[audikiller1]

Hey I am in Kansas city Missouri and having the same issue, I am trying to find a way to fix it without spending an arm and a leg, would anyone let me borrow the crankshaft seal tool? willing to give collateral and pay for shipping. 816-394-3039

[mweisdorfer]

Sealant - loctite 193140 (83190439030) - $50.00

Primer - loctite 171000 (83197515683) - $12-15.00

Crankshaft Seal - 11117547842 (BMW e60, 82, 90)

New belt - CRP - 7K1855 (for an N54) / $18-20.00

BMW Needle for Sealant - 83192345991

Front seal tool or front & rear seal tool.

CTA 7643 gives you the tools for the front & the rear

Remember the RMS (rear main seal) is a "known" seal to go on an e90 about every 75-90,000 miles.

You can buy the front tools only for around $200-225.00. The RMS tool is about $100-125.00 there of, if you buy them separately.

I bought the CTA 7643 for $350.00 out the door on Amazon. It was slightly used. When I got it, it looked like it had been used once or twice to be honest.

You can always try and find a site on-line to see if you can rent it. eEuroparts does.

[audikiller1]

thank you! I will check out eeuroparts, im trying to see if anyone in the kc bwm club might have one they just aren't quick about responding and its a pretty specific part

[mweisdorfer]

Originally Posted by kennydawgg

Do you have any leaks with that gasket maker? The recommended on the M5 through BMW is loctite 193140 the dealer said it is the same recommended for N54. The one shown in the picture is the one for the differential but If it works Ill go with that one as its 1/2 the price.

Agreed. I called my local BMW Dealer and talked to the Parts Mgr. The Bentley Repair Manual lists loctite sealant 128357, which does not exist any longer. Loctite 193140 replaces it. The BMW part no. Is 83190439030. It's about $50.00

The sealant primer is still 171000, which has a BMW part no. of 83197515683

I initially ordered the Loctite 5970 and tried to use it. There is no way you can stick the plastic nose of the bottle between the seal groove and the hub. There is no gap to do that. At least on my N54, that's how it is. My N54 is an early model from 01/07. I installed the gasket flush to the block with the tool that came with the kit I bought. Again, no gap for a plastic nozzle to squeeze in there between the block & the gasket and inject gasket maker, at the seam of the engine block.

So, I had to get another gasket & order Loctite 193140. This sealant has a syringe type needle, as pictured in the Bentley Repair Manual.

There's nothing like doing the job (2x).

I'll update the forum on my results. If all else fails and I have to do this a 3rd time, I'll use Ultra Black Gasket Maker. I used this in conjunction with the seal on the VC, and it worked like a charm there.

Ok. Update ———

Just got the 2nd seal and loctite 193140 from FCP Euro. Paid $28.00 for overnight shipping. They don't give you the freaking needle to screw onto the cap of the sealant bottle, yet they charge you $50.00 for like 2oz of sealant. Not only that, but there are warnings all over the bottle & packaging that this stuff causes cancer!!!! This is absurd and ludicrous. I'm sending this crap back and using Ultra black. Tried to call FCP. Their customer service closes at 2:00pm on Friday. WTF....

Note: ECS tuning does have a kit with the needle, primer and some sort of sealing tool for $127.00.

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...83190439030kt/

Had I known that to begin with, that's the route I would have gone. Too late. I'm using Ultra Black. Car has been sitting up on two jack stands for a week. Holiday weekend fostered this time span to be sure.

I put a bead of Ultra Grey just inside the lip of the opening; I then slathered it all over the outside and inside of the gasket. I half installed it and put a small amount in the divots, of the gasket, where the block meets the crank case seems. I then Installed it the rest of the way and then ran a bead on the outside of the crank case seems, as well as on top of the gasket. Sort of like sealing up a window or caulking the metal seams of the shell of a glass shower door, when you first install it. As the DIRECTIONS state, you have to wait 24 hours for Ultra Grey to FULLY cure. So, I won't start the car and check for leaks until that time period is up.

