[musc]

Originally Posted by hotrod182

I just do the regular S6 Launch control every time. It still seems like it is hard to keep it from spinning to much, I usually have to lift a little. You can also, do a throttle smash burnout mode, and then quickly lift and modulate as best possible. Too much rpm, or too abrupt..and my tires just spin too much. The 335i is so drama free its kind of strange. I mean, it kind of tears at the tires, but nothing too out of control. Pretty good grip without the LSD. It easily is matching my 60's in the M3 as it is. As I said if you could launch it with some boost...(slicks)...it would lower the 1/4 times to the very low 13's . Power braking it (very briefly!)...it starts spinning the tires right at around 2000 RPMs. If you could launch with that boost..it would do wonders. I think the steptronic has the launch advantage without beating up the car/clutch.

Thats the beauty of an automatic. They are easy to launch and from my experience, more consistent than manuals for drag racing. I bet with drag radials on the 335i with a 2000-2200 (if the converter slips that much) would yield some very low 13s (?high 12s with good weather), stock. My regular drag strip car has an auto that shifts quicker than the SMG in S6. People always bash autos, but they are a lot better than most realize.

Thats kind of weird with the LC. If depress the accelerator slow for LC, it launches at the 1800, but no spin at all. Doesn't even feel like the computer tries to keep the wheels from spinning, because they dont spin at all. In fact, it just feels sluggish and 'slow' till about 3500 rpm, when the car really takes off. Hence my 0-60 sucked with LC, with ETs in the upper 13s with the same traps of 105-106. I tried the burnout mode, which was hopeless, as I coudlnt modulate the throttle enough to get a good run without spinning.

I was reading on another forum about doing a full SMG reset by disconnecting the battery. I have done the soft reset with the paddle pull, which firms up the shift....but I wonder if my easy driving has caused some weak driver adaptation? Maybe making the LC slower than it should be? The last 6K miles or so have been really easy, just highway cruise. rarely over 80... no lauching, S6, or anything. I have just read so many times where the car tends to adapt to your habits. I guess its worth a try.

[dmz]

Speaking of american muscle, a guy at work just bought a slighly used '06 Pontiac GTO 6 speed manual with 5k miles for $24k and took it to the drag strip last weekend and did a 13.2s @ 107MPH bone stock. He said that if he could keep the wheel hop down at launch he can easily get it into the 12s. How is that for a bang for the buck?

Originally Posted by hotrod182

So did you run the qtr mile? Well at least you can see how close our Gtech results are between us....my times were 4.785-4.893 seconds. Thats pretty darn consistant. Let us know how the VBOX results pan out..in the C&D test the Vbox was within .05 sec of the timing lights and .25mph, compared to .10 sec, .50mph for the GTech. But the VBox is going to be more consistant. Either way of testing is much more accurate than seat of the pants feel, and within the variances of temp/baro/elevation/humidity...that comes with comparing two cars anyways. I see you have a steptronic like mine....sedan also?? We have to get some Xede equipped 335i to test. I'm predicting 12.9 @ 111 MPH......not quite is fast as a stock C6 Corvette. They run 12.8 @ 112 (in the table listed earlier in this thread), but have 400HP and weigh hundreds of lbs less. Interestingly enough, the 500HP (but heavier) GT500 Mustang gets about the same numbers. Of course this is with stock street tires. I really believe with slicks, the 335i would run very low 13s.

[WxSquid]

Anyone know the drivetrain loss for converting to (roughly) crank numbers? I just came from the MINI community where I had solid info that there was a 12% loss with the manual, roughly 20% with the auto when using a Dynojet.

Looking to dyno now that I'm past break-in....

Doug

[hotrod182]

Originally Posted by catm3

Thats the beauty of an automatic. They are easy to launch and from my experience, more consistent than manuals for drag racing. I bet with drag radials on the 335i with a 2000-2200 (if the converter slips that much) would yield some very low 13s (?high 12s with good weather), stock. My regular drag strip car has an auto that shifts quicker than the SMG in S6. People always bash autos, but they are a lot better than most realize.

Thats kind of weird with the LC. If depress the accelerator slow for LC, it launches at the 1800, but no spin at all. Doesn't even feel like the computer tries to keep the wheels from spinning, because they dont spin at all. In fact, it just feels sluggish and 'slow' till about 3500 rpm, when the car really takes off. Hence my 0-60 sucked with LC, with ETs in the upper 13s with the same traps of 105-106. I tried the burnout mode, which was hopeless, as I coudlnt modulate the throttle enough to get a good run without spinning.

