[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by themyst

thanks for the info. ETA on rev 2.5 upgrades and/or DIY?

This upcoming week we will start taking in Rev2 for Rev2.5 updates. I'll be providing update instructions via email for those who are overseas that can't easily ship their procedes to us. It's not really a DIY since I don't think anyone will have the necessary desoldering equipment in their basement. Definitely a computer repair shop job.

[SloppyJoe]

can you send me the instructions shiv?
I can handily solder most surface mount components no problem.
This would be a good weekend project

[themyst]

OK I put back the old Procede back in to test it out, updated to latest tuner maps, didn't change a thing except boost target and injection mode, reset all adaptations, CANclear on

It's still flatlining timing post-shift. Is there anyone who can take a look and tell me what to change to prevent this from happening? Log indicates a rich condition post-shift that needs to be adjusted on meth. I have the csv file if anyone can help.... thanks in advance.

[TT3 iN NyC]

Originally Posted by themyst

OK I put back the old Procede back in to test it out, updated to latest tuner maps, didn't change a thing except boost target and injection mode, reset all adaptations, CANclear on

It's still flatlining timing post-shift. Is there anyone who can take a look and tell me what to change to prevent this from happening? Log indicates a rich condition post-shift that needs to be adjusted on meth. I have the csv file if anyone can help.... thanks in advance.

Welcome back!

[dzenno]

themyst, seems odd you fuel trims are going so positive (maxing out basically) post shift...

[themyst]

I didn't post my methanol flow in the log, but it's spraying 18-19 for flow on my "pps" kit. Right between time 99-100 timing attempts to recover then flatlines as AFR goes rich. Same thing I've observed on the JB4.

Now, to figure out if this is fixable....

[themyst]

to answer some PMs I've gotten, no I didn't misfire in limited testing.

[Ilma]

I'm sad to say that Dzenno was right......my timing issue has returned this week for no apparent reason.

It seems to be specific to an upshift from 3rd to 4th only.

When I log 2nd to 3rd - no problems...timing looks perfect.

The only thing I have noticed on my logs is that the shift into 4th gear is faster than the other gears according to the time stamps.

Like under 2/10's of a second from when ignition falls to zero for the shift and then starts to rise back for the next gear.

At this point boost is still spiking downwards as timing is being reapplied.

When shift timing is 3/10th's or more the boost spike is completely finished and then timing is reapplied successfully and doesn't flatline.

I wonder if Shiv could program a map to allow ignition to recover a little bit later? I would think not - since the DME is probably controlling the entire upshift process independently of the procede.

I'm still scratching my head on this one, but I am now beginning to suspect it's the upshift timing sequence not harmonizing very well for 4th gear.

[enrita]

Strange my fuel trims got full negative with meth and car was not running right because too rich . Fixed now by removing fuel some months ago.

[themyst]

Originally Posted by Ilma

I'm sad to say that Dzenno was right......my timing issue has returned this week for no apparent reason.

It seems to be specific to an upshift from 3rd to 4th only.

When I log 2nd to 3rd - no problems...timing looks perfect.

The only thing I have noticed on my logs is that the shift into 4th gear is faster than the other gears according to the time stamps.

Like under 2/10's of a second from when ignition falls to zero for the shift and then starts to rise back for the next gear, or Vishnu needs to implement gear-dependent fuel mapping. Who knows.

At this point boost is still spiking downwards as timing is being reapplied.

When shift timing is 3/10th's or more the boost spike is completely finished and then timing is reapplied successfully and doesn't flatline.

I wonder if Shiv could program a map to allow ignition to recover a little bit later? I would think not - since the DME is probably controlling the entire upshift process independently of the procede.

I'm still scratching my head on this one, but I am now beginning to suspect it's the upshift timing sequence not harmonizing very well for 4th gear.

Looks like you need to possibly adjust the OL mapping for the 3-4 shift as opposed to the 2-3, or find some happy medium.

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by enrita

Strange my fuel trims got full negative with meth and car was not running right because too rich . Fixed now by removing fuel some months ago.

