I only ended up with a BMW because it was the only interesting car with a manual.

If you don't want to shift, get an auto. It is your car, get what you want.

An additional 40 torque doesn't WOW me. Where is it in the curve? I'd bet money it isn't in the mid-range and is 6000+. I don't spend much time there and neither does OP, you won't know the difference.

When I want more power, I'll do supporting mods and have it tuned. I'll end up with more power than I could ever use on the street with street tires.

[Celestion]

Originally Posted by iifymbro

I get in, hit M1 button which is set for manual shifting (among other things) and drive off

I have my m2 button set to the most extreme settings with dsc fully off and manual gear selection. Still doesn't wake me up... and I never enter a flow state with the auto unless I'm at a track.

It is not about being able to choose your gear, it is about the art of shifting. Put another way, the stuff that happens in-between gears is what's so appealing about about a 6MT. That's what the auto camp seems to miss. In an auto/dct car, you aren't shifting gears, you are selecting gears via button presses.

Auto-tune is to singing, as auto/dct is to shifting. If you want a pitch perfect voice, just use auto-tune. The focus and coordination needed to perform well is what makes any performance fun. Doesn't matter if its a sport, music, shifting etc. The ZF8 abstracts the perfect shift down to a simple button press thereby removing all the fun for me (unless I'm at a race track).

[iifymbro]

Originally Posted by Celestion

I have my m2 button set to the most extreme settings with dsc fully off and manual gear selection. Still doesn't wake me up... and I never enter a flow state with the auto unless I'm at a track.

It is not about being able to choose your gear, it is about the art of shifting. Put another way, the stuff that happens in-between gears is what's so appealing about about a 6MT. That's what the auto camp seems to miss. In an auto/dct car, you aren't shifting gears, you are selecting gears via button presses.

Auto-tune is to singing, as auto/dct is to shifting. If you want a pitch perfect voice, just use auto-tune. The focus and coordination needed to perform well is what makes any performance fun. Doesn't matter if its a sport, music, shifting etc. The ZF8 abstracts the perfect shift down to a simple button press thereby removing all the fun for me (unless I'm at a race track).

Over the years I started resenting the forced lull in acceleration that manuals bring on upshifts more then I enjoyed the act of upshifting, just wanna keep accelerating but no have to completely release the throttle and row my gear then re-apply throttle and spool the turbos back up to where they were and THEN I get to resume accelerating. Banging up through the shorter ZF8 gears in the 3rd setting is pretty awesome, love hitting multiple quick short shifts in a row while never losing boost.

rev matching downshifts into a corner will never be beat by a auto box though. Most of the time you're just rolling up to a traffic light/stop sign though so don't even get to do that properly that often in road cars.

I think I'm just on the other side of the manual narrative from most people, I'm coming off 15 years of only driving manuals while a lot of other guys are coming off years of autos and want that magic of a manual back in their life, there's no wrong answer it's a personal decision.

[Celestion]

Originally Posted by iifymbro

I think I'm just on the other side of the manual narrative from most people, I'm coming off 15 years of only driving manuals while a lot of other guys are coming off years of autos and want that magic of a manual back in their life, there's no wrong answer it's a personal decision.

Agreed! In terms of engine dynamics the auto is superior, and the trade off of a more engaging transmission is a less engaging engine in this car. If only I could have both without having to buy a 911 GT3...

[Ginster6]

I went from dream car at that time Focus RS MT to my other dream Car Alfa Quilia QV AT. and got bored and when back to MT starting with my G80 to now my G87. I may one day get tired and bored with an MT and then get back into AT.
And I live in the city of hills and traffic all over now.

[Geighty7]

Originally Posted by aerobod

No, whole reason for us buying the M2 over any other BMW was for the manual. Wouldn't have bought it if it was auto-only.

This is the only answer needed here. Great job summing it up in 2 sentences.