[bbnks2]

The answer will always be vrsf here since vrsf is the only one with a presence. They apparently have a denser core than all other intercooler and those denser cores also magically result in less pressure drop somehow. Apparently it has to do with larger charge air volume, per Tiago above. This makes 0 sense but I'll move along because it benefit's no one to keep going back and fourth over it. The increased inlet/outlet size does seem to result in a negligible difference in airflow. I misquoted the size as 2.25 when last known data published by vrsf stated 2.75"

I never said anything about wagner here, but look at their own flow data. Their more efficient bar and plate cores are more restrictive than their tube and fine cores. Charge air volume has nothing to do with it.

[Tiago@VRSF]

Originally Posted by Bours

ok but what about the er 6" vs vrsf 7" which one has a denser fin pack and larger core ?
this is nominated for best thread of spring so far btw i like when the community tell their opinions so we can get the best info out of the n55 car parts !

Originally Posted by bbnks2

The answer will always be vrsf here since vrsf is the only one with a presence. They apparently have a denser core than all other intercooler and those denser cores also magically result in less pressure drop somehow. Apparently it has to do with larger charge air volume, per Tiago above. This makes 0 sense but I'll move along because it benefit's no one to keep going back and fourth over it. The increased inlet/outlet size does seem to result in a negligible difference in airflow. I misquoted the size as 2.25 when last known data published by vrsf stated 2.75"

I never said anything about wagner here, but look at their own flow data. Their more efficient bar and plate cores are more restrictive than their tube and fine cores. Charge air volume has nothing to do with it.

The VRSF 7" HD has a larger core and a denser fin pack.

It has nothing to do with presence, it's fin density per square inch. Ask any vendor who's had experience with both and they'll tell you which is denser.

[bbnks2]

Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF

The VRSF 7" HD has a larger core and a denser fin pack.

It has nothing to do with presence, it's fin density per square inch. Ask any vendor who's had experience with both and they'll tell you which is denser.

The second part of that equation is that the HD core will restrict airflow more than your standard 7in core, correct?

You respond to everything by listing the benefits and ignoring the drawbacks which are being discussed here.

[Bours]

Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF

The VRSF 7" HD has a larger core and a denser fin pack.

It has nothing to do with presence, it's fin density per square inch. Ask any vendor who's had experience with both and they'll tell you which is denser.

yea does the 7 HD restrict airflow compared to the 7 ?

[Tiago@VRSF]

The 7" HD will be slightly more restrictive vs the regular 7" but not enough to quantify on paper or in logs. Everyone who has switched to the 7" HD from a 5" or our regular 7" in warmer climates has gained HP on the top end.

Doug from Frankenturbo recently tested our 7.5" race FMIC vs a standard 5" stepped and confirmed there was no loss in spool or response even though the core features an incredibly dense fin pack.

[Bours]

Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF

The 7" HD will be slightly more restrictive vs the regular 7" but not enough to quantify on paper or in logs. Everyone who has switched to the 7" HD from a 5" or our regular 7" in warmer climates has gained HP on the top end.

Doug from Frankenturbo recently tested our 7.5" race FMIC vs a standard 5" stepped and confirmed there was no loss in spool or response even though the core features an incredibly dense fin pack.

gained HP on top end ? i thought it was a ( reduce IAT mod) and not a power adder mod ?

a fmic gives the ability to have top power pull after pull but gain power ? how much whp and why would it give some if you mind me asking

[houtan]

Good discussion here and I know there are a lot of technical details to consider when buying an intercooler, but for me, results is the biggest factor. I do not own any VRSF products, but my friend owns the newer race intercooler, and the IATs are methlike. Even at the end of a half mile run, on a Pure stage two turbo, no meth, his IATs end up lower at 155mph than the start of the run.

Not sure if the race would be a good fit for stock turbo, but it definitely does a good job on IATs with a PS2.

log here: http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43168

[Tiago@VRSF]

Originally Posted by Bours

gained HP on top end ? i thought it was a ( reduce IAT mod) and not a power adder mod ?

a fmic gives the ability to have top power pull after pull but gain power ? how much whp and why would it give some if you mind me asking

When IATs get high enough the DME will pull timing which results in a significant power loss.

The HP gain mentioned previously was due to the turbo being able to breathe better on the top end where the smaller intercooler proved to be a restriction.

[JETmn]

Originally Posted by Bours

gained HP on top end ? i thought it was a ( reduce IAT mod) and not a power adder mod ?

a fmic gives the ability to have top power pull after pull but gain power ? how much whp and why would it give some if you mind me asking

Bours, you make things too complicated. Are you ever going to possibly go bigger than the stock turbo? If yes, get the 7". If no, then get a 5 or 6".