Ultra Grey is for areas that have high amounts of vibration. Aka belts & pulley area.

[fazman]

So at what mileage are you guys looking to do this job at for the Front Main Seal? I'm about 160k miles and still have the stock FMS and RMS as well as the stock vacuum lines on the n54 for 2008.

[mweisdorfer]

Originally Posted by fazman

So at what mileage are you guys looking to do this job at for the Front Main Seal? I'm about 160k miles and still have the stock FMS and RMS as well as the stock vacuum lines on the n54 for 2008.

If don't have any leaks, I wouldn't replace them proactively. Honestly, if the power steering pulley didn't hit the subframe and chip, which resulted in the belt fraying snd then wrapping around the crank and puncturing the front crank seal, I'd still have my OEM seal. This all happened due to faulty O34 engine mounts, which were supposed to be equal to if not slightly better than OEM.

I am a little shocked that your rear main seal is still original. You have an N54/55?? Correct.

I would tell you to replace your engine & trans mounts, if they are original and you are at 160,000 miles. Either go OEM or get an upgraded set. Just stay away from 034.

[fazman]

Originally Posted by mweisdorfer

If don't have any leaks, I wouldn't replace them proactively. Honestly, if the power steering pulley didn't hit the subframe and chip, which resulted in the belt fraying snd then wrapping around the crank and puncturing the front crank seal, I'd still have my OEM seal. This all happened due to faulty O34 engine mounts, which were supposed to be equal to if not slightly better than OEM.

I am a little shocked that your rear main seal is still original. You have an N54/55?? Correct.

I would tell you to replace your engine & trans mounts, if they are original and you are at 160,000 miles. Either go OEM or get an upgraded set. Just stay away from 034.

2008 N54 FBO, correct
* Still original FMS
* Still original RMS
* Still original OPG

I am losing about 1/4 qt of oil every 1000 driven miles.

[mweisdorfer]

Originally Posted by fazman

2008 N54 FBO, correct
* Still original FMS
* Still original RMS
* Still original OPG

I am losing about 1/4 qt of oil every 1000 driven miles.

How are you losing that much oil? You must have a leak somewhere....

[mr_malvo]

Regarding your car losing oil; you either have a leak or your car is consuming it.

I would suggest removing the under tray, power wash the bottom of the engine bay, drive around for a little bit, then check to see if you have leaks.

If you're FBO, with a catless downpipe, and consuming oil I would think you would be seeing some smoke coming out the back.

In my case I had both - oil pan leaks plus bad turbo seals dumping oil into the chamber.

If your front main seal is not compromised I wouldn't replace it.

Originally Posted by fazman

2008 N54 FBO, correct
* Still original FMS
* Still original RMS
* Still original OPG

I am losing about 1/4 qt of oil every 1000 driven miles.

[fazman]

Originally Posted by mr_malvo

Regarding your car losing oil; you either have a leak or your car is consuming it.

I would suggest removing the under tray, power wash the bottom of the engine bay, drive around for a little bit, then check to see if you have leaks.

If you're FBO, with a catless downpipe, and consuming oil I would think you would be seeing some smoke coming out the back.

In my case I had both - oil pan leaks plus bad turbo seals dumping oil into the chamber.

If your front main seal is not compromised I wouldn't replace it.

When I first start the motor in the morning I get no smoking issues (Other than normal stuff from having DP's). But if I park the car for a short period like going to get groceries... after that when I start the car i will get a small of smoke as I roll up to a stop sign or red light. After that I get no smoke at all.

[Ranger889]

I got a new Corteco seal and the installation instructions say that both the installation surface and the PTFE seal lip are to be completely Dry (see photos). It is obvious the installation surface is the Crankshaft and the PTFE (which is Teflon) surface is only on the inside of the seal. Below it also says to wait 2 hours so the PTFE seal lip can settle in the right position??

The Bentley manual says to lightly oil the Crankshaft. So has anyone experienced this??

