[Southtown]

Ordered the Mishimoto for mine today.

[Kanrai]

Originally Posted by Southtown

Ordered the Mishimoto for mine today.

Same here. After the Dealer told me bmw always covers their mistakes. Hehe.

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by MineralGreyMetallic

I'm with you, at the moment.

We're already into the 2nd year of the G87.

If this was a statistically significant problem, the 2024 would have come with a shield.

The problem with this line of thinking is that this forum, or others like it, represent just a minute fraction of owners. There is no way to know how many issues have occurred based on this extremely limited sample size. What we do know, from just the few that we've seen is there is the potential for catastrophic engine damage if the oil cooler is punctured, and that it can be punctured while driving on public roadways.

Was not including protective screens a cost-cutting measure, most likely. I'm sure BMW looked at any previous similar incident that was reported to a dealership and ran the probability of that occurrence against the cost to equip every vehicle with screens. Or they simply said an incident will be deemed road hazard & not covered under warranty so F-it.

A good example of a similar issue is the new C8 Corvette. Huge radiators up front and right away owners started seeing damage from road debris. Aftermarket companies came out with protective screens & immediately both the head of Corvette and the lead engineer said those screens would reduce airflow to the radiators and potentially void the vehicle warranty.

Fast forward a year or so and GM licensed the screens from the aftermarket company, lists them as an available dealer-installed option (at a price hike of course), and miraculously they no longer restrict airflow or potentially void the warranty because GM is making money from their sale.

At the end of the day, it's a couple hundred bucks for added protection. We all spend that amount, and much more, on other "unnecessary" accessories/modifications (i.e., window tint, rear spoilers, front splitters, wheel spacers, etc.) and those individuals don't get blasted for doing so.

[KC87ZB]

Fresh install last night, peace of mind restored.

Remember, raw dogging usually leads to regret.

[Kanrai]

Probably was said already but it depends also where you live, being in MI with the roads out here during winter and spring, there are just rocks everywhere. But if I lived in so cal, no need at all.

The shit I have seen on these MI roads would turn your shit white…

[akumachu]

I made some post on this thread before and I just have another scenario that I didn't think of before.

To recap, I didn't think it was mathematically or physically possible for the car to go fast enough and the vacuum effect to hit the bottom. I confirmed that with several Physics phDs from MIT on that. (I worked with a lot of them).

Bouncing rock from car in front, I have a hard time believing that would happen until I figured out a scenario that is possible this past week.

A rock that kick up high from the car in front has less chance to get under the car but I realized this week the real likely scenario is more of a rock that got shot out almost horizontally while carrying high velocity but rolling on the road.

Since no rock is an actual ball shape, when the rolling rock hit a certain edge and convert the kinetic energy upward, that I think would have the potential force to hit the cooler with enough force to puncture.

How likely is that? I have absolutely no idea but I think that is possible. I think that is why this kind of incident is coverage by car insurance make sense.

With so many people driving while looking at their phones, I believe it is more likely to get rear ended than that scenario. So both are insurance claim so personally I am not going to worry about that scenario.

I do think curb the car to damage that is most common case.
And that certainly has to do with ride height.

So the next statistic would be interesting is how many lowered cars have this problem as compare to stock?

[ourlee]

Remember, raw dogging usually leads to regret.

Top 5 line in my year on here

[M2BOT]

Originally Posted by M2siast

Precisely why it’s impossible for those to hit the oil cooler.

Impossible? A thrown rock can ricochet from the ground and bounce to hit the cooler. Impossible? It’s happened plenty already. Is everyone just lying?

[M2siast]

Originally Posted by M2BOT

Impossible? A thrown rock can ricochet from the ground and bounce to hit the cooler. Impossible? It’s happened plenty already. Is everyone just lying?

I’d just have to see one to believe it. That’s why I said mythbusters could help us.

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by M2siast

I’d just have to see one to believe it. That’s why I said mythbusters could help us.

From a physics perspective, if a rock could bounce up and hit the oil cooler in the X3MC (my wife's has several damaged fins and evidence of rock hits), could it also not bounce up & hit the oil cooler on the M2?

[M2siast]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

From a physics perspective, if a rock could bounce up and hit the oil cooler in the X3MC (my wife's has several damaged fins and evidence of rock hits), could it also not bounce up & hit the oil cooler on the M2?

The fins are extremely malleable, they bend with air under strong pressure (there’s no pressure where they are, just making the point). They don’t represent the oil ducts, which are stronger.

So, smaller particles in suspension (like dust) in high velocity can bend the fins.

We’re talking about oil-duct-puncturing rocks (they have to have substance). I can’t see those bouncing and travelling back. Dust can spiral in the air, not rocks like that. That’s my contention, and has been since the beginning.

I’d like to be wrong but I haven’t seen any evidence to the contrary, I’d like to see it. Your X3 is a good example, why didn’t the cooler fail? My M2 had 2 fins that weren’t straight, I pushed them back without any force. You touch it, it’s bent.

We have to remember the oil cooler is:
- just behind the front bumper
- facing down at a slight backwards angle
- hidden behind an air dam

It’s impossible for something to hit it “face-first”. We’re advocating a rock bounces just right to do a 45 angle bounce and hit it with enough force to kill it. That rock would’ve had to be thrown from a position higher than the cooler itself for it to conserve any energy to bounce up and hit the cooler, would it not? If a tire picks it up it’s not likely that height is the same.

Could it happen? How can we see it? Myth busters please!

