[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

Those were the days.



Every platform and forum has tuner wars. Without them these forums are pretty boring. There is also a lot of background grudges, politics and everything else that the majority don't even know or realize. Especially when things are mentioned between the lines. There is a lot of sugar coating in here. At the end of the day, you can read into this all and take it with a grain of salt and enjoy your car, that's what matters at the end of the day.

Agree 100%

[NickBlaine]

Originally Posted by mike5809

I feel like I am back in the DSM world listening to Dave Buscher and all the other tuners argue with each other

That guy was such a dick.

[OB]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

Those were the days.

Every platform and forum has tuner wars. Without them these forums are pretty boring. There is also a lot of background grudges, politics and everything else that the majority don't even know or realize. Especially when things are mentioned between the lines. There is a lot of sugar coating in here. At the end of the day, you can read into this all and take it with a grain of salt and enjoy your car, that's what matters at the end of the day.

Most confusing part of this thread is why Motiv is mentioned here, they are a separate entity and before someone says cause Jake is there now, that is irrelevant because it is a separate business.

Jeff, MOTIV was mentioned only because Nishan tuned the car to 90% and then left for MOTIV.
But the work was done while playing for PTF.

[musc]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

This thread reminds me of the old days of JB4 (Terry) vs Procede (Shiv)
an honest review thread derailed and became a tuner war
Also people please stop your one page replies


Edit: i probably should say JB3/JB4

lol, but some of those threads were great. E90post should let Terry come back since Shiv has all but disappeared.

And some of these monster paragraphs are just too cluttered to read

[Give_Em_The_DD]

I prefer the RB vs Vargas battles, but this is pretty entertaining

[stanlalee]

What's funny is the legitimacy of who is really better at tuning can't be answered by virtually anybody in this thread. They say only a ninja can kill a ninja. Only a good tuner is qualified to judge the ability of another tuner. Most of you are going to be a victim of your own ignorance. Your competence in assessing the best tuner (yes that includes me) is about as reliable as picking a number out a hat. You can't ask the questions you should ask because you don't know them and if they answered the technical stuff you still wouldn't understand it.You aren't purchasing a tune your purchasing their brain...but carry on for my entertainment purposes.

[Aerotest]

Originally Posted by stanlalee

What's funny is the legitimacy of who is really better at tuning can't be answered by virtually anybody in this thread. They say only a ninja can kill a ninja. Only a good tuner is qualified to judge the ability of another tuner. Most of you are going to be a victim of your own ignorance. Your competence in assessing the best tuner (yes that includes me) is about as reliable as picking a number out a hat. You can't ask the questions you should ask because you don't know them and if they answered the technical stuff you still wouldn't understand it.You aren't purchasing a tune your purchasing their brain...but carry on for my entertainment purposes.

Yeah but one of these tuners atleast lets you see up the skirt....the other hides behind the cloak of intellectual property claims. I think the business model is changing and some are feeling the shift.

[musc]

Originally Posted by stanlalee

What's funny is the legitimacy of who is really better at tuning can't be answered by virtually anybody in this thread. They say only a ninja can kill a ninja. Only a good tuner is qualified to judge the ability of another tuner. Most of you are going to be a victim of your own ignorance. Your competence in assessing the best tuner (yes that includes me) is about as reliable as picking a number out a hat. You can't ask the questions you should ask because you don't know them and if they answered the technical stuff you still wouldn't understand it.You aren't purchasing a tune your purchasing their brain...but carry on for my entertainment purposes.

You assume that everyone here is a complete idiot and knows nothing about tuning on this platform. Good thing there are no ninjas on this forum.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by OB

Jeff, MOTIV was mentioned only because Nishan tuned the car to 90% and then left for MOTIV.
But the work was done while playing for PTF.

I just don't think it's fair to call out a company that really didn't tune your car, that's all but hey I guess it's none of my business since it's not mine.

[OB]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

I just don't think it's fair to call out a company that really didn't tune your car, that's all but hey I guess it's none of my business since it's not mine.

I think you're right actually, even though that Nishan moved on to Motiv the work was done while being at PTF and then the work was passed along.
Removed Motiv from the thread title.

[WedgePerformance]

Originally Posted by Manny_World

Every year there's a big pissing contest between two top notch vendors .

This started off with a good review and then the thread turned south quick. Couldn't make it pass page 2 of this thread due to so much shit slinging. However, the comments above gives me hope that the experts could come together to continue developing great things and move the whole community forward.

Thanks for the kind words and look forward to seeing some really big developments soon.

[WedgePerformance]

Originally Posted by proTUNING Freaks

Given you're stooping to the level of posting previous WhatsApp messages how about disclosing you went to a dyno day with your touted aggressive map a few months back only to make 30whp LESS on the SAME dyno SAME day than a car we tuned remotely thousands of miles away That, Ken, is what years of tuning on the same platform over and over again provides you with. That is what a complete tune looks like. We're happy to learn that your future customers will benefit from that dyno session and knowledge gathered as it has introduced more appropriate timing curves with Wedge tunes. If it weren't for those unfortunate blown motors and seeing a PTF car on the same dyno same day with your car make considerably less power and for Dimitri helping you Wedge tunes would still have those table top 15-16* timing curves out there with literally no consideration of engine theory and tuning principles.

Advice: http://www.efi101.com/ ... SIGN UP!

