[Former_Boosted_IS]

Originally Posted by lndshrk

Without changing ANY of the components? around +70-80 hp.

Changing the intercooler and improving the cooling? around +100hp.

Beyond that and you are talking changing turbos and motor parts.

Just IMHO, of course.

Jim, I very much appreciate your response and know you are terribly busy, but I would love to see the technical reasons you believe we need to upgrade certain components to achieve more than 100 hp over stock? I know the compressors clearly are taxed at quickly on this car. However, I have seen many IAT's with the stock intercooler and to me they look extremely reasonable. Unless you are course racing very hard, then why does an IAT of 120-135 concern you, especially on a DI car? As for cylinder 5 and 6 getting hot, do you think that this is simply a bi-product of the fuel system? Do you think upgrades there like a larger dual feed fuel rail, pump, and injector setup solves that problem? What do you feel the limits of the internals are?

This is a conversation that every tuner seems to vehemently avoid for some strange reason. I would love cold hard facts on this stuff.

[e.n335]

Originally Posted by Former_Boosted_IS

Jim, I very much appreciate your response and know you are terribly busy, but I would love to see the technical reasons you believe we need to upgrade certain components to achieve more than 100 hp over stock? I know the compressors clearly are taxed at quickly on this car. However, I have seen many IAT's with the stock intercooler and to me they look extremely reasonable. Unless you are course racing very hard, then why does an IAT of 120-135 concern you, especially on a DI car? As for cylinder 5 and 6 getting hot, do you think that this is simply a bi-product of the fuel system? Do you think upgrades there like a larger dual feed fuel rail, pump, and injector setup solves that problem? What do you feel the limits of the internals are?

This is a conversation that every tuner seems to vehemently avoid for some strange reason. I would love cold hard facts on this stuff.

Hi Former_Boosted_IS,

I think a lot of people will be happy with Jim's numbers. Dinan and Noelle basicly confirm what Jim posted here. So take your 335i and ignore everything, probably a blown engine or turbos on YOUR car would be hard fact enough ?

This is no offense. Why don't you start careful and slowly raise the numbers ? My first approach would be to feel confident in what I do, rather than expecting explanations why others do their job like they prefer to.

References like Jim Conforti, Dinan and Noelle are more than credible for me to trust them in tuning my 335i. AA is missing in this list, they don't provide ECU-flashes for the N54 right now. All those tuners are well known in the BMW tuning scene and have a very good reputation due to the reliable performance of their products. It will not be easy to be "better" than they already are.

Cheers,
Eugen

P.S. Beside the ECU-tuning itself, other tuners use larger oil-coolers, different water-pump mappings, high-flow cats and better FMIC's to keep the temp's down, IIRC.

[judec]

Jim,

U mentioned intake and IC, cooling (I suppose U mean oil cooler, or the water radiator needs to be updated too?), what U havent mentioned is the exhaust section - downpipes and the rest and its impact on performance. I am curious about why. U have forgotten to mention it or U dont recommend to install DPs for some reason or what? Care to write a few words?

[Former_Boosted_IS]

Originally Posted by e.n335

Hi Former_Boosted_IS,

I think a lot of people will be happy with Jim's numbers. Dinan and Noelle basicly confirm what Jim posted here. So take your 335i and ignore everything, maybe a blown engine or turbos on YOUR car would be hard fact enough ?

This is no offense. Why don't you start careful and slowly raise the numbers ? My first approach would be to feel confident in what I do, rather than expecting explanations why others do their job like they prefer to.

References like Jim Conforti, Dinan and Noelle are more than credible for me to trust them in tuning my 335i. AA is missing in this list, they don't provide ECU-flashes for the N54 right now. All those tuners are well known in the BMW tuning scene and have a very good reputation due to the reliable performance of their products. It will not be easy to be "better" than they already are.

Cheers,
Eugen

P.S. Beside the ECU-tuning itself, other tuners use larger oil-coolers, different water-pump mappings, high-flow cats and better FMIC's to keep the temp's down, IIRC.