[Tag]

Originally Posted by M2siast

It’s impossible for something to hit it “face-first”. We’re advocating a rock bounces just right to do a 45 angle bounce and hit it with enough force to kill it. That rock would’ve had to be thrown from a position higher than the cooler itself for it to conserve any energy to bounce up and hit the cooler, would it not? If a tire picks it up it’s not likely that height is the same.

Could it happen? How can we see it? Myth busters please!

Rocks are not perfect spheres and don't bounce like that. They're mostly irregularly shaped, some with sharp right angles and as they tumble at high velocity can take any number of trajectories including upward. A rock under a tire can also get kicked up into the oil cooler if happens to get pinched on the inner shoulder of the tire as the car runs over it.

[akumachu]

Originally Posted by Tag

Rocks are not perfect spheres and don't bounce like that. They're mostly irregularly shaped, some with sharp right angles and as they tumble at high velocity can take any number of trajectories including upward. A rock under a tire can also get kicked up into the oil cooler if happens to get pinched on the inner shoulder of the tire as the car runs over it.

Yup, the irregular shape was exactly the scenario I was describing above.

However, given the placement of our oil cooler underneath, I don't think our front wheels can turn enough to line up to to hit the cooler.

If I remember correctly the cooler sit further in front then the front axle, not behind.

[Tag]

Originally Posted by akumachu

Yup, the irregular shape was exactly the scenario I was describing above.

However, given the placement of our oil cooler underneath, I don't think our front wheels can turn enough to line up to to hit the cooler.

If I remember correctly the cooler sit further in front then the front axle, not behind.

Regarding the wheels, I meant a rock under the edge/shoulder of the tire can get pinched and kicked up, not getting slung from the rear of the tire. We also need to factor in that this car weighs nearly 4k lbs, so one corner is applying approximately ~1k lbs of force on a tire. I've seen rocks get pinched from the edge/shoulder of the tire and kicked up sideways on gravel roads as a car drives over them.

[Southtown]

Originally Posted by Kanrai

Same here. After the Dealer told me bmw always covers their mistakes. Hehe.

Just got an email that it’s back ordered 8-10 weeks…

[MineralGreyMetallic]

Rocks have been hitting radiators since they started being mounted to the front of cars over 100(?) years ago.

In fact, if I understand radiator design at all, that array of metal fins is protecting the tubing that carries the oil that's being cooled. The purpose of those fins is to be a heatsink. It's an efficient way to dissipate heat.

Something would have to completely penetrate that layer and then still have high enough velocity to then puncture the (metal) tubing carrying the oil.

I'm not trying to say anyone is right or wrong. Mostly I'm just trying to validate my understanding of radiators, so please correct me where I'm wrong.

Here's a good reference image where you can see the tubing that carries the liquid being cooled.

[Tag]

Originally Posted by MineralGreyMetallic

Rocks have been hitting radiators since they started being mounted to the front of cars over 100(?) years ago.

In fact, if I understand radiator design at all, that array of metal fins is protecting the tubing that carries the oil that's being cooled.

Something would have to completely penetrate that layer and then still have high enough velocity to then puncture the (metal) tubing carrying the oil.

I'm not trying to say anyone is right or wrong. Mostly I'm just trying to validate my understand of radiators, so please correct me where I'm wrong.

The fins are there to radiate the heat. Radiator guards are for protection.

[MineralGreyMetallic]

Originally Posted by Tag

The fins are there to radiate the heat. Radiator guards are for protection.

Yes, I forgot to be explicit about that in my post, but had edited after you responded.

[Kanrai]

Originally Posted by Southtown

Just got an email that it’s back ordered 8-10 weeks…

Same here, called them they said might be more by mid Feb, so might not be that long of a wait.

[akumachu]

Originally Posted by Tag

Regarding the wheels, I meant a rock under the edge/shoulder of the tire can get pinched and kicked up, not getting slung from the rear of the tire. We also need to factor in that this car weighs nearly 4k lbs, so one corner is applying approximately ~1k lbs of force on a tire. I've seen rocks get pinched from the edge/shoulder of the tire and kicked up sideways on gravel roads as a car drives over them.

It does not matter how fast and how heavy the force involve in the scenario is, if the trajectory can never get to the cooler, it does not matter. If your argument was drive backward, that would be valid.

I just saw there is a picture above and we could clearly see the front most edge of the tires are behind the cooler. So unless you are driving backward to shot the rock forward, the front tires driving forward can't shot anything forward.

I mean, we don't see rocks coming out in the front of the car when you drive forward regardless how fast or how you turn, right?

[Tag]

Originally Posted by akumachu

It does not matter how fast and how heavy the force involve in the scenario is, if the trajectory can never get to the cooler, it does not matter. If your argument was drive backward, that would be valid.

I just saw there is a picture above and we could clearly see the front most edge of the tires are behind the cooler. So unless you are driving backward to shot the rock forward, the front tires driving forward can't shot anything forward.

I mean, we don't see rocks coming out in the front of the car when you drive forward regardless how fast or how you turn, right?

If a rock is run over on the edge of a tire it can go in any number of directions depending on multiple variables such as the shape of the rock and where it gets pinched on the tire.

[Rx-7ames]

Originally Posted by FrankWhite!

Can’t take the risk and it’s cheaper than
1. An insurance claim
2. A new oil cooler
3. A new engine
4. Piece of mind

For the price of my deductible it was a no Brainer for me! I Installed mine the same time as my break-in service and was nervous the entire 1200 miles.