[T Bone]

Originally Posted by dr325i

Exactly...T Bone again has no clue what he's talking about...
Carfact is doing business, not a charity organization...

What are you talking about sparky?

Tell me where I gave some flawed advice here.

Are you going to add anything here other than being a prick?

[DFW_M]

Originally Posted by T Bone

What are you talking about sparky?

Tell me where I gave some flawed advice here.

Are you going to add anything here other than being a prick?

Read the fine print on Carfax...
They cannot claim to be responsible for something they absolutely have no control over -- someone hits a tree then pays out of pocket to fix it -- no police, no insurance records. If so, according to your claim, Carfax would be buying cars every day...

Carfax guarantees that if the damage was ever reported (cops, insurance...) and they can trace it -- they will stand by it. Otherwise, there is no way they can be responsible for the damage that was known only to the owner.

On the other hand, I think that previous owner has to report "extensive" damages when trading the car in as asked by the dealer and signed when handing the car over. I am not sure who has the responsibility if the owner failed to report it and the dealer claimed a clear title.

However, in this case -- sounds to me that the dealer must have known about the damages if they are so obvious, and that can probably be proven by looking at the purchase price from the previous owner (most likely got it very cheap). Also, if the dealer claimed in ANY (hopefully written) way that the car comes with the remainder of the warranty, they should be held responsible. Also, if the dealer claimed that the car was inspected, they should be held accountable.

To the OP, my suggestion is as someone already pointed out to talk to the GM and see where it goes. I believe that the OP has a good case here as the previous damage is obvious and my guess is that the dealer knew about the damage. If the GM does not want to deal, then I'd resort to the lawyers and media...

GL to the OP...

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by dr325i

Read the fine print on Carfax...
They cannot claim to be responsible for something they absolutely have no control over -- someone hits a tree then pays out of pocket to fix it -- no police, no insurance records. If so, according to your claim, Carfax would be buying cars every day...

Carfax guarantees that if the damage was ever reported (cops, insurance...) and they can trace it -- they will stand by it. Otherwise, there is no way they can be responsible for the damage that was known only to the owner.

On the other hand, I think that previous owner has to report "extensive" damages when trading the car in as asked by the dealer and signed when handing the car over. I am not sure who has the responsibility if the owner failed to report it and the dealer claimed a clear title.

However, in this case -- sounds to me that the dealer must have known about the damages if they are so obvious, and that can probably be proven by looking at the purchase price from the previous owner (most likely got it very cheap). Also, if the dealer claimed in ANY (hopefully written) way that the car comes with the remainder of the warranty, they should be held responsible. Also, if the dealer claimed that the car was inspected, they should be held accountable.

To the OP, my suggestion is as someone already pointed out to talk to the GM and see where it goes. I believe that the OP has a good case here as the previous damage is obvious and my guess is that the dealer knew about the damage. If the GM does not want to deal, then I'd resort to the lawyers and media...

GL to the OP...

Much different post in tone and content, bravo.

[DFW_M]

Originally Posted by T Bone

Much different post in tone and content, bravo.

Sorry if my previous post sounded offensive though...

[nmcampbell]

Originally Posted by T Bone

I guess you really have no clue.....

If you buy a report from Carfax, and it give you a clean bill of health, Carfax is supposed to buy the car back if they are wrong.

So thank you for your completely ignorant post.

Actually, your post is just as ignorant so try to be respectful. Carfax is only obligated to buy back the car if they "missed" something. If you read my earlier post, if the car was in an accident with a prior owner who paid cash to get it fixed, it's not going to show up on Carfax unless SOMEBODY reported it. A cash repair that didn't go through insurance isn't likely to be reported. Carfax is virtually useless for anything other than insurance-reported claims.