[mr_malvo]

The sources I read recommended oil on the crank shaft to help the seal slide well during installation. And primer on the block.

Regarding the wait time, you'll have to use some gasket maker in the two side grooves, and since that needs to cure your wait time will be longer than two hours anyways.

Originally Posted by Ranger889

I got a new Corteco seal and the installation instructions say that both the installation surface and the PTFE seal lip are to be completely Dry (see photos). It is obvious the installation surface is the Crankshaft and the PTFE (which is Teflon) surface is only on the inside of the seal. Below it also says to wait 2 hours so the PTFE seal lip can settle in the right position??

The Bentley manual says to lightly oil the Crankshaft. So has anyone experienced this??

[Ranger889]

Thanks for the reply. I would tend to believe the write-ups as well. I've been working on cars for many years and I can't remember ever putting a crank, cam or axle bearing seal in dry. Plus, this one looks like it can easily roll over the wide Teflon sealing surface from a tight fitting dry shaft.

[triax37]

Originally Posted by mrpriceisright

Given what a significant job this is and the expensive special tools needed, you might want to try either running it for a minute or two without the belt to see if there are any leaks or putting it all back and checking often. The belt failures are supposedly caused in the main by oil leaking from the oil filter housing gasket at the top of the engine, down onto the belt. I suspect a leak from the seal will not get oil on the belt, so it is not so dangerous to run the motor with the belt in, IMO, and check for leaks. Also, it will not add much extra work (removing belt and draining oil), if you indeed find a leak and have to go back and replace the seal.

Just removed the harmonic balancer and trying to determine if I have a leak or not. I'm an N52, 100k miles, recently fixed a OFHG and VCG that probably leaked slowly for 1 year. I have never had a shredded belt. Below are some pictures - any thoughts whether I have a leaky seal?

Just to confirm the quoted post - is it safe for me to run the engine and see if oil comes out? I've removed the radiator fan and intake, as I was having a separate MAF issue.

[mr_malvo]

Originally Posted by triax37

Just removed the harmonic balancer and trying to determine if I have a leak or not. I'm an N52, 100k miles, recently fixed a OFHG and VCG that probably leaked slowly for 1 year. I have never had a shredded belt. Below are some pictures - any thoughts whether I have a leaky seal?

Just to confirm the quoted post - is it safe for me to run the engine and see if oil comes out? I've removed the radiator fan and intake, as I was having a separate MAF issue.

Be merry, sir. Your seal looks intact.

[triax37]

Originally Posted by mr_malvo

Be merry, sir. Your seal looks intact.

Thank you, sir! I agree that it seems to look ok, but I was almost hoping this was the cause of all of the oily residue on the lower front side of the engine. Any thoughts as to what could be leaving behind the residue?

Would anyone confirm whether it's ok to let the engine run without the serpentine/accessory belt? My hope is that I will see a leak somewhere. Google tells me that for lots of other cars, it's fine to do it for a few minutes...

[mr_malvo]

Originally Posted by triax37

Thank you, sir! I agree that it seems to look ok, but I was almost hoping this was the cause of all of the oily residue on the lower front side of the engine. Any thoughts as to what could be leaving behind the residue?

Would anyone confirm whether it's ok to let the engine run without the serpentine/accessory belt? My hope is that I will see a leak somewhere. Google tells me that for lots of other cars, it's fine to do it for a few minutes...

The oil from a leaky OFHG splatters everywhere around the block after it hits the belt. Your pictures are consistent with what I've seen, including my own case. So that would be my bet.

Our cars can run for a little bit without the belt as the water pump is electric, and you won't need the power steering or AC while on jack stands. Just mind the battery as the alternator won't be running.

