[jirka330i]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

Aged sensor - you can buy the sensor separately,you need a 8 wire sensor and stainless crimp clamps... in Germany there used to be a company called NOX sensor shop and they sold a kit with all the bits..

I do not think you can get a good and reliable nox probe on the market...ngk as the major player controls the distribution to the big boys like continental etc.
However, the replacement probe with 8 wires could be as good as the bosch probe in noxem...if it measures lambda like bosch and delivers an electric signal in the range similar to ngk probe, and will be able to communicate with continental unit then it would be a good deal I guess.
As for the sonic cleaning ...I went to guys who succesfully clean wideband probes but the operation did not revive my old probe...and I was also told that due to the fact that nox probes have rhodium inside which is ultra sensitive the success was a mission impossible...

[jirka330i]

Originally Posted by schriss

I don't think it's a battery, if it needed to save some data for power-loss situation thats done with eproms I think.
I might put loads of silicon grease on my NOXEM when we install it It does seem like it's closed shut for good, can't even see any gap between plastic and metal.
Re original NOX sensors they just last for a given mileage, like 100k. Sensor is the problem, not electronics, sensor simply clogs up more and more, or so I read. Mine is like that. INPA shows Offset value outside of range. Also it reports over 200ppm of nox when driving, not sure if that's supposed to be so much.

I would not put any silicone on noxem....you risk a refusal of the warranty in case you would send it back with a claim....in my case the were trying to find any reason to make the claim complicated
It should be them delivering the product fit to the purpose as they are quite critical themselves on the others

[schriss]

Originally Posted by jirka330i

I would not put any silicone on noxem....you risk a refusal of the warranty in case you would send it back with a claim....in my case the were trying to find any reason to make the claim complicated
It should be them delivering the product fit to the purpose as they are quite critical themselves on the others

Same as insurance companies, makes sense. I'll just put it in as it is.

[jirka330i]

Originally Posted by aaronblack

From everything that has been said it seems that the most reliable options (subjective) in order are:

1- Map-out
2- NOxEM
3- OEM NOx

NOxEM seems to have some quality issues, yet some have also had great success! Map-out seems better as it has no sensors/ecu etc yet no remapper has confirm all 3 stages in any my emails!

I'll call Map-tech and see whether they'll confirm the 3 stages.

As I have not heard any satisfactory reply from UK tuners, I contacted couple of German tuners and at least 2 confirmed proven Nox Map-out solution incl. references; however not willing to sell the respective file (respectively adjust my MSD80original file) and send it to me...only possibility to come there and do it in their garage....and as it was north of Germany (Hannover) I continued my search and found a guy here in Czech who is more of a car software engineer (specialized in bmw and vag) rather than a tuner; he confirmed ability to do map-out as well for N53/MSD80. He did a read-out of my ecu last weekend (free of charge) and promised to prepare an adjusted file by the end of November...so if he succeeds I will be running nox free car in 2020 and can exchange the oem middle pipe to something like supersprint . The good thing here is that if the solution does not work I can get back the original file as well as 80% of the money...so the risk is less than 50eur

[schriss]

How do you then flash the adjusted file? And what cable needed?
I wonder what is the difference between NOX map-out and NOXEM in relation to emissions. I wonder if my car with NOXEM will pass them at all... I do think they measure CO2 only, not nox on petrol cars but who knows.

[Dormermike]

Correct, co2 only. N53 NOX is less than a current 520d

[jirka330i]

Originally Posted by schriss

How do you then flash the adjusted file? And what cable needed?
I wonder what is the difference between NOX map-out and NOXEM in relation to emissions. I wonder if my car with NOXEM will pass them at all... I do think they measure CO2 only, not nox on petrol cars but who knows.

You need Kess for flashing....ideally original as msd80 is a bit "fragile"...msd81 is much better

both nox map-out and emulator are equal in relation to emissions. Even if they measured nox emissions for petrol cars I think there is a good chance to pass with map-out as highest nox emissions are in the stratified mode while in the homogenous they are very low; I wonder if the inspectors are so educated in these modes of one specific n53 engine from bmw...would be good to know what approach they have. In my country there is definitely no nox emission measure for petrol engines with Euro5...

[aaronblack]

Originally Posted by jirka330i

Please let us know...I already had experience 3) and 2)...so cant wait to get the last one as well :-)

Originally Posted by jirka330i

Please let us know...I already had experience 3) and 2)...so cant wait to get the last one as well :-)

Update, I phoned ProMap specifically asking about stratified mode and as expected no answer. Either they don't fully understand or just don't want to confirm Incase after the delete it doesn't function fully.

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by jirka330i

Well....both tuners mentioned above were quick to reply on remap pricing but none of them able or willing to answer question whether remap allows all 3 modes of n53. The only way to find that is then the practical experience and observing with INPA which can monitor switching of the modes...anyone did this already?