To the OP:

There are a lot of facts need to give a full analysis. What representations or warranties did the VW dealer who sold the car make to you? Did that dealer represent to you that the car was/is still under the BMW warranty? What disclosures did they make? I find it hard to believe that a dealer could not have discovered this damage and known the car had been in an accident, when the you found it so easily. Did the VW dealer provide its own warranty, separate and apart from the BMW warranty? Also, read your purchase agreement? Does it include a clause providing for the recovery of attorneys' fees if you have to litigate? If so, then consulting an attorney might be more feasible. But you also have a duty to mitigate your damages in most states, therefore I would suggest you attempt what I and others have suggested first, contact the dealership, talk to the general manager, point out your case, indicate you feel you've been wronged and ask them to take the car back with a full refund or some other fair result.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by nmcampbell

Actually, your post is just as ignorant so try to be respectful. Carfax is only obligated to buy back the car if they "missed" something. If you read my earlier post, if the car was in an accident with a prior owner who paid cash to get it fixed, it's not going to show up on Carfax unless SOMEBODY reported it. A cash repair that didn't go through insurance isn't likely to be reported. Carfax is virtually useless for anything other than insurance-reported claims.

To the OP:

There are a lot of facts need to give a full analysis. What representations or warranties did the VW dealer who sold the car make to you? Did that dealer represent to you that the car was/is still under the BMW warranty? What disclosures did they make? I find it hard to believe that a dealer could not have discovered this damage and known the car had been in an accident, when the you found it so easily. Did the VW dealer provide its own warranty, separate and apart from the BMW warranty? Also, read your purchase agreement? Does it include a clause providing for the recovery of attorneys' fees if you have to litigate? If so, then consulting an attorney might be more feasible. But you also have a duty to mitigate your damages in most states, therefore I would suggest you attempt what I and others have suggested first, contact the dealership, talk to the general manager, point out your case, indicate you feel you've been wronged and ask them to take the car back with a full refund or some other fair result.

If you read my posts, I suggested many paths to resolve this. Obviously any claims against Carfax would be subject to their exceptions.

Perhaps you should hang up a shingle here?

[stressdoc]

This sounds to me like a really crappy thing that your dealership did to you, recommending the car at the VW dealership. And likewise the VW dealership sold a damaged car. I would be really pissed at this kind of dishonesty. If the dealers do not work this out for you, the list deserves to know what dealer they should avoid.

If BMW NA has the info in their database that the car was damaged, then that info was clearly available to your dealer.

[nmcampbell]

Originally Posted by T Bone

If you read my posts, I suggested many paths to resolve this. Obviously any claims against Carfax would be subject to their exceptions.

Perhaps you should hang up a shingle here?

You've managed to transcend simple ignorance into the fine art of being an a-hole (perhaps you SHOULD be in my field?).

I offer my comments because I've seen a lot of flawed legal advice and incorrect interpretations of third-party obligations on this forum, including woefully inaccurate interpretations of BMW's warranty requirements.

If you read MY posts, you'll notice that I offer the benefit of my advice, not based on a "shoot from the hip" interpretation of the law, but instead, I actually read any relevant documents available to me as well as any pertinent statutes and explain my reasoning. Any comments I provide are also based on several years of practicing contract law and litigating cases relating to warranties and guaranties. All this without once trying to solicit business. Quite honestly, I'm not interested in business from anyone on this forum; I have plenty to keep me busy. On the other hand, when I see a fellow forum member who is in a bind and is asking for advice based on an actual understanding of the legal system, as opposed to armchair lawyering, I'm happy to give it and, surprise surprise, I don't send an invoice.

Rather than hang a shingle, I'd rather just sit back and enjoy reading the mistaken "legal advice" that's frequently offered on here, particularly if your opinion on my posts is shared by the other forum members.

I commented on your post in that particular manner because I found it akin to those forum members who seem to like to comment on others' grammar mistakes all while doing so with a post which is riddled with spelling errors.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by nmcampbell

You've managed to transcend simple ignorance into the fine art of being an a-hole (perhaps you SHOULD be in my field?).

I offer my comments because I've seen a lot of flawed legal advice and incorrect interpretations of third-party obligations on this forum, including woefully inaccurate interpretations of BMW's warranty requirements.

