[Sara]

This brings back awful memories as this happened to me this year. In the Saks 5 Ave parking garage downtown I put my child in her car seat in the back, my diaper bag with my key fob on the passenger seat. I closed the door to walk around to the driver side and the car locked as soon as I closed the door.

I PANICKED.

My cell phone, key fob, and infant inside. It was 80 degrees outside. Lord only knows how hot is was going to get inside my car.


I was SCREAMING for help. I was telling anyone with any tools to bust out the windows. Any windows. THANK GOD 10 people came running over and called 911 and one person was able to shatter my windows after what seemed like forever with a "Life Hammer". I dove in over the broken the glass and we got my infant daughter who was hot and crying out of the car.

[tony20009]

Originally Posted by P1et

Well, no need to be rude to me Tony. I was merely politely asking.

I regret that what I wrote as direct and succinct you construed as rude.

All the best.

[P1]

Originally Posted by tony20009

I regret that what I wrote as direct and succinct you construed as rude.

All the best.

No worries Tony. Apology accepted.

[Flying Ace]

I'd rather cry in a BMW. google that.

[MiddleAgedAl]

Call me ignorant, but this seems all the more bizarre to me considering that people in China have not been free to have as many kids as they want; so you'd think they would be all the more protective of that child...

Everyone I know who has > 1 kid admits that they were super protective and hyper paranoid about the first one, and with each successive kid, got more relaxed about rushing over at the first sign of a kid crying, etc.... and yet they still wouldnt let their 3rd or 4th child roast themself in a hot car. With their firstborn, they would be even more vigilant.

In this case, the odds are very good that the child is likely that woman's first born, and only child.....

Considering that, if you still think that your car's window (or your husband's concern for a car window) is more important that the safety of your kid, maybe you shouldn't be allowed to have any kids at all.... It's not as if the country is so underpopulated that everyone who is biologically capable of carrying a fetus from conception to birth should be strongly encouraged to do so.....

[NEFARIOUS]

Originally Posted by tony20009

??? Say what??? You could not be louder, stronger or wronger!

I might not rebut your comment were you to have made them specifically with regard to one or several governmental policies or actions, but picking up a fallen old man from off the street isn't at all a governmental action. Moreover, you can rest assured that if nobody helped the man up -- something that is a literal impossibility -- a policeman would eventually show up and do so, just as one would in U.S. or any other Western country. Additionally, unlike American culture, the Chinese one values seniority.

There are over a billion people in China. I'm sure you can find examples to illustrate the claims you made above. I am in the PRC almost every week and have worked there for nearly a decade now.

What you claim above isn't at all what I've observed. Not from total strangers whom I just see going about their business. Not from the people whom I meet but don't otherwise know. Not from the people whom I know.

In fact my experiences and observations have been exactly the opposite. So much so that I think Chinese people may be the most generous, interpersonally outgoing, humble, curious and helpful people I've come across in all my travels.

Cocky, arrogant and self-centered? Those are traits I am sure some Chinese people have, but as a culture, I just don't see it. I think culturally, those traits are more typically American, not Chinese.

• Humility: http://www.ipedr.com/vol29/24-CEBMM2012-Q00050.pdf
• Arrogance: As a Manifest Destiny governmental policy, I can see why one might cite arrogance as a trait. (http://thediplomat.com/2010/07/china...ous-arrogance/) I would ask, however, if the Monroe Doctrine/Manifest Destiny was good for the goose (USA/UK), why is it not good for the gander (China)?
  
  If there is one thing I've observed the Chinese to be very good at doing, it's emulating the successful acts of others. China's imperialist moves aren't so different than those of many Western countries. Moreover, Western nations have a long history of sticking their noses in other coutries' business and taking the stance that they know best. It's at least a bit disingenuous that now Western nations see it as arrogant when China adopts similar policy positions.
  
  As for arrogance being part of the core nature of the Chinese people, individuals, I really don't see that at all, quite the opposite in fact. Certainly no more so than is anyone who is by a third party told what they should or should not do, think or say.

You write that you've first hand experience in China. I'd think from that experience you'd know quite well that for more so than in most Western countries that there are two Chinas: the Chinese government China and the people of China. In my experience in the PRC, what I observe from the government and what I observe from the people are vastly different observations and attitudes.
All the best.

I didn't say I have firsthand experience IN China, I have firsthand experience in dealing WITH Chinese people, and with living around this area, dealing with an increasing amount of Asian business owners, and having Asian clients in the course of business, it's fair to say that I'm not pulling things out of a hat or pigeonholing people based on a narrow observation.

