[boostd92]

Originally Posted by joyride

You should also research a certain tuner and how he's acted in the past with the EVO crowd.

Shiv, don't be a d'bag and delete this like other things. Must be nice to filter out the stuff that doesn't go your way...

I'm not proud of everything I've done in my past, but that doesn't mean I can't improve/overcome.

I do find it funny however, that I didn't mention anyone's names, yet when I referenced someone with the best skills/competence/etc, you automatically assumed I was talking about Shiv.

That's a nice complement.

[Sneeze]

Originally Posted by thr33fivei

are you going to upgrade when this new bms board comes out?

edit that you were an Ex -JB3 User.

[M3_WC]

Originally Posted by r45t4m4n

I'm all for cheaper and more feature rich tunes. Its just insulting when features are being copied and re marketed as revolutionary, especially after being called pointless. Sounds like a play out of Apple's play book.

But won't it be amusing when Terry builds a tune with the same hardware and then sells it for half the price of Procede.

[ridin135]

Well can't say this is interesting but this does mean that in a couple months I will put back in the jb3 to try out the new version, until then the procede stays in.

[Sneeze]

Originally Posted by M3_WC

But won't it be amusing when Terry builds a tune with the same hardware and then sells it for half the price of Procede.

as a customer i dont see anything wrong with that.

[alpinedevil335]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

Some people really are clueless in this thread.

Firstly its not $1000.

Second, if you havnt driven with both and tuned with both nobody should be talking at all.

There are plenty of nut huggers on these forums, and plenty of people who jump on the bandwagon just to jump, or conclude stuff simply cause of what they have.... Finally, there are other people that just regurgitate what they read.... and are still left in the dark. (Here is a hint theres atleast 5 guys in this thread that have ran both tunes in the past 3 months... See what tune they run now... Heres a hint see my sig).

Try em both..... Then you will see the light.

I wonder how long the "$350" tunes will last till people still realizing what they are missing.

Your right its not....but close enough! and almost $700 to upgrade!! damn thats steep!...im sure the price will drop soon

[yandy]

Originally Posted by alpinedevil335

Your right its not....but close enough! and almost $700 to upgrade!! damn thats steep!...im sure the price will drop soon

Is this really your best argument? Are you trying to be informed or just blatantly put something down because you don't understand it or care to? I know, I was there, I defended it blindly.. I don't put it down.. but I learned my lesson..

[Bagelfast]

Originally Posted by alpinedevil335

Your right its not....but close enough! and almost $700 to upgrade!! damn thats steep!...im sure the price will drop soon

+1 it has to! Cuz for that price they can keep it!

2nd, if can does come out on the JB3, it is going to be ALOT CHEAPER thant he PROcede... Alot of people are mad because of this and hating but competition FTW...

[alpinedevil335]

Originally Posted by yandyr

Is this really your best argument? Are you trying to be informed or just blatantly put something down because you don't understand it or care to? I know, I was there, I defended it blindly.. I don't put it down.. but I learned my lesson..

Just stating facts buddy.
I understand it very well. Im not you so dont assume im doing what you did.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by thr33fivei

are you going to upgrade when this new bms board comes out?

If the opportunity arises where I can try it I would gladly do so...Moreover, If
I see fit I would gladly make the switch. I dont hug anyones nuts for tunes. Neither shiv nor Terry can give a damn what I do, and in the same respect I dont know them personally enough to do much for them.

I want whats best for my car. I've had several years of experience not only tuning my last few cars but several other people's cars in the past 5 years. (From street tuning, dyno tuning to internet tuning, N/A, turbo, Supercharger, and nitrous). I know what's correct and what isnt. I also have a handful of people I know that know plenty more then me. The tune I have right now is the ideal choice at this juncture.

As it stands in the future, Cp-E has what looks like a promising product coming out believe it or not when they too integrate CAN.

At that juncture combined with BMS' new juncture, IDK who will stand as the better tune for my needs.

There are def improvements to be made not only by Vishnu, and BMS, but every other tune for this car, compared to products Ive used before, they are all inadequate. I'll tell it like it is. Then again, they've also dealt with this Nazi like car, its ECU, its nannies and granny's and all its little quirks quite well, more then I can do personally, so i'll commend them all on that.

Unfortunately we have a complicated car, it really is at the end of the day. If people want to wait for upgrades, and wait for new things to come out and blah blah.... do what you want its your car and your money(as well as your time).