Originally Posted by jirka330i

Well....both tuners mentioned above were quick to reply on remap pricing but none of them able or willing to answer question whether remap allows all 3 modes of n53. The only way to find that is then the practical experience and observing with INPA which can monitor switching of the modes...anyone did this already?

Yes me

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by jirka330i

You need Kess for flashing....ideally original as msd80 is a bit "fragile"...msd81 is much better

both nox map-out and emulator are equal in relation to emissions. Even if they measured nox emissions for petrol cars I think there is a good chance to pass with map-out as highest nox emissions are in the stratified mode while in the homogenous they are very low; I wonder if the inspectors are so educated in these modes of one specific n53 engine from bmw...would be good to know what approach they have. In my country there is definitely no nox emission measure for petrol engines with Euro5...

Originally Posted by jirka330i

Well....both tuners mentioned above were quick to reply on remap pricing but none of them able or willing to answer question whether remap allows all 3 modes of n53. The only way to find that is then the practical experience and observing with INPA which can monitor switching of the modes...anyone did this already?

Did you get this up and running be interested to
Know the outcome

[AUDELA]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

I doubt any will confirm it, they do not have the in-depth knowledge or the engine and the ecu.

Please make sure you have inpa and understand how to reset adaptations.. adaptations will also cause issues with running all 3 modes.. msd80 is ultra sensitive, also confirm which firmware you are running bimmerproffs have a really good page on tests they have do e with different firmware.

Will - thanks so much for all your input here and on your other posts.


I recently purchased a 2007 325i N53 3.0L (with MT6) and just discovered the NOX sensor errors. Am debating which route to go:

1) OEM NOX — of course my local Indy and BMW specialist both recommend OEM NOX sensor (at a cost of nearly £500 with labor) - they claim the NOXEM will cause issues down the line with the cats.

2) NOX & secondary cat Delete — have spoken to both Maptech and Promap and it's around £200 on top of the Stage 1 remap. So basically remap + NOX for same price as just fitting the OEM

3) NOXEM - it seems quality of production may be an issue. And not sure who I could get to fit it.

The remap and NOX delete option seems most interesting route given the performance boost — although I've not got INPA nor the knowledge of how to do the resets you talk about.

Any further suggestions would be more than appreciated. Thanks !

[aaronblack]

I would personally talk to the remappers and confirm with them that stratified mode works with the nox delete. I wasn't able to get them to confirm this and since I've sold the car.

However, I think the safest option is NOxEM unless you get a confirmation from the tuner and after the delete you check with INPA etc. If the car is running stratified.

[AUDELA]

Originally Posted by aaronblack

I would personally talk to the remappers and confirm with them that stratified mode works with the nox delete. I wasn't able to get them to confirm this and since I've sold the car.

However, I think the safest option is NOxEM unless you get a confirmation from the tuner and after the delete you check with INPA etc. If the car is running stratified.

Thanks. Good suggestion. Will definitely call Maptech and ask. I emailed Promap but they haven't replied, whereas they were quick to reply on first emails regarding price.

My only other concern with the delete is that you can't easily go back from what I understand?

[aaronblack]

Originally Posted by AUDELA

Thanks. Good suggestion. Will definitely call Maptech and ask. I emailed Promap but they haven't replied, whereas they were quick to reply on first emails regarding price.

My only other concern with the delete is that you can't easily go back from what I understand?

That's correct, to my understanding once you map it out you really can't go back.

I had the same issue with all of them. They all replied fairly quickly regarding price etc. However once I questioned them about stratified mode, I got no response.

[AUDELA]

Originally Posted by aaronblack

That's correct, to my understanding once you map it out you really can't go back.

I had the same issue with all of them. They all replied fairly quickly regarding price etc. However once I questioned them about stratified mode, I got no response.

Same here. Never heard back.

I did find a couple companies selling NOX sensors at a much lower price. Wonder if anyone has used or know if they're any good?

Xenons4U (in UK)
https://xenons4u.co.uk/nox-sensors/bmw-nox-sensors.html

FSP Performance (Dutch company)
https://www.noxsensorshop.com/nox-se...w-nox-sensors/


There are also a couple of local U.K. shops on EBay selling "Original BMW" sensors for nearly £200 less than the price from BMW.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Original-...-/163373471610

This one has 9 positive reviews and appears to have sold 95 of them. I messaged one of the people who left review and he said it worked perfectly, cleared his codes and he would recommend.

Curious if anyone else has experience buying OEM from EBay? Does make you wonder how they can sell them so cheaply.

Although this makes the NOXEM option less attractive if an OEM replacement is about same price.

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by AUDELA

Same here. Never heard back.

I did find a couple companies selling NOX sensors at a much lower price. Wonder if anyone has used or know if they're any good?

