[stressdoc]

If you are going to bitch about no DCT, do so at your local dealer.

[Jack in Jax]

There apparently is far more change afoot at BMW AG than dicing up the new technologies among the various geographic markets. For those who haven't read the recent announcements about how BMW plans to approach sales in the USA, you might want to check out:

http://stage.bmwcca.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2937

I'm new here and using this & other forums (fora?) to build my knowledge base on BMW products. Much to my surprise, after coming back into the car marketplace after 8 years, I find it a bit of a challenge to understand the consequences that come with some of these high-end, technology-laden brands - and especially so the BMW product. So far, after reading many a Roundel, CCA website owner comments, and forum comments from many owners of late model BMWs, I'm left to wonder if BMW is shifting left while the USA marketplace is shifting right.

A fair comment, I think, is that it's been part of BMW's long-term strategic plan to utilize technology to lever up the performance of their cars. Consequently, as often happens in organizations which find something is working, technology shifts from being a means to an end to becoming an end of its own. And as was mentioned above, there's only so much technology a given manufacturer can develop and introduce in a given amount of time. So...we see 'answers' to questions that were never asked (the removal of the oil dipstick being BMW's epitome of 'technology for its own sake') while the new iDrive and DCT lumber along towards introduction.

Here's a Q for everyone, posed by the link above: Are North American buyers really going to embrace the shift to a 'Pull' sales strategy at their local dealers? My perception is that a meaningful slice of new NA car buyers, once they wade through the brand choices and check their options boxes, want their cars soon(er), not later. Yet BMW's plan is to lower dealership inventories and invite more factory orders. That sales strategy strikes me as a bit Eurocentric. (Let's get Americans to behave more like our other markets, since it's more works better for us.')

BTW in answer to an earlier Q in this thread, a news item in a Spring Roundel gave an estimated price for the turbo'd diesel in the 335i as $4K. The city/hwy mpg estimate (combined with an estimated $4.50/gal for diesel fuel) meant a 5 year/15,000 miles/year payback period, as the improvement in mileage performance isn't that stunning. Not a terribly compelling rationale for the typical North American buyer.

Jack

[mhaas]

Originally Posted by TheBry

I think their update scheme makes sense. They're freshening the cars in the order they were originally released. Weren't the E90 / E91 models released first in the USA, followed by the E92 then E93 eight months later?

Maybe BMW feel it's too soon to re-tool for those models and will, instead, update them sometime next year. Maybe they'll be 2009.5 models or something. They've done that before.

That is exactly the case in ALL markets, and btw it has always been the case and not just at BMW!!!

BMW as other carmakers updates the models in the order they were introduced in the market, the E90 & E91 were the first two current 3 series body styles that were introduced they were followed by first the coupe (E92) and last the convertible (E93). So what is the big fuss here all about. Why should the E92 & E93 be updated already now? They are a lot more up to date than the E90 & E91 those two had to be updated to stay on par with the new A4 sedan & wagon as well as the C-Class sedan & wagon.

Still to my knowledge the old idrive will dissappear completly in all models pretty much at the same time maybe it will take a few months more to have it achieved in the whole lineup.

In Europe everyone is jealous of you guys in the US, as you get your BMW's so much cheaper than we do and you only complain?

[nidget]

Originally Posted by mhaas

Why should the E92 & E93 be updated already now? They are a lot more up to date than the E90 & E91 those two had to be updated to stay on par with the new A4 sedan & wagon as well as the C-Class sedan & wagon.

+1

Originally Posted by mhaas

In Europe everyone is jealous of you guys in the US, as you get your BMW's so much cheaper than we do and you only complain?

Nearly half the price when you include the options. But that's not the fault of the US buyers (and this situation will evolve soon). I think, when you buy something of that price, even when you buy it half of the price, you get the right to complain when you're not happy.

I think however that some components of the cars should be designed "plug and play". The iDrive would be a good example of this: you don't want to buy a new car because your iDrive is outdated, do you ? Maybe you don't need it initially but would like to add it at a later stage ?
Actually, our cars are becoming less and less plug and play ? Can you change the radio in a 3 to put one of another brand instead ? I'm not sure.

[mhaas]

I am not blaming the US buyers for the different pricing at all, just think they have it quiet nice to be complaining. Most of their (and our) complains will be addressed by BMW, all we need is a little bit faith and patience - its not a matter if the complains or whishes will be addressed but rather if they will be addressed in September 2008, March 2009, September 2009 or...

Of course that is not so exciting for someone who is in the market for a new car, in the next two months, but the situation is the same with other car makers.