As far as the tuners themselves, they can all bicker back and forth to what they have, what they are going to do and what they did, and what they dont do.... thats cute.

You guys all need to realize one thing... they are in the business to make money, and im not against people making money.

I hope what everyone gets out of all this is there really isnt a "Right Answer" but there is a wrong answer.

There a plenty of people on these forums that have a solid background of tuning, and i mean real tuning, not this piggy back Bullsh*t. (People that tune their A/Fs, ignition, and paid attention to other aspects of tuning.

To those that are more amateur, and arent really up on that whole bit, stick to whatever you got, I'm sure you will be fine. (Just dont believe its safe to run large turbos and nitrous, and use methanol as fuel temporarily as its a band aid). I could careless if there car is till running right now on these mickey mouse tunes.... Cars just dont blow up cause of a "good enough" tune, but nobody said they will last. Hopefully these people have enough safety built in but thats a different discussion....

However, as people start pushing these upgraded turbo's and adding nitrous, and going bigger boost with this car, they will realize how inadequate these tunes become. Oh and sure I know you can "get away with them" thats cute, it really is, but there will still be a better alternative, maybe its not out yet, but there will be something better for peoples needs in the future.

I'm trying to bring my rant down to something people can just read in one paragraph so here it is for people that dont feel like reading:

For those with a tuning background and want to see what works best for your car right now, you need to try all 3 tunes.... Cp-E BMS and Vishnu.

I'm keeping GIAC out of this cause its not really a plug and play or piggy back system, its simpl reflash and I think thats a good solution too.

Anyway, after you try all of them it will be obvious once you try them which is going to work for you. I think CP-e and BMS have some improvements that will come in the future, so im not sure how they will stack up then.

For those who are content with run of the mill stuff, that gets the job done, stick with what you have, but if you havnt tried both or all 3, you really shouldnt be talking, you are in the dark.

There are a few different people on this forum and others that follow the same role. I'm going to name the people that should sit back on the sidelines and let the big people talk....

If you 1) Have only tried one tune, Get Lost
2) If you have no tuning background, Get Lost
3) If you just "read" forums and think you know enough, Get Lost

To anyone else, who doesnt fit in there, congrats, you might know something worth while talking about.

To anyone else using their gut instict, or stuck on marketing tactics, or just fell into a bandwagon, or like a tuner because of their actions or marketing practices, or whatever, I feel bad for you.

Seriously, good luck to everyone, i'm sure nobody is losing sleep over this, just remember, pull your heads out of your ass and think long and hard, do you want a good tune for your car, or do you want to suck at the teet of some tuner because you joined a bandwagon.

[yandy]

Originally Posted by alpinedevil335

Just stating facts buddy.
I understand it very well. Im not you so dont assume im doing what you did.

I'm not assuming, did you see the "?" at the end of that? oh wait.. probably not.. sorry to have upset you buddy..

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[alpinedevil335]

Originally Posted by yandyr

I'm not assuming, did you see the "?" at the end of that? oh wait.. probably not.. sorry to have upset you buddy..

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lol...child.

[itsbrokeagain]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

Some people really are clueless in this thread.

Firstly its not $1000.

Second, if you havnt driven with both and tuned with both nobody should be talking at all.

There are plenty of nut huggers on these forums, and plenty of people who jump on the bandwagon just to jump, or conclude stuff simply cause of what they have.... Finally, there are other people that just regurgitate what they read.... and are still left in the dark. (Here is a hint theres atleast 5 guys in this thread that have ran both tunes in the past 3 months... See what tune they run now... Heres a hint see my sig).

Try em both..... Then you will see the light.

I wonder how long the "$350" tunes will last till people still realizing what they are missing.

Ive driven both. Does that count?

I own neither one of them for that matter. Heck I dont even have a 335 anymore.


And I'll give you a hint too..its not whats in your sig. The Procede might have more bells and whistles to make that last 2hp over your buddy so you can have bigger balls than he does, but who gives a shit?

Both have their pros and cons. The Procede might feel a little more smoother in the midrange than the JB3 does, but I come from the import 4 banger community were its BAM power in your face. Thats how I like it, thats how Im used to driving cars, pedaling it in the turns to keep it under control. In a 240 or some other RWD car, it would still blaze the tires just like one of these would. To me a JB3 would suit my needs, it certainly is enough for my gf's car.