Eugene, some are different then you and I don't know why you don't understand this? Just because Dinan or Noelle runs X power means I should believe them? You clearly could care less about the details of this car, however Jim must know that if he is releasing a flash then giving users good solid infromation on the limits of things like pistons, rings, rods, bolts, injector duty cycle at different power levels, max hp on fuel system, etc. is hugely benefitial to his end users. The future then involves how we can fix the issues that limit power levels.

I am amazed at how you attack those who want to learn. Taking this car to the next level is clearly an interest to tons of people. Making gigantic power on this car is very attractive. Heck, even your God Dinan is researching larger turbos, so they must think this engine can handle some more power with larger turbos. I have never told you what to do or how to do it. I find it uncomfortable that you are trying to stop me from reaching my goals and learning about the limits of what seems like an incredible power plant from BMW.

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by lndshrk

LOL

At this point, I'm only discussing Shark EDIT - btw - the thread title would
probably be more correct if it said "Sharkedit tuneR" - since it's a program
that YOU tune - not a provided tune.

Title change done.

[TurboFan]

Originally Posted by lndshrk

Haven't even really thought about it to be honest.

The release of Shark Edit is somewhat of a change in priorities for me.

I'm 45, and I'm about to have a baby boy.

No offense to everyone with cars, but as of Sept - my Son is the priority.

I'm sure you all understand

Sounds like you'll need an apprentice then. I'll be moving to SLC in July, and I'll have a bit of time on my hands.

I also think you need to snag one of these for the little guy... My son is 15mos and loves his!

[Calgary Agent]

Originally Posted by Former_Boosted_IS

Jim, I very much appreciate your response and know you are terribly busy, but I would love to see the technical reasons you believe we need to upgrade certain components to achieve more than 100 hp over stock? I know the compressors clearly are taxed at quickly on this car. However, I have seen many IAT's with the stock intercooler and to me they look extremely reasonable. Unless you are course racing very hard, then why does an IAT of 120-135 concern you, especially on a DI car?

Former_Boosted - Upgrading the intercooler has more to do with reducing the pressure drop thru the intercooler than it does lowering the IAT *of course a lower charge temp WILL result in a denser charge / slightly more power*. The Spearco FMIC, which is the design that Dinan has selected *and modified* has a significantly lower pressure drop across the unit than does the stock FMIC. What does that mean? Likely somewhere around 1psi increase in boost entering the manifold.

As for the oil cooler, heat is the enemy of any engine, especially one that has FI. Pushing power close to / beyond 400hp (crank) results in undesired level of heat that cause not only premature oil breakdown, but also severe strains on certain mechanical components.

[ezatnova]

Originally Posted by lndshrk

I had not planned to, but a lot of people are asking me too. So this may change in the next month or so.

I already have a tune running in my 335i - and have for months (on and off -
depending on whether my dealer has reflashed me AGAIN or not)

I'm just not saying a thing about it. I'm not stubborn or anything - I just
like to keep control over product releases

W00T

That would be sweet if you sell your "standard stock N54" tune along with the Edit to give people a solid start, or for most people, all they ever need.

[Former_Boosted_IS]

Originally Posted by Calgary Agent

Former_Boosted - Upgrading the intercooler has more to do with reducing the pressure drop thru the intercooler than it does lowering the IAT *of course a lower charge temp WILL result in a denser charge / slightly more power*. The Spearco FMIC, which is the design that Dinan has selected *and modified* has a significantly lower pressure drop across the unit than does the stock FMIC. What does that mean? Likely somewhere around 1psi increase in boost entering the manifold.

As for the oil cooler, heat is the enemy of any engine, especially one that has FI. Pushing power close to / beyond 400hp (crank) results in undesired level of heat that cause not only premature oil breakdown, but also severe strains on certain mechanical components.

The pressure drop is significant in only that it should drive the turbos harder to make up the difference. There is pretty good data thats shows the IATs are 120 - 135 under hard acceleration, which is really not a problem. Remember we are a DI engine, so the heat impact on this engine should be vastly different in terms of detonation.

