[JLed79]

I was just talking this over with a buddy of mine the other day and we both found it interesting that the X1 reports we've read regard it as having the best steering feel BMW has out out in a long long time. I haven't driven one personally, but it's proported to be reminiscent of the glory days of BMW, almost an E30 type steering feel. If that's truly the case it kinda bums me out that I got a '13 X3 for the wife a couple months before the X1 was available. Granted, the X1 is probably too small for our needs. I still may take one for a spin to see how it feels compared to the reviews I've read.

[BMWrules7]

Originally Posted by wilbur_the_goose

BMW seems to be a victim of the Euro economy. The new 3-series is back to a 4 cyl, and people are complaining about degradation of quality.

Do you think the E9x or even the E46 was the best BMW will ever produce? Or, are BMW's best days in front of it?

No. I think bmw has a chance to clobber the market. Electric steering's main improvement is the capability to interface with driver assistance systems.

People cry about the feel of electric steering. But, if the car ends up driving you to work, you won't feel the steering anyway.

BMW has a brilliant manufacturing process. I always say, "BMW doesn't build cars, BMW builds machines that build cars."

Plus, the driver assistance have come a long way. It does bother me that BMW tv puts out videos that my F2 can send emails via voice control when it fails to work in the USA. Plus, the apple iphone interface defect is unforgivable, especially when we buy iphone specific enhancements like BMW apps.

[JLed79]

Plus, the apple iphone interface defect is unforgivable, especially when we buy iphone specific enhancements like BMW apps.

I couldn't agree more. I'll never get BMW apps again. What a disappointment.

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by JLed79

I was just talking this over with a buddy of mine the other day and we both found it interesting that the X1 reports we've read regard it as having the best steering feel BMW has out out in a long long time. I haven't driven one personally, but it's proported to be reminiscent of the glory days of BMW, almost an E30 type steering feel. If that's truly the case it kinda bums me out that I got a '13 X3 for the wife a couple months before the X1 was available. Granted, the X1 is probably too small for our needs. I still may take one for a spin to see how it feels compared to the reviews I've read.

Steering feel between the two is very noticeable, and you are correct that the X1 is much smaller inside than the X3 and a lot of the little details like the tie down rings in the trunk were skipped. It's a lot of fun though.

[JLed79]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Steering feel between the two is very noticeable, and you are correct that the X1 is much smaller inside than the X3 and a lot of the little details like the tie down rings in the trunk were skipped. It's a lot of fun though.

Congrats on owning one of the modern greats. Enjoy it in good health. I guess I will resign myself to driving her X3 when I have to and settling with my E90 M3

On a sidebar, how's the motor in that thing sound? Just this morning I told myself a funny while driving her car. We had just dropped one boy off at the sitter and when getting back on the road a truck was coming up behind us somewhat quickly. I hit the sport button and got on it and the engine sound made me quote the movie Elf in my head. "Ooooh, you're an angry little elf!" The turbo 4 is great on gas and has decent power, but man it sounds like a pissed off little diesel.

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by JLed79

Congrats on owning one of the modern greats. Enjoy it in good health. I guess I will resign myself to driving her X3 when I have to and settling with my E90 M3

On a sidebar, how's the motor in that thing sound? Just this morning I told myself a funny while driving her car. We had just dropped one boy off at the sitter and when getting back on the road a truck was coming up behind us somewhat quickly. I hit the sport button and got on it and the engine sound made me quote the movie Elf in my head. "Ooooh, you're an angry little elf!" The turbo 4 is great on gas and has decent power, but man it sounds like a pissed off little diesel.

Haha, it sounds pretty good, just the classic straight six sound, slightly muffled from the n/a days though. My wife's previous car was an N54 135i that didn't have as much turbo noise as this N55 (which is carrying around a good bit more weight). It still has the DI sound at idle, so sounds a little diesel-ish.

I like your combo of cars, I've debated getting an E90 M3 to replace the M Coupe I had for a dozen years, but I really want something lighter and just a touch less thirsty. I think they're keepers though and being the last of the n/a M cars it should really have a solid place in history. I haven't completely resigned from picking one up though.

[JLed79]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Haha, it sounds pretty good, just the classic straight six sound, slightly muffled from the n/a days though. My wife's previous car was an N54 135i that didn't have as much turbo noise as this N55 (which is carrying around a good bit more weight). It still has the DI sound at idle, so sounds a little diesel-ish.

I like your combo of cars, I've debated getting an E90 M3 to replace the M Coupe I had for a dozen years, but I really want something lighter and just a touch less thirsty. I think they're keepers though and being the last of the n/a M cars it should really have a solid place in history. I haven't completely resigned from picking one up though.