[Mike Whitney]

I just finished up the crank seal repair (twice!) and wanted to thank mr_malvo and others for the writeup. I wanted to add some bullet points / comments / suggestions for others attempting the repair:

- first, change the belt! I bought an 06 330i fixer-upper for my son, knowing it had a leaky OFHG and bad belt, and it broke on the way home, and a bunch of belt made it's way into the crankcase.
- I do not think the expensive BMW and loctite primers and sealers are necessary. If you look at the notches on the seal and what needs to be sealed, a reasonable application of RTV or permatex black will do the job nicely. It's just a seal
- Buy or borrow the correct seal puller and (more importantly) installer for the job. The install seal allows you to use the white plastic guide / carrier correctly and with even force around the seal.
- During install the correct procedure is: bolt the install tool on the crank, then push (tap with a mallet) the plastic sleeve all the way onto the tool and over the crank nose, then push the seal on by hand and align grooves, as far as it will go, then wrench it in with the large circumference pusher until it's flush.
- The first time I did it, I did not push the white plastic carrier all the way over the crank nose, which allowed the PTFE inner seal to get boogered, and it resulted in a pretty bad oil leak
- Use a thin coat of permatex black on the seal before sliding in and it should all be good. Add a small dollop at the notches to be sure those get filled.

Another note is -- The puller did not work for me the 2nd time I used it. It threaded in and tightened up fine, but then stripped out the contents of the seal and left a barrel of steel with no lip to grab onto. No amount of subsequent threading and pulling of the tool would grab it. If this happens it IS possible to use a screwdriver and hammer to pry up the lip of the seal steel ring and eventually pry it out with a screwdriver. It takes a lot of time, patience, and yes some damage to the outer edge of the block / plate edges. As long as you're diligent to not damage the more internal surfaces of the mating area where the seal sits, you should still get a good seal.

Best of luck!

[Mike Whitney]

Some pictures for entertainment purposes:

Properly inserted install tool, sleeve, and seal (note that I needed to tap the white plastic sleeve onto the install tool with a mallet to ensure that the seal would slide onto the crank nose with no gap):


Chiseling ledges into the crank seal with a screwdriver to pry it out (when the extract tool fails)


Pried out steel seal shell


Here's what I dug out of the oil pickup and oil pan after a shredded belt:

[slinkygn]

Originally Posted by Mike Whitney

Another note is -- The puller did not work for me the 2nd time I used it. It threaded in and tightened up fine, but then stripped out the contents of the seal and left a barrel of steel with no lip to grab onto. No amount of subsequent threading and pulling of the tool would grab it. If this happens it IS possible to use a screwdriver and hammer to pry up the lip of the seal steel ring and eventually pry it out with a screwdriver. It takes a lot of time, patience, and yes some damage to the outer edge of the block / plate edges. As long as you're diligent to not damage the more internal surfaces of the mating area where the seal sits, you should still get a good seal.

This exact same thing happened to me. No idea why it happened, either. The only difference I could come up with is that the seal I pulled out (which I would assume was the original seal) looked different than the seal I put in (pn 11117547842). The biggest differences in how the seals look seem to have nothing to do with that front face, though, so I don't know.

The old seal, that came out fine with the tool:



I may need to take a better photo of that, perhaps after cleaning it up a bit.

The new seal, that is now in and failed to be removed by the tool (before insertion):



And finally, just for grins, the new installed seal currently in my engine with the front face pulled off and the metal ring still there:



So it looks like I have a LONG afternoon of prying and pulling in front of me. (Unless anyone has a better idea!)

[slinkygn]

Originally Posted by Mike Whitney

As long as you're diligent to not damage the more internal surfaces of the mating area where the seal sits, you should still get a good seal.

Best of luck!

How much of a problem is it if some of those internal surfaces do get marred a bit? I finally got mine out; the crank is intact, but along with that outer edge getting beat up there also seem to be some nicks and indentations on the surface of the engine casing that the stuck outer seal ring pressed against. I took some steel wool to try and lightly take off any potential burrs , but am hesitant to use a file or anything harsher in there without knowing how smooth I need to get it and how aggressive or gentle I need to be in doing so.

[oilcrankinject]

Will the crank seal removal tool also work on the rear seal? I will be getting a used motor at the end of next week so I want to do as much as I can before I drop it in my car.