I was reading on another forum about doing a full SMG reset by disconnecting the battery. I have done the soft reset with the paddle pull, which firms up the shift....but I wonder if my easy driving has caused some weak driver adaptation? Maybe making the LC slower than it should be? The last 6K miles or so have been really easy, just highway cruise. rarely over 80... no lauching, S6, or anything. I have just read so many times where the car tends to adapt to your habits. I guess its worth a try.

If you are running 106mph in the qtr, you definitely have the power to be running lower 13's and 0-60 in the high 4 second range. I usually run when its cold, because the car feels so much stronger. 58F or less. The colder weather probably gives me a little wheel spin too. A little wheel spin may actually help keep the engine from bogging at times. (this is why some 4WD cars are actually kind of hard to launch without killing the clutch). When I leave with launch control, it is really pretty violent and hard...there is NO bogging of the engine....and seems very ideal. I have no reason to tap the throttle to raise the RPMs any more. I do drive relatively hard. I know I go through the gears..redline it quite often. I just love the feel of acceleration. What is your avg MPG? In 10,000 miles of driving in my M3, I am averaging 16MPG all around. That is with two trips from Los Angeles to Sanfranciso. On a side note: my 335i is only averaging 13.6mpg so far. I don't think my M3 was ever any lower than that. But then again...I spend a lot of time on boost..LOL. I am a car nut, as you can probably tell, I love testing, testing, trying different things, and analyzing data. I even have a Snap On lift in my garage, because I got tired of crawling under cars...laying on my back.

As far as automatics go...My GN has an automatic. 3.8L Buick GNs regularly turn high 12 second qtr miles at only 106MPH+ with traction. They use the turbo/automatic trans combo to their advantage...and do power brake launches with major boost. As far as top end loss...my GN had a chip that locked up the converter above 60MPH in 3rd-4th gear at full throttle. So trap speeds weren't hurt. The only problem was that I was pretty much at redline, and overboosting just before the end of the 1/4 mile, but if I shifted to overdrive 4th, it would totally be bogging the engine down....I wish 4th didn't lock up the converter! Hence the advantage of the 6spd automatic/steptronic. Those extra gear ratios help you to do a lot.

As far as the GTO is concerned. Yes they are rated pretty fast. Even though they weigh a little more...with that 400HP Corvette engine...they have a pretty good trap speed.. 107-108MPH. Their 0-60 time is sometimes only 5.0 sec, and about 13.5 in the 1/4. So a M3/335i could seriously challenge them in the 1/4 miles, but the GTO is slowly pulling away at upper speeds. It is traction limited...(My friend gave me a ride in his). I bet if you check out drag times...all you have to do is put on slicks to be running very low 13s, or high 12s. That is my impression, without even researching the drag times. They definitely don't have the refinement, or the precise handling. When riding in one, it almost feels like a Camaro...compared to the BMW in refinement. But interestingly enough...his car is the one I most want to beat! And with the M3, there isn't too much I can do. With the Exede/335i of course, the situation would be ripe for the picking. As with the Corvette, that 6L V8 also gets great HWY gas mileage because of the high torque...tall overdrive gearing. So again, stock from a stand still, you should be able to stick with the GTO at least till 60mph. He has a very loud exhaust. and CAI, he THINKS it will trap at 112mph, high 12s in the qtr...If I can get around to timing his GTO, I will post the times. On the other hand, he is seriously considering putting on a Eaton blower...which I have seen take these things to 500RWHP! No but serioiusly, if I could comfortably pull away from GTOs, and most EVO/WRXs, I would be so much more pleased. And if the 335i could keep up with the stock C6 Corvette, that would be wonderful. But with the weight disparity...the 335i would need to be making about 440HP.

[sdiver68]

Originally Posted by dmz

Speaking of american muscle, a guy at work just bought a slighly used '06 Pontiac GTO 6 speed manual with 5k miles for $24k and took it to the drag strip last weekend and did a 13.2s @ 107MPH bone stock. He said that if he could keep the wheel hop down at launch he can easily get it into the 12s. How is that for a bang for the buck?

Problem is, and CTS-V owners have the same issue, it's impossible to keep the wheel hop down in those cars.