Plug and play still exists, it just changed a bit:
Sure once you have the navigation in your car, there is not a lot you can still plug or play with but when you order your car with the business radio for example you can replace it with a different radio and buy a DIN-fitting from BMW. So its still possible but not as easy as in an E36 or Z3.

[nidget]

Originally Posted by mhaas

but when you order your car with the business radio for example you can replace it with a different radio and buy a DIN-fitting from BMW. So its still possible but not as easy as in an E36 or Z3.

I don't think this is "plug and play". Can you change it without loosing the memory key functionality ? Can you change it without loosing the controls from the steering wheel buttons ?
With a "plug and play" communication interface, a standard communication mechanism must be specified between a car and a radio, and you could plug another radio without loosing any of the existing functionalities (if the radio provides it but, with a standard interface, there would be no reason the radio manufacturers don't implement it, because it could be used on all the different models of cars).

[JakeBaker]

from bimmerfile

http://www.e90post.com/goodiesforyou...w_3_series.pdf

Page 13 says: "...generates a fulsome 300 lb-ft. of torque..."

I love my twin turbos, but did not know that they were offensive!

Look it up:
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/fulsome

-Jake

[BMWagain]

Originally Posted by GregL

It may seem like a small thing, but I'm surprised it took BMW this long to integrate "active front head restraints" to help prevent whiplash. My Infiniti already had it back in 2000.

Indeed. Now the cant get critisism for that.

[Jonny D]

Anyone know when the '09 configurator will be up on BMW's US website?

[crazyeyeskilla]

Originally Posted by Jonny D

Anyone know when the '09 configurator will be up on BMW's US website?

In time for MY10 at this rate

[nidget]

It's been updated beginning of this week for Belgium and Luxembourg (two countries that have a border with Germany).

So, you'll probably have it very soon. I had ordered a 08 model, but will get a 09. For me, in the options, the only thing that has changed is the model of the rims: no more 160, replaced by 284. But they look nearly the same. The price of mine is +/- 1500 € less (I have a lot of options and some prices have decreased). But don't count on this decrease outside Europe.

[enhanz]

Hi

Does anyone know whats the costs of changing the current bumper of the E90 3 series to the new facelifted version. I think the facelifted version looks good..like the coupe

Cheers

[Bora20]

So when can I expect a diesel wagon? I commend BMW for bring diesels to the 3 series, but why on the largest one.

I would much prefer the 320d, 325d, or 330d, with their much better fuel economy and manual transmission.

[nidget]

Originally Posted by GAaaAR

The fact that nobody has yet able to confirm that the US 2009 E92 coupe is getting DCT is probably a sign that we won't get one.
All the other countries already know.

It would be a shame for BMW to not offer it in the country where most of the trannies are automatic.

[DinoMite]

[QUOTE=Balthazar_B;3002431]

Originally Posted by mapezzul

Well,
BMW answered my questions tonight after I posted on why they were keeping us in the dark (USA).

Not going to make some people happy, as it is still leaves some things open.
The DCT being one of them. No Direct injection and No Connected Drive. iDrive.... Full read and .pdf

from bimmerfile

http://www.e90post.com/goodiesforyou...w_3_series.pdf

Actually, what little they say about the coupe and cabrio could be taken to mean that the '09s will be saddled with the old iDrive. I'm reminded of how several auto manufacturers refused to make any meaningful improvements in some of their top-selling cars in the face of rising competition, and never regained market share in that segment. With Infiniti coming out with a very attractive cabrio and Audi revamping its A4, S4, and RS4, I'd have to just shake my head and wonder what BMW is thinking (especially if they release a new iDrive and DCT with the E92/E93 models throughout the rest of the world and not to the US, which I would find insulting if it weren't so utterly knuckleheaded). That may just tip the scales for cancelling my order and considering more attractive alternatives in the next few months.

I agree, i dont' want to purchase the 335 without the DCT, god damn.

[DinoMite]

Originally Posted by mapezzul

That they did and for once they may be correct!
That is the most difficult part of sorting through all the info, what market gets what and how something can so quickly change. The DCT was originally for the US market but the economy and dollar is such crap now they can sell the US DCT inventory to the ROW and make twice as much money.

We are going to see a real shift in the US as far as cost and options go if the next administration does not fix this mess we are in.

The US was the largest most profitable market, but that is in the past, BMW has options elsewhere and should do what they need to maintain there profit margins and stay independent.

We dug this hole and now we need to dig out of it.

I still do not understand why Alfa is still coming to the US... makes little sense.

The US dollar is weak? Than what is the Australian dollar? and they got M type wheels and DCT as options for their 335 coupes. Australians make less money and get the better options, and their market is 1/15 the size of the American market probably.

The a-holes in Germany just had a brainfart and didn't ship DCT over here

[DinoMite]

Originally Posted by ManMachine

Heated steering wheel is great to have for cold weather. It's long overdue for the 3 series.