You perhaps lucked out and you're probably in a better side of town, or they're just friendlier around you, a "老外 [Lao Wai = Foreigner]", especially if you work in international trade... There are some companies that hire foreigners to sit in the executive boardroom just to look better to investors! Laowai's are hot commodities there, and perhaps the only reason you haven't seen it is because you're not Chinese. If you are, then please disregard this paragraph.

Also not just Chinese, but lots of Asians in general... They can show one side to the public; the organized, professional, outgoing and generous side with a Porsche Cayenne and designer clothes, but once they are out of sight of their homies, he drives that Cayenne into a working-class neighborhood into a rundown house reeking of cigarettes and clothes that hasn't been washed in a month, hates going out and wishes the people he was hanging out with earlier "would just die already"... I know this person personally and saw both sides, plus 2 other similar people.

But for me, I haven't gotten along with Tianjin people, who are often boisterous and unforgiving, and that's 3 out of 5 that I've dealt with on a regular basis, and that 4th one was only because he reconciled, and I rarely talk to the 5th guy enough to make a sufficient aggregate. Also, plenty of people from Beijing and Shanghai fit the bill as to what I described... A good percentage encounters I've had with Mainland Chinese people have not been pleasant.

But note that I'm not saying all of them are bad, but there are also times that you encounter some people that hide their true identity until about 3 months later, kinda like getting into a relationship with a closeted psycho.

[tony20009]

Originally Posted by NEFARIOUS

I didn't say I have firsthand experience IN China, I have firsthand experience in dealing WITH Chinese people, and with living around this area, dealing with an increasing amount of Asian business owners, and having Asian clients in the course of business, it's fair to say that I'm not pulling things out of a hat or pigeonholing people based on a narrow observation.

You perhaps lucked out and you're probably in a better side of town, or they're just friendlier around you, a "老外 [Lao Wai = Foreigner]", especially if you work in international trade... There are some companies that hire foreigners to sit in the executive boardroom just to look better to investors! Laowai's are hot commodities there, and perhaps the only reason you haven't seen it is because you're not Chinese. If you are, then please disregard this paragraph.

Also not just Chinese, but lots of Asians in general... They can show one side to the public; the organized, professional, outgoing and generous side with a Porsche Cayenne and designer clothes, but once they are out of sight of their homies, he drives that Cayenne into a working-class neighborhood into a rundown house reeking of cigarettes and clothes that hasn't been washed in a month, hates going out and wishes the people he was hanging out with earlier "would just die already"... I know this person personally and saw both sides, plus 2 other similar people.

But for me, I haven't gotten along with Tianjin people, who are often boisterous and unforgiving, and that's 3 out of 5 that I've dealt with on a regular basis, and that 4th one was only because he reconciled, and I rarely talk to the 5th guy enough to make a sufficient aggregate. Also, plenty of people from Beijing and Shanghai fit the bill as to what I described... A good percentage encounters I've had with Mainland Chinese people have not been pleasant.

But note that I'm not saying all of them are bad, but there are also times that you encounter some people that hide their true identity until about 3 months later, kinda like getting into a relationship with a closeted psycho.

Off Topic:
I'm responding to your post because it's so full of apparent prejudice that it cannot go unanswered. That said, I doubt the themes of your post are at all what the OP intended for I didn't sense his/her OP teetered on the edge of outright bigotry. Indeed, the OP didn't even not that the ethnicity of the woman who wanted to protect her car rather than free her child from it.

• When I'm in China, I stay in a very nice hotel. Even so, in many Chinese cities, and certainly in the one I am in most often, Shenzhen, very nice hotels often stand in or immediately abut very working class neighborhoods. Nice hotels also exist in posh or commercial areas. The hotel I'm most often in is in a working class area. I certainly and regularly patronize businesses in the neighborhood. Those businesses range from individuals who set up hibachi grills and cook for sale chicken and veggies, small lo mein places, an apothecary from which I've purchased both Western-stye and traditional Chinese medicines (the Western stuff works as one'd expect; the traditional stuff does what I wish the Western stuff would do), barbershops, the dudes selling bootleg DVD movies (some of them work in my home DVD player and some don't), convenience and grocery stores, restaurants both "chic" and not-at-all chic and electronics stores. I also patronize posh shopping malls, restaurants, massage parlors/spas, and boutiques in town.
• I don't sit on the board of any Chinese companies. I am a management consultant not a trade representative or trade advisor. I am responsible for multiple projects in the PRC as well as in other Southern and Eastern Asian countries. My project teams range in size from about a dozen people to about 250 people. I've been directly involved with projects of those sorts for nearly a decade and my actions and roles on them span the gamut from detailed problem solving with "stumped" low level subordinates to high level project management and strategic planning with executives, both my Asian peers in my firm as well as client execs. My direct clients are multi-national manufacturers, and business and consumer service providers.
• I am lucky in that I have been able to refrain from allowing myself to extrapolate my individual experiences with individuals to entire cultures comprised of hundreds of millions and billions of people, to say noting of entire continents of people. I like to think that luck has little to do with it and that my good sense, my "love your neighbor as yourself" attitude, and my genuine concern for and like of humans play the major roles in my not having the sorts of negative experiences and negatively biased views you do with regard to Asians.