I agree. It is a thirsty car. I also think the tank is just a bit too small making fill ups too frequent. I do think it's a good balance of cars though. We have the space and utility we need out of her car and it does surprisingly well on gas. I live in a very hilly area and we average 26 to 27 mpg in her car. Not too bad. So with the offset of the 15-16 I get in my car it all averages out to be not too bad. Some E90 M3 owners have reporterd much better mpg, but I drive it like an M. Why have that power if you're not gonna use it.
I definitely love the NA V8. I don't have any idea what I will replace it with when that time comes. There's nothing out there that does it for me like my car does. Fortunately that decision is a long time off for me. I plan on driving it into the ground. I've never been so enamoured with any car and I've had my fair share of fun cars. I will say that the 135i Msport 6MT impressed me far more than I expected it too. That is a light and nimble little rocket. Not too thirsty either comparitively.
Those M coupes are sweet too! Do you still have it?

[Red Bread]

Sold it about a year ago, which was difficult, but I'd had my fun with it. Tracked it plenty, moved from Texas to California and back with it and it was bullet proof and always put a smile on my face. I switched jobs and went from a 60 mile roundtrip day to 4 miles r/t and it never got a chance to get the oil temp up and I just felt bad doing that to it, so I have a beater now and have been looking for an appropriate weekend car.

I intended to buy a Boxster Spyder, but the new one is proving to be tempting too, and I keep bouncing back to an E90 M3, a BRZ or a 993. In other words, I don't really have a clue what's next.

The 1er was fun, but the lack of an LSD just makes for a really limited car, I can't understand why BMW doesn't offer a real LSD as an option on their non-M cars. The M235i seems promising, but I'm sure the M2 will be much better sorted. I'm patient, I will likely wait to see what happens on that front before making a decision, unless Subaru sorts out a BRZ STI or Porsche gets serious about a Cayman GT3 first.

[JLed79]

I can see that. The lack of a LSD is a big let down. Hopefully you find something you like. My obviously biased vote would be for the E90, but the other cars you mentioned aren't too shabby either! Good luck!

[ChrisK]

I spent some time behind the wheel of a brand new F30 and I was really disappointed in the quality. Thought my Nissan had a better quality interior.
I will never give up my e92 M3 now. My next car will most likely be a Porsche.

BMW is trying to be something to everyone. They need to stop with the GM strategy IE X1,X2,X3,X3,X4,X5,X6,X7,X8,X9.

I still cant believe they pulled this M3/M4 nonsense with the iconic M3 badge.

[JLed79]

Originally Posted by ChrisK

I spent some time behind the wheel of a brand new F30 and I was really disappointed in the quality. Thought my Nissan had a better quality interior.
I will never give up my e92 M3 now. My next car will most likely be a Porsche.

BMW is trying to be something to everyone. They need to stop with the GM strategy IE X1,X2,X3,X3,X4,X5,X6,X7,X8,X9.

I still cant believe they pulled this M3/M4 nonsense with the iconic M3 badge.

Yep, I'm right there with you. I was given an F30 335 as a loaner when my E90 was in for service. What an underwhelming experience to say the least.
And regarding the nonsensical models, what the heck is up with the M6 Gran coupe? How is it any different than the F10 M5 aside from some aesthetic differences? Maybe its just me, but I see no viable market for that car.

[Red Bread]

I do agree, the countless iterations of the F3x chassis are just pulling things in too many directions and then add in the lines and you have a million iterations of what used to just be a choice between a sedan, a coupe, a convertible or a wagon, with the colors you wanted and few basic options. If you missed one or two options, you still had a fundamentally sound car that wasn't far removed from differently optioned cars. Now it seems like you can easily screw yourself out of a fun to drive car if you miss one tick box.

I know the incremental cost to develop an ugly hatch from the existing LWB sedan is small, but if they just put all of their resources into getting the core product right and skipped the GT and GC and six slices of SUV on top of it, I have to think they'd have happier, more faithful customers. The current trend appears to grow customers over all other consideration and keep throwing marginally different products out there until you can't slice it any finer.

I'll also add the the seemingly arbitrary exclusion of manuals from the F31, the 32"8"d and xDrive 328i sedans plus not being able to get the N55 in the F31 are increasingly frustrating. There was a point that you could do really strange things like get an E38 7er with a manual or an X3 and X5 if you really wanted to. I sort of miss the days that if you wanted something, even if it seemed stupid, BMW would sell it to you.

[JLed79]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

I do agree, the countless iterations of the F3x chassis are just pulling things in too many directions and then add in the lines and you have a million iterations of what used to just be a choice between a sedan, a coupe, a convertible or a wagon, with the colors you wanted and few basic options. If you missed one or two options, you still had a fundamentally sound car that wasn't far removed from differently optioned cars. Now it seems like you can easily screw yourself out of a fun to drive car if you miss one tick box.