Makes sense you were running rich if the fuel trims went negative.

But Myst is showing positive fuel trims.

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by themyst

Looks like you need to possibly adjust the OL mapping for the 3-4 shift as opposed to the 2-3, or find some happy medium.

The maps are not gear specific as far as I know.

[themyst]

Originally Posted by Ilma

The maps are not gear specific as far as I know.

Yeah I know that, what I'm wondering is if your fueling goes richer on the 3-4 shift as opposed to the 2-3. Maybe u should make the adjustments for 4th gear instead of 3rd.

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by themyst

Yeah I know that, what I'm wondering is if your fueling goes richer on the 3-4 shift as opposed to the 2-3. Maybe u should make the adjustments for 4th gear instead of 3rd.

That does seem to be the case.

2-3rd the AF ratio was 12.1 post shift.
3-4th it drops to low 11's or high 10's sometimes.

But I still don't think that's enough to upset the timing curve.

Here is my 2-3rd shift. It took 3/10's of a second

Notice how the boost spike is completely finished before timing is reapplied.

[Ilma]

Here is the 3-4th shift with a timing drop.

Notice that timing tries to ramp up right in the middle of the boost spike.

That shift times at 1/10th of a second....seems too fast?

[OpenFlash]

Ilma- log IAT and see if you see a correlation between it and your 3-4th gear timing drop. The only real difference between the 2-3 shift and the 3-4 shift is that IAT is almost always higher during the latter. This is one reason that, when running pwm meth, you will not see timing drop post shift, regardless of fuel trims. I did a bunch of testing on a local 6at car. Running the newest dme software.

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Ilma- log IAT and see if you see a correlation between it and your 3-4th gear timing drop. The only real difference between the 2-3 shift and the 3-4 shift is that IAT is almost always higher during the latter. This is one reason that, when running pwm meth, you will not see timing drop post shift, regardless of fuel trims. I did a bunch of testing on a local 6at car. Running the newest dme software.

I just checked the temps on those logs.......
Bear in mind that I am stock exhaust/downpipes, but do have an aftermarket intercooler and DCI's.

For the 3-4th pull, ambients were 79F and the IAT when I hit fourth gear was 102F.

For the 2-3rd run, ambients were a little cooler, but the IAT hitting 3rd gear was 94F.

Bear in mind that this problem has been hounding me since April when ambients were significantly lower.

I don't know anymore.....I think I am spinning my wheels on this one

It's so frustrating because the car feels so good and I just don't want to give up on it.

[dzenno]

It doesn't look IAT related at all BUT I think given Shiv stated PWM meth fixes it completely I say you guy the PWM meth kit from him with the condition that the issue will go away after the fact and that way you have the best of both worlds, meth which you want and shiv showing that this really does fix it...

game? would love to see how this fixes it seriously...i just don't see it..

[OpenFlash]

I'm game. I've done enough testing to be confident enough on this subject.

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by dzenno

It doesn't look IAT related at all BUT I think given Shiv stated PWM meth fixes it completely I say you guy the PWM meth kit from him with the condition that the issue will go away after the fact and that way you have the best of both worlds, meth which you want and shiv showing that this really does fix it...

game? would love to see how this fixes it seriously...i just don't see it..

Lol.......I wouldn't do that to Shiv.

In any case, even if 4th gear timing sucks, 1-3rd would rip and I can stop buying race gas to raise my octane.

But yeah - I don't think meth or cooler intake temps are going to solve this problem.

I have already tried pure 110 octane in cooler weather.

But I tell you what. I would be game for a new procede unit and send my old one to Vishnu to see if the problem replicates on another car.

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

I'm game. I've done enough testing to be confident enough on this subject.

You actually think the meth kit would solve this issue for me?

[dzenno]

Originally Posted by Ilma

You actually think the meth kit would solve this issue for me?

I say go for it, if it doesn't work out let's have the option to return for full refund...if it does this'll be one major reason why pwm meth kits integrated with procede rock!