But yes, they (GTO's, CTS-V's) are strong! Stock for Stock, I'd run a GTO but not expect to win. I think, however, that even if I lost the GTO owner would find new found respect as it would be close and typically he would be used to trashing 3 series.

[sdiver68]

Originally Posted by hotrod182

If you are running 106mph in the qtr, you definitely have the power to be running lower 13's and 0-60 in the high 4 second range. I usually run when its cold, because the car feels so much stronger. 58F or less. The colder weather probably gives me a little wheel spin too. A little wheel spin may actually help keep the engine from bogging at times. (this is why some 4WD cars are actually kind of hard to launch without killing the clutch). When I leave with launch control, it is really pretty violent and hard...there is NO bogging of the engine....and seems very ideal. I have no reason to tap the throttle to raise the RPMs any more. I do drive relatively hard. I know I go through the gears..redline it quite often. I just love the feel of acceleration. What is your avg MPG? In 10,000 miles of driving in my M3, I am averaging 16MPG all around. That is with two trips from Los Angeles to Sanfranciso. On a side note: my 335i is only averaging 13.6mpg so far. I don't think my M3 was ever any lower than that. But then again...I spend a lot of time on boost..LOL. I am a car nut, as you can probably tell, I love testing, testing, trying different things, and analyzing data. I even have a Snap On lift in my garage, because I got tired of crawling under cars...laying on my back.

As far as automatics go...My GN has an automatic. 3.8L Buick GNs regularly turn high 12 second qtr miles at only 106MPH+ with traction. They use the turbo/automatic trans combo to their advantage...and do power brake launches with major boost. As far as top end loss...my GN had a chip that locked up the converter above 60MPH in 3rd-4th gear at full throttle. So trap speeds weren't hurt. The only problem was that I was pretty much at redline, and overboosting just before the end of the 1/4 mile, but if I shifted to overdrive 4th, it would totally be bogging the engine down....I wish 4th didn't lock up the converter! Hence the advantage of the 6spd automatic/steptronic. Those extra gear ratios help you to do a lot.

As far as the GTO is concerned. Yes they are rated pretty fast. Even though they weigh a little more...with that 400HP Corvette engine...they have a pretty good trap speed.. 107-108MPH. Their 0-60 time is sometimes only 5.0 sec, and about 13.5 in the 1/4. So a M3/335i could seriously challenge them in the 1/4 miles, but the GTO is slowly pulling away at upper speeds. It is traction limited...(My friend gave me a ride in his). I bet if you check out drag times...all you have to do is put on slicks to be running very low 13s, or high 12s. That is my impression, without even researching the drag times. They definitely don't have the refinement, or the precise handling. When riding in one, it almost feels like a Camaro...compared to the BMW in refinement. But interestingly enough...his car is the one I most want to beat! And with the M3, there isn't too much I can do. With the Exede/335i of course, the situation would be ripe for the picking. As with the Corvette, that 6L V8 also gets great HWY gas mileage because of the high torque...tall overdrive gearing. So again, stock from a stand still, you should be able to stick with the GTO at least till 60mph. He has a very loud exhaust. and CAI, he THINKS it will trap at 112mph, high 12s in the qtr...If I can get around to timing his GTO, I will post the times. On the other hand, he is seriously considering putting on a Eaton blower...which I have seen take these things to 500RWHP! No but serioiusly, if I could comfortably pull away from GTOs, and most EVO/WRXs, I would be so much more pleased. And if the 335i could keep up with the stock C6 Corvette, that would be wonderful. But with the weight disparity...the 335i would need to be making about 440HP.

+1, and thanks for your posts I can tell you are someone who has BTDT and not talking out your FWIW, my avg mpg in my 335i (mostly DS mode Step) is ~20, but I'm not at WOT very often!

[kujo]

Originally Posted by hotrod182

So did you run the qtr mile? Well at least you can see how close our Gtech results are between us....my times were 4.785-4.893 seconds. Thats pretty darn consistant. Let us know how the VBOX results pan out..in the C&D test the Vbox was within .05 sec of the timing lights and .25mph, compared to .10 sec, .50mph for the GTech. But the VBox is going to be more consistant. Either way of testing is much more accurate than seat of the pants feel, and within the variances of temp/baro/elevation/humidity...that comes with comparing two cars anyways. I see you have a steptronic like mine....sedan also?? We have to get some Xede equipped 335i to test. I'm predicting 12.9 @ 111 MPH......not quite is fast as a stock C6 Corvette. They run 12.8 @ 112 (in the table listed earlier in this thread), but have 400HP and weigh hundreds of lbs less. Interestingly enough, the 500HP (but heavier) GT500 Mustang gets about the same numbers. Of course this is with stock street tires. I really believe with slicks, the 335i would run very low 13s.