Ive gone from that to building and tuning air cooled flat six Porsche Turbo engines, 2 of them making 800+hp in change. And a little of everything else in between. The one thing that I've learned the most, after all these years of watching my bosses run their businesses, and whats most influential to me as I run my own business now, is customer service. That is the #1 priority.

There are a lot of us on here who know who stands out the most when it comes to that. And thats who I put my decision with.

[yandy]

Originally Posted by alpinedevil335

lol...child.

just trying to poke some fun.. no need for bikering.. oh and yes, deep down inside I am a child! and proud of it

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Matt@Camber-Toe

Ive driven both. Does that count?

I own neither one of them for that matter. Heck I dont even have a 335 anymore.


And I'll give you a hint too..its not whats in your sig. The Procede might have more bells and whistles to make that last 2hp over your buddy so you can have bigger balls than he does, but who gives a shit?

Both have their pros and cons. The Procede might feel a little more smoother in the midrange than the JB3 does, but I come from the import 4 banger community were its BAM power in your face. Thats how I like it, thats how Im used to driving cars, pedaling it in the turns to keep it under control. In a 240 or some other RWD car, it would still blaze the tires just like one of these would. To me a JB3 would suit my needs, it certainly is enough for my gf's car.

Ive gone from that to building and tuning air cooled flat six Porsche Turbo engines, 2 of them making 800+hp in change. And a little of everything else in between. The one thing that I've learned the most, after all these years of watching my bosses run their businesses, and whats most influential to me as I run my own business now, is customer service. That is the #1 priority.

There are a lot of us on here who know who stands out the most when it comes to that. And thats who I put my decision with.

You know what, I'll agree with you to an extent, but this is the best tune out there today.
Have you driven the latest V4 rev II, I think not? Have you had to deal with changing settings of the Jb3 on your GF's car? What sold you most on the Jb3 tunability? Or was it not that? That is my point. I think not.... Step aside man.

Your first mistake was thinking you should choose a tune based on HP or better yet that I did. Thats not what I did.

I come from the same 4cyl raw power, tuning bolgona so dont get it twisted im no euro fanboi here either.

So a Jb3 suits your needs, or better yet your Gf's needs, cmon bro, you cant bullshit a bullshitter... Your gf likes the tune so now we should agree with you that its "good enough". Great, you sound like the rest of these cluess pawns and yet you still claim to have a tuning background? Maybe you've been out of the loop on what exactly is missing from certain tunes.

As I said in my last post, all tunes available are inadequate in comparison to other tunes for other cars but we're stuck here.

You're customer service remark is the same "tune" no pun intended, that has been played since the time of the JB3. Yet Ive had no problems contact Vishnu and getting answer.

Moreover, why need customer service? A tune should just work, shouldnt it?

I rather not have to email my tuner 18 times a day to find out why my car is bogging on the 2-3 shift, or better yet the 3-4 shift.... Oh well I'll just send you another log of me shifting at 110 MPH, no PROBLEM, as long as the customer service is great.... Cmon man.... PLEASE.

Good enough for your GF?

[itsbrokeagain]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

There a plenty of people on these forums that have a solid background of tuning, and i mean real tuning, not this piggy back Bullsh*t. (People that tune their A/Fs, ignition, and paid attention to other aspects of tuning.

To those that are more amateur, and arent really up on that whole bit, stick to whatever you got, I'm sure you will be fine. (Just dont believe its safe to run large turbos and nitrous, and use methanol as fuel temporarily as its a band aid). I could careless if there car is till running right now on these mickey mouse tunes.... Cars just dont blow up cause of a "good enough" tune, but nobody said they will last. Hopefully these people have enough safety built in but thats a different discussion....

However, as people start pushing these upgraded turbo's and adding nitrous, and going bigger boost with this car, they will realize how inadequate these tunes become. Oh and sure I know you can "get away with them" thats cute, it really is, but there will still be a better alternative, maybe its not out yet, but there will be something better for peoples needs in the future.

This I will agree with...running nitrous+meth+21psi...I can only imagine how long these things will last.

I was never taught to tune with band-aids....to be honest I laughed when people insist on having to run meth or nitrous to support their mods. In all my years of tuning I never heard of such things. To me it just sounds like a way to make money, and I dont think half the people on here realize how dangerous nitrous really is, or how detrimental it can be. 10:1 compression engine and you are spraying 2 different power adders and piling 21psi into it. You can't change the laws of physics...and if you try to add that all up, well....it doesn't.