[Bours]

Originally Posted by JETmn

Bours, you make things too complicated. Are you ever going to possibly go bigger than the stock turbo? If yes, get the 7". If no, then get a 5 or 6".

You know my steez im going ps2 really soon ( for real now lol ) i have a good deal on a er 6" i was just looking for data from actual owners ( logs )

[Bours]

How long is install time on a 5 and 7 fmic???

[JETmn]

Originally Posted by Bours

You know my steez im going ps2 really soon ( for real now lol ) i have a good deal on a er 6" i was just looking for data from actual owners ( logs )

If you are going PS2 then get the 7" or 7" HD. /end thread

[Bours]

Originally Posted by JETmn

If you are going PS2 then get the 7" or 7" HD. /end thread

yup just wanna know install time then itll be done cause indy shop is quoting me 4-5 hours for a 7" and he said a lot of cutting of plastic shroud is needed

true or nah ?

[lurker14]

Originally Posted by Bours

yup just wanna know install time then itll be done cause indy shop is quoting me 4-5 hours for a 7" and he said a lot of cutting of plastic shroud is needed

true or nah ?

It took me 4-5 hours in my garage but that was being in no hurry, washing and waxing the bumpers and wheelwell and under car plastics while they were off, checking suspension and engine parts while I had access. Cutting took about 15 minutes if you count the time I spent going to the basement for tools and deciding what to cut.
Anything over 2 hours in shop time is highway robbery.

edit, I installed the 7"HD, no noticeable change in lag on stock turbo.

[Bours]

Originally Posted by lurker14

It took me 4-5 hours in my garage but that was being in no hurry, washing and waxing the bumpers and wheelwell and under car plastics while they were off, checking suspension and engine parts while I had access. Cutting took about 15 minutes if you count the time I spent going to the basement for tools and deciding what to cut.
Anything over 2 hours in shop time is highway robbery.

edit, I installed the 7"HD, no noticeable change in lag on stock turbo.

Thank you sir !! Thats the info i was looking for

[Cory S]

I run the 5" stepped with my PS2. IAT's are still never 20* over ambient. Even before the WMI, IAT's never went over 90* after 4 gears of WOT in 80*F outside air temps. The DME doesn't start pulling timing until around 120*F IAT.

Unless you are road racing the car in Arizona/Texas in August, or running WOT for 1/2 mile blasts at a time, the 5" stepped VRSF I/C is all you'll need.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by Cory S

I run the 5" stepped with my PS2. IAT's are still never 20* over ambient. Even before the WMI, IAT's never went over 90* after 4 gears of WOT in 80*F outside air temps. The DME doesn't start pulling timing until around 120*F IAT.

Unless you are road racing the car in Arizona/Texas in August, or running WOT for 1/2 mile blasts at a time, the 5" stepped VRSF I/C is all you'll need.

the 5" VRSF is a solid intercooler, but i still would go with the bigger 7" if customer has upgraded turbos
Since both are the same price, i see no reason to get the 5" with an FBO car

[STR8-6IX]

5 inch: daily driving

7: track use

[Tiago@VRSF]

There's no noticeable pressure drop or lag when going from the 5" to the 7". We recommend the 7" unless you don't want to trim.

[Turbod]

Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF

There's no noticeable pressure drop or lag when going from the 5" to the 7". We recommend the 7" unless you don't want to trim.

Completely agree

[NRigs]

I got the 5" installed on Saturday. Have it paired with the Cobb Stage 1+ tune for the time being until I get the downpipe installed and get an MHD custom tune. Car feels like it breathes so much better and definitely less lag (from the little that there is stock or just stage 1 without the FMIC).

I will add that this was kind of a PITA to install. 1. I had a really hard time fitting the silicone houses onto the FMIC and ended up having to use a little oil so they would slide on which I generally do not like to do. 2. I feel the passenger side hose is a bit too short. The top clamp hangs slightly over the end of the clamp, but it is secure at least. 3. OEM screws to mount the intercooler are too short. I bought it used, not sure if VRSF supplied new screws to mount it. I luckily had longer screws in my toolbox that worked perfectly. I honestly think these screws came from the MAF on stock airbox as I have the BMS intake intsalled. 4. I ended up trimming a tiny bit of plastic passenger side that the top of the intercooler was hitting just so it had more room to slide in.

Total install took 4 hours, but one of those hours was trying to loosen a rusted bolt from the used clamps that I was given. Sounds simple, but it was so frustrating.
I did this on rhino ramps. I used my car jack to help me hold the intercooler up in place to connect the hoses.