If you read MY posts, you'll notice that I offer the benefit of my advice, not based on a "shoot from the hip" interpretation of the law, but instead, I actually read any relevant documents available to me as well as any pertinent statutes and explain my reasoning. Any comments I provide are also based on several years of practicing contract law and litigating cases relating to warranties and guaranties. All this without once trying to solicit business. Quite honestly, I'm not interested in business from anyone on this forum; I have plenty to keep me busy. On the other hand, when I see a fellow forum member who is in a bind and is asking for advice based on an actual understanding of the legal system, as opposed to armchair lawyering, I'm happy to give it and, surprise surprise, I don't send an invoice.

Rather than hang a shingle, I'd rather just sit back and enjoy reading the mistaken "legal advice" that's frequently offered on here, particularly if your opinion on my posts is shared by the other forum members.

I commented on your post in that particular manner because I found it akin to those forum members who seem to like to comment on others' grammar mistakes all while doing so with a post which is riddled with spelling errors.

While I appreciate that you are trying to help out others and dispense legal advice without actually dispensing legal advice, this is the internet and anyone foolish enough to take legal advice on the net would be foolish.

My intention is also to help the OP, if you look at the course of action that I proposed, Carfax is one of multiple options. I do not have the complete set of facts to render an opinion, do you? I have no idea if the OP can make a claim under Carfax or would fall outside of its exceptions.

I realize that it is important for you to use your training to make use of the adverserial system.... Read documents, challenge assumptions / statements....

The goal for these types of threads is to get the OP to seek real advice by following some "shoot from the hip" paths.

If you are comfortable with the facts, please by all means render a legal opinion. I am sure your Bar would be very proud.

[SoCali E36]

Originally Posted by majin ssj eric

God, I'm glad I don't buy used anymore....

+1

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by DaveFan782

So I bought my E90 on Dec 4 with 32,xxx miles on it and one previous owner. Clean Carfax, clean dealership record, no obvious signs of damage (and I thought I was damn good at looking for that stuff).

On 1/11, BMWNA flagged my car, stating that "Vehicle was involved in severe front-center impact, as per national vehicle records database. Any warranty items that fail as a result of the accident or replaced parts can and will be denied by BMW of North America."

Nobody at my dealership knows what I should do, and nobody at BMWNA warranty headquarters is able to give us any answers. Carfax is still clean- and I'm now noticing recent date codes on the headlights, grille, hood, and some wiring harnesses forward of the engine.

Do I wait it out and risk it, or do I lose my ass and get a new car that I really can't afford now?

.....

I haven't read all of the replies to this, but I'm going to give u my two cents. There's nothing u can do. You bought the car "as-is". CarFax will not flag repairs paid for in cash by the owner. I'm sorry, but the person who sold u the car was a real piece of shit for not fessing up about repairs, and YOU should've called BMW to confirm warranty was still intact. On the pluse side, warranty will be denied for only those items which were repaired/replaced.

[tjnptel1]

Originally Posted by White05X3

I suggest contacting the prior owner immediately and retaining a good lawyer. Do not wait to see what happens. If the prior owner did not disclose the accident to you I suspect you might be able to unwind the deal due to fraud. But you need advice from a lawyer in your area.

i don't know how the deal went down, but from what i know, he bought the car as is. The previous owner doesn't have to disclose shit unless asked.

If the new owner had asked "has this car been in any accidents or body work done?" and the previous owner replied "no." then he can be sued but otherwise i doubt it.

[tjnptel1]

Originally Posted by Socom

I haven't read all of the replies to this, but I'm going to give u my two cents. There's nothing u can do. You bought the car "as-is". CarFax will not flag repairs paid for in cash by the owner. I'm sorry, but the person who sold u the car was a real piece of shit for not fessing up about repairs, and YOU should've called BMW to confirm warranty was still intact. On the pluse side, warranty will be denied for only those items which were repaired/replaced.

+1, contrary to popular beliefs, Carfax is not 100% accurate.