Green:
Boisterousness, remorselessness and cruelty are not endearing character traits; however, I don't think that a person's being Tianjinese would affect whether I or others can or will get along with them or not. Nor does their ethnicity play a role in how I'd respond to or feel about what I unilaterally deem to be any individual's foul comportment.

Tianjin is a major port city having a population of nearly 10 million. Now this may come as a surprise to you, but the various "flavors" in which can come human personalities is not culturally, ethnically or racially dependent and the Chinese, over the course of five millennia, have had more time than any other culture on the planet to understand human nature and how to get along with other people, be they Chinese or not.

Lastly, it's curious, to say the least, that you haven't gotten along with 3 of 5 Tianjinese whom you've met...Tianjin is a city known for its comedy and comedians. Clearly not everyone in Tianjin is a comedian, or even merely a "happy go lucky" kind of person, but given the prominent place of comedy in the city's culture, one has to think that folks issuing from such a local tradition are at least reasonably easy to get along with.

Purple:
Is that something of which only Asians, and not also non-Asians, are capable? From what you wrote, one might infer that you believe duplicitousness unique to, or at least characteristic of, Asians. Do you?


Red:
You may want to consider that rather than it being the "fault" of the Asians, it may be that your preponderance of negative experiences and my preponderance of positive ones portends that it's our individual personalities that are to "blame" for those things.


Blue:
I honestly have only once in my life encountered a person so deceitful as you describe. That person is a white guy from Indiana who has blond hair and blue eyes. I'm certainly not going to assume as a result of my unfortunate interactions with him that, say, Indianans are deceitful.

It's clear to me that even though I've not had to deal with a lot of deceitful folk, there surely are such folk moving among us. Furthermore, I'm sure that among the people exhibiting that character flaw, there are Americans, Asians, Africans, Australians, and Europeans. I am going to guess there are no deceitful Antarticans, Martians or Moon People.


All the best.

[valbmw]

Originally Posted by tony20009

Off Topic:
I'm responding to your post because it's so full of apparent prejudice that it cannot go unanswered.

Tony, pardon me for stepping into the conversation but reading the posts like the one you have just answered to, I couldn't stop thinking about that: http://www.liveinternet.ru/users/the...post97159365/#

I lived and worked in India for 3 years where traveled by business cross 20 states, therefore know very well the huge difference between someone's subjective opinion and my own which is apparently subjective one, too. However I learned one thing: the most generalizations are totally wrong.

Everyone has his own point of view, but The World According to Stereotypes is always something new. This is also too much of that stuff between our countries, but this is another story.

Thanks.

[tony20009]

Originally Posted by valbmw

Tony, pardon me for stepping into the conversation but reading the posts like the one you have just answered to, I couldn't stop thinking about that: http://www.liveinternet.ru/users/the...post97159365/#

...

No pardon needed. It's a public forum. That member is free to offend, and anyone else is free to chime in.

Bold:


Funny, but sadly, as seen by someone who is often outside my home country, U.S., it's not far from an accurate depiction of the sentiments many of my countrymen express, or act like they believe when they don't openly express their views.

Of course, having the freedom to speak offensively (or be a bigot for that matter) is important too. It's that U.S. isn't the only country that accords that right.

• http://www.therichest.com/rich-list/...dom-of-speech/
• http://www.whichcountry.co/most-freedom-of-speech/
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedo...ech_by_country

All the best.


All the best.

[NEFARIOUS]

I've been pretty busy, and even though you're exposed to a region that is actually pretty neutral and haven't experienced what is IMO "true China", I'll just agree to disagree.

[tony20009]

Originally Posted by NEFARIOUS

I've been pretty busy, and even though you're exposed to a region that is actually pretty neutral and haven't experienced what is IMO "true China", I'll just agree to disagree.

??? What is "true China?" More importantly, however, what are you writing about in general and that you disagree with?

To put my question in perspective, if Chinese folks were to fly to U.S. and spend their time in D.C., New York and Dallas, would they not see "true U.S.?" They wouldn't see all of U.S., but what they would see would be "true U.S." Now if instead they were to learn that D.C. was inspired by Paris, no matter how comprehensive their visit to D.C. be, they still would not have experienced "true Paris."

All the best.