Based on our conversions and from the information I gathered from OP, you had no intention of fixing Ops torque issue. Car ran fine in 3rd and 4th gear, right. Can’t be fixed without Alpina flash, right! But now it's fixable? Honestly, you need to apologies to OP rather than trying to make it his fault for not getting back to you.

Yes, I dyno'd. It was actually a week prior to the dyno day and yes it made less power than the PTF car did on the dyno day a week later.

What you failed to tell people (which you do a lot) was that tune actually put down better ETs at the track the week prior than the PTF car which made more power… It was consistently quicker than the PTF car which trapping 2 or 3 mph faster...

Just a week after that dyno day you claimed I was at, I went back to the same dyno and made more power than the PTF car…

We didn’t stop there… We increased the power even more and pulled off a Stock Turbo World Record with an Automatic transmission none the less. Yes, I did it in 5th gear which is closer to 1:1 than 4th before you go off telling people I broke some unwritten rule about doing a dyno pull in 5th as if less than 1:1 is fair against an MT car. Let’s just say that small advantage is offset by AT loss..

Let’s also to bring up the XI quarter mile, how is a .01 60’ that much better to pull off such a big gap in ET even though the PTF car trapped at a much higher speed? One week PTF tells everyone ET matters, the next week its trap speed. Did you also tell everyone we tuned this car is 6 days from Thousands of Miles away and it’s not even close to being complete but set a WORLD RECORD ¼ Mile. Oh snap…

Please stop digging up the past as everyone knows that segment is history. I do not make stack flashes anymore because of people like you who have issues and like to blame others for their own ignorance. @BuraQ is responsible for our tuning and I handle ops. We both tune and test on our own cars which we do rigorously and share our results with each other just so we can do further testing prior to releasing performance enhancements to our customers. By assignment of duties, we can maintain a more consistent tune for all of our customers.

Bottom line, OP is happy and his car is faster regardless of your attempts to hijack this thread.


Pre-Dyno Day


Post-Dyno Day

[proTUNING Freaks]

Bottom line is you're just looking to continue arguing. No further comments, look into EFI 101 when you get a chance and start making your own tunes instead of blindly plagiarizing others based on logs that get posted online, taking timing curves from anything starting with the OFT (15deg timing tables), etc, as you've done in the past.

Its one thing to be passionate about something and another to be passionate as well as willing and able to understand what you're doing with tuning instead of just tinkering and throwing things together. You're catching on but its clearly a slow process and for once learn to spell your partner's username, its BuraQ lol not BaruQ

[LMB335IS]

I crown PTF as the most argumentative by a nearly 2 to 1 margin. PTF has 23 posts and Wedge/BuraQ a combined 12 in this thread. Thanks Ken and D, my car has never ran better or stronger.

[proTUNING Freaks]

Lol 24!

Cheers

[PR3CI5N]

I've been to the last two NFZ events and have been hoping to see either a PTF or Wedge/BuraQ FBO E60 Meth car that I could race in my FBO E60 Meth JB4 BMS E85 flashed 335i but no luck yet. I'll be at SS in April, maybe I'll have better luck then.

I will be racing my buddies FBO E60 Cobb (his own tuning) MT 335i within the next few weeks. He dynojetted 440/480. Footage coming soon

[WedgePerformance]

Originally Posted by PR3CI5N

I've been to the last two NFZ events and have been hoping to see either a PTF or Wedge/BuraQ FBO E60 Meth car that I could race in my FBO E60 Meth JB4 BMS E85 flashed 335i but no luck yet. I'll be at SS in April, maybe I'll have better luck then.

I will be racing my buddies FBO E60 Cobb (his own tuning) MT 335i within the next few weeks. He dynojetted 440/480. Footage coming soon

I'll be there in April. This will be my 4th Shift Sector. Hopefully there will be a better turn out of stock turbo cars this year also.

[PR3CI5N]

Originally Posted by WedgePerformance

I'll be there in April. This will be my 4th Shift Sector. Hopefully there will be a better turn out of stock turbo cars this year also.

I might not be on stock turbos still by April but that depends on when Pure finishes my stage 2's. Either way I know we'll race

Once I go Pure I actually might switch to you guys from my JB4/Backend setup but we'll see. We'll talk at SS

[PR3CI5N]

A few of us N54 guys will be at Fontana 1/4 mile early February if anyone in SoCal that uses PTF or Wedge/BuraQ would like to join. Sadly it's a slow track but it'd still be nice to compare on the same track. Then we'll have 1/4 mile and 1/2 mile comparisons

[BQTuning]

If any of our customers are going to one of these events mentioned above please let me know

[Give_Em_The_DD]

Originally Posted by BuraQ

If any of our customers are going to one of these events mentioned above please let me know

I'm always down to take a road trip

[onesuperboi]

Originally Posted by proTUNING Freaks

Bottom line is you're just looking to continue arguing. No further comments, look into EFI 101 when you get a chance and start making your own tunes instead of blindly plagiarizing others based on logs that get posted online, taking timing curves from anything starting with the OFT (15deg timing tables), etc, as you've done in the past.

Its one thing to be passionate about something and another to be passionate as well as willing and able to understand what you're doing with tuning instead of just tinkering and throwing things together. You're catching on but its clearly a slow process and for once learn to spell your partner's username, its BuraQ lol not BaruQ

I see more bashing of the tuner rather than tune itself. If you can't articulate why your tunes are better then maybe you guys don't have the technical knowledge that you think have...