I know the incremental cost to develop an ugly hatch from the existing LWB sedan is small, but if they just put all of their resources into getting the core product right and skipped the GT and GC and six slices of SUV on top of it, I have to think they'd have happier, more faithful customers. The current trend appears to grow customers over all other consideration and keep throwing marginally different products out there until you can't slice it any finer.

I couldn't have said it better myself. Literally, I couldn't if I tried. Complete agreement here.

[Bm4Mee3]

bought my first bmw 6 weeks ago its the 318i 2008 facelift model and i must say im not impressed with the car its all i ever wanted been driving fords,vw,eg for 15 years and thought it was time for an upgrade only to find out i should have kept my wee focus

[Rover]

Originally Posted by Bm4Mee3

bought my first bmw 6 weeks ago its the 318i 2008 facelift model and i must say im not impressed with the car its all i ever wanted been driving fords,vw,eg for 15 years and thought it was time for an upgrade only to find out i should have kept my wee focus

A 318i...are you sure? That would suggest it is a non-turbo 4 cylinder. Don't think they sold those in the US in 2008.

Second...if you are only driving to and from the grocery store...I'd also vote for a Ford or VW.

Truly....few, few folks would have the same impression you have. Just look at the test reports in any magazine or website. The 3 series is a king in the handling department....and probably more reliable than the Ford or VW (Consumer Report).

[Rover]

Originally Posted by ptack

Gee, it's a good thing BMW's are not reknown for their handling or that might mean their cars are getting, big, boring and overpriced like the loaner I got. C&D, which admittedly worships the 3, just found the F30 worse than a Lexus in a comparison which is like a nun thinking a televangelist is more interesting than the pope.

Actually...the F30 outperforms the Lexus IS..and the EX350...in the mags...by some distance. Only C/D has the Lexus winning by 240 to 239...due mostly to ride quality. THE 3 series out performed the Is in engine performance (in all performance categories including Gas mileage)...braking...G force...etc in the C/D. Read the other Mags...and then read Edmunds recent review.

[Rover]

Originally Posted by davesaddiction

The M135i and upcoming 2-series give me hope, as does the lightening of the new M3/4, but the loss of NA engines and hydraulic steering is of serious concern.

The Cadillac ATS beat the new 3-series in a recent comparison in handling feel and fun-to-drive, fercryinoutloud!

Those are subjective measures. And even with those measures...the F30 is still declared the better car overall...in most all publications. And that is before considering the reliability issue. Recent Consumer Report gives the F30, 328i...its top reliability rating. Cadillac is average...2 rungs lower.
Then add in re-sale....and the choice becomes even clearer.

[Rover]

Originally Posted by ptack

Ha - Edmunds picks an IS250 and complains about the power and tires where as you could spec an IS 350 with sport wheels and tires for the same price as the 328i. I think the winner of that comparison would have been different.

You need to see the new Edmunds video comparing the 328 vs IS250 F Sport vs Cadillac CTS. Here is the order of their selection. BMW...Cadillac...IS250.
Google it!

When you add in...reliability measures...and re-sale...the BMW would run away from the group. (Yes....Consumer Report now gives the F30 328 its highest reliability rating. As well...Kiplinger gives the 328....a higher resale value vs cost...than the other two cars).

[davesaddiction]

Quote from that recent C&D article, where the 335 lost to the Lexus IS350:

"Compared with the other two cars here, the BMW feels immense and slow-witted."

Sad. I love my car, but let's not become BMW apologists here...

Here's the link: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test

More:

"Few can fathom that sort of unwavering discipline. BMW maintained such a regimen for years, and it has shown in the continued excellence of its cars. But after we cycled through the cars on our Hill Country loop, the question on everybody’s mind was one vocalized by technical editor K.C. Colwell: “Is it possible that the BMW has the worst steering here?” With the F30, BMW wavered. This is the first 3-series that feels less thoroughly engineered than its competition. It’s competent, it’s spacious, it’s comfortable; but in comparison with other cars in its segment, the 3-series is undercooked."

[davesaddiction]

Originally Posted by Rover

The 3 series was a king in the handling department....

Fixed. Let's hope they get their crown back with the new M3/4...

[mgacarnut]

Bought my wife a new Audi A4. My 2006 E90 is a much better driver's car. Not the fit and finish of the Audi, but much more of a Sports sedan.

[davesaddiction]

Originally Posted by mgacarnut

My 2006 E90 is a much better driver's car.

No dispute from me on the E90. Only problem I have with it is the weight.

Have you driven the new 3-series yet?