[hl0m4n]

Originally Posted by bnj

However, Dinan would need the ECU password from BMW to get into the ECU to be able to program it to make it perform better than what piggybacks ar able to accomplish. He might not have the password. Even if he got it, there is a lot to catch up. We'll see.

this is awesome. can't wait to see what dinan has done with their ecu having seen the competition such as aa and procede.

on a more interesting thought, i wonder how the bmw ecu password looks like? i don't think it can be like a pw for your e90 accounts. maybe something like a code from the movie swordfish? seems really cool on how people broke the pw on the e46 m3s.

[BzzzBom]

Are all the current BMW/Dinan dealers on Dinan's website no longer Dinan dealers? Please define "Broke up."

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by astris

If you were looking to lose hp on your E60 M5, Dinan would be a great choice, lol... check post #5.

http://http://www.m5board.com/vbulle...d.php?t=101926

This is out of context.....I had Dinan SW installed no problem at all.

As with any SW flash, the ECU forgets how the driver drives. It adapts quickly.

[Beer Goggles]

Originally Posted by Crimson92

way off topic, beer you used to have a Z right? you were on 350zmotoring?

good to see a familiar face around here, you made the right move with the 3

Yes sir!

Who were you on Motoring?

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by bnj

However, Dinan would need the ECU password from BMW to get into the ECU to be able to program it to make it perform better than what piggybacks ar able to accomplish. He might not have the password. Even if he got it, there is a lot to catch up. We'll see.

Why would this be any different than what Turner has done?

[Beer Goggles]

Originally Posted by zenmaster

Why would this be any different than what Turner has done?

None of the piggybacks are altering maps or the code of the computer. They are simply adjusting voltage (simple terms) of sensors so the computer sees something different.

[Beer Goggles]

Originally Posted by BzzzBom

Are all the current BMW/Dinan dealers on Dinan's website no longer Dinan dealers? Please define "Broke up."

I read somewhere and forgive me for not having the link, that Dinan and BMW had a falling out over who paid for warranty claims. If that isn't true then I'm a moron, which there is a good possibility. This is the internet afterall.

[hotrod2448]

Originally Posted by Beer Goggles

Do you have any to back up your claim. Go blow up your turbo or engine and see who pays for it...it's going to be you.

Just like with my FI350Z, my TK didn't void my warranty, but if I blew something up Greddy nor Nissan was realistically going to pay for it. I'm not spreading paranoia I'm spreading the reality that NO company unless they have some outside insurance policy is going to pay for your engine if you blow it up.

Removing the redline is a nice way for BMW to say you over-revved the engine. You think DINAN is going to buy you an engine...or anybody?

Let's be real. Dinan's stance, and ANY tuner, is they think their product won't cause a failure. They really wouldn't release it if they did. But if there is some problem they fingers are going to be pointed the other way.

Why do you think BMW and Dinan "broke up".

Well, then I guess since neither of us have any evidence to support either of our statements and we are both wrong. Let's not continue this BS any longer.

[Crimson92]

Originally Posted by Beer Goggles

Yes sir!

Who were you on Motoring?

5sftecelica...anyways enjoy the 3...i know i am

[astris]

Originally Posted by T Bone

This is out of context.....I had Dinan SW installed no problem at all.

As with any SW flash, the ECU forgets how the driver drives. It adapts quickly.

Please explain how that is out of context. Poster dynoed car pre and post software installation. Post installation dyno shows 10whp loss. Seems pretty cut and dry unless there are a whole bunch of other detrimental factors left our of the post. Temps and different dynos can play factors, but I don't know why anyone would run on different dynos at greatly different temps.

Yes, I understand ecu adaption, but under no circumstance should one lose horsepower, especially that much, due to the ecu not being fully adapted. Gains may be minimal or nill immediately after installation, but should not be showing a loss.

So, you are going to tell me that once he drives around the car is going to pick up 20whp just from adaption? I don't think so.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by astris

Please explain how that is out of context. Poster dynoed car pre and post software installation. Post installation dyno shows 10whp loss. Seems pretty cut and dry unless there are a whole bunch of other detrimental factors left our of the post. Temps and different dynos can play factors, but I don't know why anyone would run on different dynos at greatly different temps.

Yes, I understand ecu adaption, but under no circumstance should one lose horsepower, especially that much, due to the ecu not being fully adapted. Gains may be minimal or nill immediately after installation, but should not be showing a loss.

So, you are going to tell me that once he drives around the car is going to pick up 20whp just from adaption? I don't think so.

It is out of context because you need to follow about 3-4 seperate threads. Here is the thread where the poster in Darren_Dallas is asking about the variance in the dyno results. The 2 different dyno results were done at big temp differences.

See posts:

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/sho...55&postcount=1

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/sho...5&postcount=50

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/sho...&postcount=107


Darren_Dallas appears to have some specific problems with both the dyno and perhaps some of his mods.

I also had the SW installed and like it quite a bit, no loss in power.

[hool97]

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu
It's funny that he would say that considering he approached us a few months back, asking us if we could sell him re-boxed PROcedes for him to private label.

Shiv

Originally Posted by normtrum

SNAP!

+1

Sometimes better control can be gained by piggyback systems look at Viperalley and Imports. It took reworking the ECM for us Vette owners to have 2 and 3 bar maps. Yet these are not as good as Bigstuff 3 or other piggyback ecms/full ecms.

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by Beer Goggles

None of the piggybacks are altering maps or the code of the computer. They are simply adjusting voltage (simple terms) of sensors so the computer sees something different.