Isn't DCT a more expensive option that STEP? I think marketing probably decides that most every day drivers don't need this.

More expensive? Hmmm, how much does Volkswagen charge for their Dual Clutch transmission? So even if BMW charges 50% more, i'm sure they'd make money on it.

Drivers don't need this???? Why not? it is better than a manual transmission, and the automatic they are offering now... HOW can this not be a useful thing in the North American market?

[mhaas]

Take it easy, you will get the DCT and the new iDrive, if not in 2009 than in 2010. You rather get it now and be a BETA tester? I don't think so, in that case even more Americans would complain and whine about BMW built quality and how they will go for a japanese competitor...

Come on, this is not the first time Europe or mostly the German market plays BETA tester for new BMW innovations. Once the first or second year of customers here in Germany don't have any problems with DCT anymore you guys will get it as well.

BMW just can't afford the bad PR in the US, so they rather wait until all problems are ironed out before bringing it to the US. Better wait until you have a good product than bringing it on the market early.

[DinoMite]

Originally Posted by mhaas

Take it easy, you will get the DCT and the new iDrive, if not in 2009 than in 2010. You rather get it now and be a BETA tester? I don't think so, in that case even more Americans would complain and whine about BMW built quality and how they will go for a japanese competitor...

Come on, this is not the first time Europe or mostly the German market plays BETA tester for new BMW innovations. Once the first or second year of customers here in Germany don't have any problems with DCT anymore you guys will get it as well.

BMW just can't afford the bad PR in the US, so they rather wait until all problems are ironed out before bringing it to the US. Better wait until you have a good product than bringing it on the market early.

I think BMW tested that thing long enough to know if it is stable or not... and ready for production.

[mhaas]

That's what you think, because you want it. Once you have it - and it makes problems - you will be the first to say: BMW should have tested the product better before releasing it in the US.

Believe me, it would not be the first time...

[mhaas]

Originally Posted by DinoMite

I think BMW tested that thing long enough to know if it is stable or not... and ready for production.

There you go, yesterday recalled 7500 M3 because of a problem with the DCT, its just a software problem but it shows you that its not ironed out yet.

*********************

27.11.2008
BMW M3 Doppelkupplungsgetriebe
Wegen Problemen mit dem Getriebe bittet BMW weltweit 7.500 M3 in die Werkstatt. In Deutschland sind rund 1.000 Fahrzeuge von der Aktion betroffen. Anlass ist ein Defekt in der Steuerung des Doppelkupplungsgetriebes, wodurch es bei kalten Motor, starkem Bremsen und beim Mehrfach-Rückschalten kurzzeitig dazu kommen kann, dass beide Kupplungen geöffnet sind. Im schlimmsten Fall kann dadurch der Motor ausgehen. Bei einem Werkstattaufenthalt erhalten Getriebe- und Motorsoftware ein Update. Das Kraftfahrt-Bundesamt (KBA) wurde über die Aktion informiert, die Halter bereits angeschrieben. Nach Angaben eines BMW-Sprechers ist es bislang zu keinen Unfällen oder kritischen Fahrsituationen gekommen. (mid)

http://ww2.autoscout24.de/magazine/m...L-12-CW48-2008

*************************

So, be happy you have to wait a bit longer...
...and have a good weekend.

[Kev]

Originally Posted by mhaas

There you go, yesterday recalled 7500 M3 because of a problem with the DCT, its just a software problem but it shows you that its not ironed out yet.

*********************

27.11.2008
BMW M3 Doppelkupplungsgetriebe
Wegen Problemen mit dem Getriebe bittet BMW weltweit 7.500 M3 in die Werkstatt. In Deutschland sind rund 1.000 Fahrzeuge von der Aktion betroffen. Anlass ist ein Defekt in der Steuerung des Doppelkupplungsgetriebes, wodurch es bei kalten Motor, starkem Bremsen und beim Mehrfach-Rückschalten kurzzeitig dazu kommen kann, dass beide Kupplungen geöffnet sind. Im schlimmsten Fall kann dadurch der Motor ausgehen. Bei einem Werkstattaufenthalt erhalten Getriebe- und Motorsoftware ein Update. Das Kraftfahrt-Bundesamt (KBA) wurde über die Aktion informiert, die Halter bereits angeschrieben. Nach Angaben eines BMW-Sprechers ist es bislang zu keinen Unfällen oder kritischen Fahrsituationen gekommen. (mid)

http://ww2.autoscout24.de/magazine/m...L-12-CW48-2008

*************************

So, be happy you have to wait a bit longer...
...and have a good weekend.

Same deal when they released the SMG, kinda expected.