As for the oil issue, I can understand the need for a better oil cooler. Easy fix.

Ultimately the future of where this platform goes will be what stresses the stock components can handle. Limits of the fuel system and ability to upgrade. What power level internals can handle. Where the tranny will fail. These do have answers and it would be the greatest sticky ever for the N54 if we can get facts from experienced tuners.

[e.n335]

Originally Posted by ezatnova

W00T

That would be sweet if you sell your "standard stock N54" tune along with the Edit to give people a solid start, or for most people, all they ever need.

[Calgary Agent]

Originally Posted by Former_Boosted_IS

The pressure drop is significant in only that it should drive the turbos harder to make up the difference...

Exactly. Pushing the turbos beyond 14psi is apparently outside of their efficiency range *I qualify this as I haven't seen the efficiency islands for the Mitsi turbo maps on the N54*. Can you do it? Sure. Will it impact the life expectancy of the turbos? Absolutely.

[Former_Boosted_IS]

Originally Posted by Calgary Agent

Exactly. Pushing the turbos beyond 14psi is apparently outside of their efficiency range *I qualify this as I haven't seen the efficiency islands for the Mitsi turbo maps on the N54*. Can you do it? Sure. Will it impact the life expectancy of the turbos? Absolutely.

Calgary, can you post up those maps? I and many others would LOVE to see this. The arguments end when documented facts appear. That is what we all want is documented facts.

[Calgary Agent]

Originally Posted by Former_Boosted_IS

Calgary, can you post up those maps? I and many others would LOVE to see this. The arguments end when documented facts appear. That is what we all want is documented facts.

I think you misread what I wrote. I don't have the maps, nor does anyone that I know. They aren't something that Mitsubishi has put out into the public domain.

[Former_Boosted_IS]

Originally Posted by Calgary Agent

I think you misread what I wrote. I don't have the maps, nor does anyone that I know. They aren't something that Mitsubishi has put out into the public domain.

You must understand that it is hard for us to just take someone's word for it. This is the internet and many claim a lot of things. Garrett, turbonetics, etc. all make compressor maps public. I guess I don't understand what is in it for Mitsubishi to keep this private?

[oc24]

Originally Posted by lndshrk

MSD81 has barely hit the dealers - I need to find an MSD81 equipped car in
Utah - with a decent owner - order a spare DME for it - have the car and
the DME taken into the dealer and flashed to the same I-Level and have the
CAS programmed/synced - see the new DME start the car - then have the
owners original DME returned to the vehicle.

Then I can start analyzing that DME.

Is there really nobody in the state of Utah that has the MSD81 that would offer this to you? Cmon guys!

[judec]

Originally Posted by Former_Boosted_IS

You must understand that it is hard for us to just take someone's word for it. This is the internet and many claim a lot of things. Garrett, turbonetics, etc. all make compressor maps public. I guess I don't understand what is in it for Mitsubishi to keep this private?

These turbos are made to order for BMW. As MHI does not intend or expect to release them to public sales, they also dont need to publish their data. The only possibility would be to find similar MHI turbos whith such data available.

[ruxp]

2 questions

1. will it cause the flash counter to increment?

2. when can i buy it?

[e.n335]

Originally Posted by ruxp

2 questions

1. will it cause the flash counter to increment?

2. when can i buy it?

1. No
2. Shark Edit is announced for July 1st, 2008 for the MSD80

[judec]

Originally Posted by ruxp

2 questions

1. will it cause the flash counter to increment?

2. when can i buy it?

[e90AW335i]

Originally Posted by judec

+1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000

[jdink]

Originally Posted by e.n335

1. No
2. Shark Edit is announced for July 1st, 2008 for the MSD80

Will anyone still have MSD80 by then?

[judec]

ooops. I havent realized this thread is already on its 32nd page... hmmm.

Advice to all newcomers - Go to the top of the page -> Hit the "Search this thread" button -> Hit the "Advanced search" button -> insert "lndshark" to the "Search by User Name" field -> Hit he button

I suppose this way U can find most of the relevant info in this thread