Yes, I have an AT sedan as well.
I did not run the 1/4 as I didn't have a road long enough and dead enough to run that fast.

Getting rid of these RFTs will help a bit as well, as they don't grip as well as say PS2s do.

I'll be able to go out with my VBox, with another member here and we'll be able to test both cars, back to back and run the 1/4 times as well.

We'll see what they come up with.

I can also run both the VBox and Gtech at the same time, as I have a splitter to power them both, so we'll see how those units compare as well.

kj

[hotrod182]

Originally Posted by kujo

Yes, I have an AT sedan as well.
I did not run the 1/4 as I didn't have a road long enough and dead enough to run that fast.

Getting rid of these RFTs will help a bit as well, as they don't grip as well as say PS2s do.

I'll be able to go out with my VBox, with another member here and we'll be able to test both cars, back to back and run the 1/4 times as well.

We'll see what they come up with.

I can also run both the VBox and Gtech at the same time, as I have a splitter to power them both, so we'll see how those units compare as well.

kj

That will be very nice. One of the mistakes some people make is hitting the start button on the GTech before the car is perfectly still, (not rocking on the springs still). Thats why I usually wait at least 5 seconds after stopping. I would say that the times should be within .15 sec....and .75mph from what I have read. Do you dial in a rollout with the Vbox? I bought a Vericom many years ago, but it started reading out of whack, so I bought the GTech. Im so glad I don't have to manually write down the numbers any more! The Gtech stores at least 10 runs, then you just download it to your computer. Also remember, on the charts that I superimposed the graphs, the odds of having both cars so close 2x is astronomical if the Gtech wasn't consistant. Specifically, they were both within about 4/100th of a second on both runs.

[Ryan@Motorwerks]

What shifting program were you using? Did you lift the throttle between shifts? The shifts don't look that fast for SMG.

[musc]

Originally Posted by hotrod182

If you are running 106mph in the qtr, you definitely have the power to be running lower 13's and 0-60 in the high 4 second range. I usually run when its cold, because the car feels so much stronger. 58F or less. The colder weather probably gives me a little wheel spin too. A little wheel spin may actually help keep the engine from bogging at times. (this is why some 4WD cars are actually kind of hard to launch without killing the clutch). When I leave with launch control, it is really pretty violent and hard...there is NO bogging of the engine....and seems very ideal. I have no reason to tap the throttle to raise the RPMs any more. I do drive relatively hard. I know I go through the gears..redline it quite often. I just love the feel of acceleration. What is your avg MPG? In 10,000 miles of driving in my M3, I am averaging 16MPG all around. That is with two trips from Los Angeles to Sanfranciso. On a side note: my 335i is only averaging 13.6mpg so far. I don't think my M3 was ever any lower than that. But then again...I spend a lot of time on boost..LOL. I am a car nut, as you can probably tell, I love testing, testing, trying different things, and analyzing data. I even have a Snap On lift in my garage, because I got tired of crawling under cars...laying on my back.

As far as automatics go...My GN has an automatic. 3.8L Buick GNs regularly turn high 12 second qtr miles at only 106MPH+ with traction. They use the turbo/automatic trans combo to their advantage...and do power brake launches with major boost. As far as top end loss...my GN had a chip that locked up the converter above 60MPH in 3rd-4th gear at full throttle. So trap speeds weren't hurt. The only problem was that I was pretty much at redline, and overboosting just before the end of the 1/4 mile, but if I shifted to overdrive 4th, it would totally be bogging the engine down....I wish 4th didn't lock up the converter! Hence the advantage of the 6spd automatic/steptronic. Those extra gear ratios help you to do a lot.