Right. Why is Dinan's any different than Turner's? Both are flashes.

[hl0m4n]

well just got off phone with dinan and spoke to three reps. all say it is still in "development" and expected release is still 1-2 months away. sorry guys but i don't think it is weeks away.

[bnj]

Originally Posted by zenmaster

Why would this be any different than what Turner has done?

Its not any different. ECU reflash cannot do much before ECU can be reprogrammed. It is password protected and tuners do not know how to reprogram it. When the map cannot be changed in ECU, the only way to change the map is to use piggyback. Current reflashes are comparable to Juice Box and SSTT in many respects.

Only if someone figures out how to reprogram the ECU, has ECU reflash a chance to provide better performance than a piggyback. As ar as I know, tuners do not know yet how to reprogram the ECU. Figuring out something like that can take a long time. It can be many years... or many days... but you cannot count on it to be a short time.

[hotrod2448]

Originally Posted by bnj

Its not any different. ECU reflash cannot do much before ECU can be reprogrammed. It is password protected and tuners do not know how to reprogram it. When the map cannot be changed in ECU, the only way to change the map is to use piggyback. Current reflashes are comparable to Juice Box and SSTT in many respects.

Only if someone figures out how to reprogram the ECU, has ECU reflash a chance to provide better performance than a piggyback. As ar as I know, tuners do not know yet how to reprogram the ECU. Figuring out something like that can take a long time. It can be many years... or many days... but you cannot count on it to be a short time.

Reflashing and reprogramming are two ways of saying the same thing. Obviously if they are going to offer a reflash they have figured out how to reprogram the ECU. Unless they are using a replacement ECU or a piggyback but, at that point they should not be calling it a "reflash".

[bnj]

Originally Posted by hotrod2448

Reflashing and reprogramming are two ways of saying the same thing. Obviously if they are going to offer a reflash they have figured out how to reprogram the ECU. Unless they are using a replacement ECU or a piggyback but, at that point they should not be calling it a "reflash".

You are right. I would use the terms "reflash" and "reprogram" easily at the same way as you suggested.

What I try to say is that they are not able to fully reprogram it, and a reflash for our cars can change only a part of the code at the moment.

I checked some ECU tuning forums and ECU tuning people use the expression: they are "not being able to reprogram" the ECU. Obviously, the reflash however change the program somehow just as you said. I would understand this "not being able to reprogram" the ECU is that they are not able to reprogram the maps, i.e. e.g. to change ignition timing. However, they might be able to change how the ECU reads the signals. I would think that changing the ECU ihnput signals would be easy even without being able to fully reprogram the ECU. I am not professional in reflashes so I don't know exactly, but if someone knows more please chime in.

[Sherhart]

Originally Posted by T Bone

It is out of context because you need to follow about 3-4 seperate threads. Here is the thread where the poster in Darren_Dallas is asking about the variance in the dyno results. The 2 different dyno results were done at big temp differences.

See posts:

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/sho...55&postcount=1

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/sho...5&postcount=50

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/sho...&postcount=107


Darren_Dallas appears to have some specific problems with both the dyno and perhaps some of his mods.

I also had the SW installed and like it quite a bit, no loss in power.

Dyno numbers aside, I would say the videos do a nice job of showing llittle-to-no gains from the Dinan software. Would you not agree?

Jimbo

[dinkoh]

Originally Posted by BzzzBom

It looks like Dinan software is coming soon. I hope this is a recent addition to their website:

http://www.dinancars.com/whitepapersFile.asp?ID=10

Looks like its offline?

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by Sherhart

Dyno numbers aside, I would say the videos do a nice job of showing llittle-to-no gains from the Dinan software. Would you not agree?

Jimbo

I like the software, a bit more responsive, some extra margin to shift at redline so I don't hit the rev limiter and I can say I have a 200 mph car....but no increase in power but certainly no decrease in power either.

[BzzzBom]

You can't compare ECU reflashes with a normally aspirated engine (or supercharged engine) with a reflash for a turbocharged engine. The ECU controls the boost in a turbo engine so we should see some major HP and Torque increases. My quess is that the Dinan ECU reflash for the N54 engine will increase WHP about 30-40, torque about 40-60, will remove the speed limiter, increase the rev limiter, and may even change the sensitivity of the DTC. The ECU relash will also optimze the AFRs and timing. The cost will be $500-$700. My $0.02 (and I'll bet I am right or close).

[hotrod2448]

Originally Posted by bnj

You are right. I would use the terms "reflash" and "reprogram" easily at the same way as you suggested.

What I try to say is that they are not able to fully reprogram it, and a reflash for our cars can change only a part of the code at the moment.

I checked some ECU tuning forums and ECU tuning people use the expression: they are "not being able to reprogram" the ECU. Obviously, the reflash however change the program somehow just as you said. I would understand this "not being able to reprogram" the ECU is that they are not able to reprogram the maps, i.e. e.g. to change ignition timing. However, they might be able to change how the ECU reads the signals. I would think that changing the ECU ihnput signals would be easy even without being able to fully reprogram the ECU. I am not professional in reflashes so I don't know exactly, but if someone knows more please chime in.

I could be wrong but, I would think you either have the ability to rewrite code or you don't. I can understand them not knowing which ROMs do what shortly after gaining access but, it would seem to me if you could rewrite scaling on the inputs (not sure why you would want to do that when you could just tell the ECU you are now working in this range vs. factory range) you could rewrite the code entirely if you wanted to.