Xenons4U (in UK)
https://xenons4u.co.uk/nox-sensors/bmw-nox-sensors.html

FSP Performance (Dutch company)
https://www.noxsensorshop.com/nox-se...w-nox-sensors/


There are also a couple of local U.K. shops on EBay selling "Original BMW" sensors for nearly £200 less than the price from BMW.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Original-...-/163373471610

This one has 9 positive reviews and appears to have sold 95 of them. I messaged one of the people who left review and he said it worked perfectly, cleared his codes and he would recommend.

Curious if anyone else has experience buying OEM from EBay? Does make you wonder how they can sell them so cheaply.

Although this makes the NOXEM option less attractive if an OEM replacement is about same price.

No tuner will state this partly they don't know and partly there are lot of reasons why a car won't run stratified


The ebay sensors are China copies and are not genuine - perhaps they are just relaying a signal back to the dme without actually reading Nox etc - hard to tell with the right equipment.

The replacement sensors from Nox sensor shop etc appear to be replacement genuine Nox sensors.

[AUDELA]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

The ebay sensors are China copies and are not genuine - perhaps they are just relaying a signal back to the dme without actually reading Nox etc - hard to tell with the right equipment.

The replacement sensors from Nox sensor shop etc appear to be replacement genuine Nox sensors.

So you think the ones at NOX sensor shop would be worth a go?

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by AUDELA

So you think the ones at NOX sensor shop would be worth a go?

Originally Posted by AUDELA

So you think the ones at NOX sensor shop would be worth a go?

Or Amazon at least they are easy on returns

[4foothill]

You might have more luck asking the tuners if they code out the DTC (basically disable the error code) or if they use a third party tool like Swiftec (which emulates the sensor values and would most likely support stratified).

[0l0dom0l0]

I can answer a few questions about the OEM NOX Sensor.

Buying a complete new unit in unnecessary. All you need to do is replace the NOX probe with any NGK 8 wire sensor.

For me I found a cheap second hand BMW NOX sensor from an X5 4.0d. I cut the old sensor off which had a failed heating element and cut the 'new' sensor off, soldering the new sensor on to the car. Then registered a new NOX sensor and deleted adaptions.

The solution worked perfectly and the car is showing no errors for the NOX sensor itself. It worked in all modes etc etc.

BUT before spending any money or time on the NOX sensor you need to see if you have the 30E9 code for NOX Catalyst aging. I had this code and read on the internet it would eventually come back even after registering a new NOX cat and fixing any issues with the sensor. I thought for £40 I would try a bottle of cataclean, replacement of the sensor and registering a new cat to see if this was true.

8 months (6000 miles) I can tell you the aging catalyst is back. The car worked perfectly and switched modes as it should, did regens etc all normally until one day it stopped going into stratified mode with no faults present and approx 1000 miles later, 30E9 is back.

So the long and short of it is, if you have 30E9 you have no other option other than Noxem, replacement of the NOX catalysts or a remap. Replacing the sensor for a working one at this point is only a short term solution.

Personally I will be going down the route of NOXEM. I do not think there is anyone that understands these engines in enough detail to sort them out properly with a remap.

[AUDELA]

Originally Posted by 0l0dom0l0

I can answer a few questions about the OEM NOX Sensor.

Buying a complete new unit in unnecessary. All you need to do is replace the NOX probe with any NGK 8 wire sensor.

For me I found a cheap second hand BMW NOX sensor from an X5 4.0d. I cut the old sensor off which had a failed heating element and cut the 'new' sensor off, soldering the new sensor on to the car. Then registered a new NOX sensor and deleted adaptions.

The solution worked perfectly and the car is showing no errors for the NOX sensor itself. It worked in all modes etc etc.

BUT before spending any money or time on the NOX sensor you need to see if you have the 30E9 code for NOX Catalyst aging. I had this code and read on the internet it would eventually come back even after registering a new NOX cat and fixing any issues with the sensor. I thought for £40 I would try a bottle of cataclean, replacement of the sensor and registering a new cat to see if this was true.

8 months (6000 miles) I can tell you the aging catalyst is back. The car worked perfectly and switched modes as it should, did regens etc all normally until one day it stopped going into stratified mode with no faults present and approx 1000 miles later, 30E9 is back.

So the long and short of it is, if you have 30E9 you have no other option other than Noxem, replacement of the NOX catalysts or a remap. Replacing the sensor for a working one at this point is only a short term solution.

Personally I will be going down the route of NOXEM. I do not think there is anyone that understands these engines in enough detail to sort them out properly with a remap.

Did you try a manual regen?

[0l0dom0l0]

Yes, multiple times. But there is no NOX in the catalyst to regen as the car does not enter stratified mode so the value is fixed at about 170mg.

I only ever did one manual regen but it wasn't really necessary. The car sorted itself out fine and never threw me the sulphised code. I checked the NOX concentration regularly using Carly and after a long drive it was always sub 200mg.