As far as the GTO is concerned. Yes they are rated pretty fast. Even though they weigh a little more...with that 400HP Corvette engine...they have a pretty good trap speed.. 107-108MPH. Their 0-60 time is sometimes only 5.0 sec, and about 13.5 in the 1/4. So a M3/335i could seriously challenge them in the 1/4 miles, but the GTO is slowly pulling away at upper speeds. It is traction limited...(My friend gave me a ride in his). I bet if you check out drag times...all you have to do is put on slicks to be running very low 13s, or high 12s. That is my impression, without even researching the drag times. They definitely don't have the refinement, or the precise handling. When riding in one, it almost feels like a Camaro...compared to the BMW in refinement. But interestingly enough...his car is the one I most want to beat! And with the M3, there isn't too much I can do. With the Exede/335i of course, the situation would be ripe for the picking. As with the Corvette, that 6L V8 also gets great HWY gas mileage because of the high torque...tall overdrive gearing. So again, stock from a stand still, you should be able to stick with the GTO at least till 60mph. He has a very loud exhaust. and CAI, he THINKS it will trap at 112mph, high 12s in the qtr...If I can get around to timing his GTO, I will post the times. On the other hand, he is seriously considering putting on a Eaton blower...which I have seen take these things to 500RWHP! No but serioiusly, if I could comfortably pull away from GTOs, and most EVO/WRXs, I would be so much more pleased. And if the 335i could keep up with the stock C6 Corvette, that would be wonderful. But with the weight disparity...the 335i would need to be making about 440HP.

The MPH is there, so I know I am losing some time in the early part of the run. Interestingly, I have had a 60ft in the 2.0x range. My average mpg is more like 23. I know Inspection 1 is based on your mpg. I am at 21K with it still showing Insp. 1 nearly 4K miles away. I have had spurts of hard driving, but overall, I have just done a lot of cruising.

I love the grand nationals. I used to run with a few guys that had them, one had the GNX! I have a 69 Chevy Nova with a built TH350. No lock up converter, but I have still trapped 99 mph in the 1/8th. It is set up with a low compression big block chevy which hopefully will receive a turbo soon Goal is a 9 second range 1/4 mile.

The GTOs are a great budget beast, easy to mod. I wasnt too impressed with the upper end, but they do have loads of torque. This was in an 4spd auto that I drove. Not sure how the 6spd GTOs are. My brother did have a run in with a 6spd GTO with his F250 turbo diesel... which easily beat the GTO. His truck made me give up on trying to build fast N/A motors. With an aftermarket turbo setup, it puts down 1100 rwtq

[hotrod182]

Originally Posted by 335e90

What shifting program were you using? Did you lift the throttle between shifts? The shifts don't look that fast for SMG.

S6 Program.. full throttle with no lift during the shifts. The acceleration graph probably reflects more delay than just the shift itself...it shows the delay of the engine throttle response/timing/etc....and it also shows the shock of being in a taller gear suddenly (accompanied by some wheel spin), with less acceleration gs. Remember...there is more time involved than just the mechanical gear change. Either way..in the M3, with the SMG ripping through those shifts, it feels so fast...its amazing the 335i acceleration is right there with it. Also, if you look at each acceleration segment and draw a straight line through it, indeed the M3 is steeper between the shifts between 2nd/3rd gears...60-100mph...but then on all my graphs, above 100mph..it seems the 335i is just as steep. But again, that is just the start of 4th gear on the M3, so who knows how it would compare if the speeds continued. Very interesting...because I was saying how the M3 feels stronger down at upper FWY speeds...and judging by the graphs, I would say the M3 makes its greatest pull on the 335i between 85-100mph..but maybe they are closer than we think at 100 MPH. I love these graphs, it answers a lot of questions about gearing, where the M3 has its advantages, etc, etc. If the M3 shifted even quicker..you can see how it would be ahead..but again...the full throttle shifts "feel" instantaneous. The 335i steptronic just has a mild "lull" between shifts, in contrast to the sharp well defined shifts of the SMG.

[Norsk]

Great Post Hotrod

Very informative

[hotrod182]

Originally Posted by Norsk

Great Post Hotrod

Very informative

Thank you very much. It's always a pleasure..people in this forum seem to be very respectable car enthusiasts.

Did you already see this cool 335i video on Edmunds? :
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=117669

[2007/335i/coupe]

Thanks for the clip

[OIIIIO]

what exhaust do you have on your 335i?

[OC ///M]

hotrod182;

I couldn't help myself...I had to thank you for the very informative post.

I consider you a "Jedi" on this forum and know that other newbies besides myself will appreciate your efforts here.

I know it's an old post...but it deserves a

Thanks again.
OC kid