[alpinedevil335]

Originally Posted by yandyr

just trying to poke some fun.. no need for bikering.. oh and yes, deep down inside I am a child! and proud of it

bikering.....riiiight.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Matt@Camber-Toe

This I will agree with...running nitrous+meth+21psi...I can only imagine how long these things will last.

I was never taught to tune with band-aids....to be honest I laughed when people insist on having to run meth or nitrous to support their mods. In all my years of tuning I never heard of such things. To me it just sounds like a way to make money, and I dont think half the people on here realize how dangerous nitrous really is, or how detrimental it can be. 10:1 compression engine and you are spraying 2 different power adders and piling 21psi into it. You can't change the laws of physics...and if you try to add that all up, well....it doesn't.

Well you know the answer here...

My last car was an N/A car, with the addition of a supercharger and nitrous, tuned by me on a more or less standalone engine managment.

You know what made it safe.... one answer, CONTROL.

I tuned the IGNITION, Conservative, tuned the A/F conservative, had control for temperature changes, gear differences, load differences, failsafes in place for knock, and leaning out. This was all done on a car revving to 8600 RPM on 11:1 compression. Car still runs today with over 100K on the clock stock motor.

Back to my point though.... Control. That was my point. You should know more then anyone the only thing more frustrating then a bad tune is a tune you cant control with ease.

Oh and dont think im hating on you, if my GF had this car I would probably get her a Jb3 too, why? Its good enough for her, shes not tuning her car, she would just want something that works for a quick boost of power, however, I still wouldnt cal it ideal, but lets face it, it gets the job "done" and its cheap.

But shes not rolling around on stage 4+ and meth and isnt going WOT daily either so....

[yandy]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

If the opportunity arises where I can try it I would gladly do so...Moreover, If
I see fit I would gladly make the switch. I dont hug anyones nuts for tunes. Neither shiv nor Terry can give a damn what I do, and in the same respect I dont know them personally enough to do much for them.

I want whats best for my car. I've had several years of experience not only tuning my last few cars but several other people's cars in the past 5 years. (From street tuning, dyno tuning to internet tuning, N/A, turbo, Supercharger, and nitrous). I know what's correct and what isnt. I also have a handful of people I know that know plenty more then me. The tune I have right now is the ideal choice at this juncture.

As it stands in the future, Cp-E has what looks like a promising product coming out believe it or not when they too integrate CAN.

At that juncture combined with BMS' new juncture, IDK who will stand as the better tune for my needs.

There are def improvements to be made not only by Vishnu, and BMS, but every other tune for this car, compared to products Ive used before, they are all inadequate. I'll tell it like it is. Then again, they've also dealt with this Nazi like car, its ECU, its nannies and granny's and all its little quirks quite well, more then I can do personally, so i'll commend them all on that.

Unfortunately we have a complicated car, it really is at the end of the day. If people want to wait for upgrades, and wait for new things to come out and blah blah.... do what you want its your car and your money(as well as your time).

As far as the tuners themselves, they can all bicker back and forth to what they have, what they are going to do and what they did, and what they dont do.... thats cute.

You guys all need to realize one thing... they are in the business to make money, and im not against people making money.

I hope what everyone gets out of all this is there really isnt a "Right Answer" but there is a wrong answer.

There a plenty of people on these forums that have a solid background of tuning, and i mean real tuning, not this piggy back Bullsh*t. (People that tune their A/Fs, ignition, and paid attention to other aspects of tuning.

To those that are more amateur, and arent really up on that whole bit, stick to whatever you got, I'm sure you will be fine. (Just dont believe its safe to run large turbos and nitrous, and use methanol as fuel temporarily as its a band aid). I could careless if there car is till running right now on these mickey mouse tunes.... Cars just dont blow up cause of a "good enough" tune, but nobody said they will last. Hopefully these people have enough safety built in but thats a different discussion....

However, as people start pushing these upgraded turbo's and adding nitrous, and going bigger boost with this car, they will realize how inadequate these tunes become. Oh and sure I know you can "get away with them" thats cute, it really is, but there will still be a better alternative, maybe its not out yet, but there will be something better for peoples needs in the future.

I'm trying to bring my rant down to something people can just read in one paragraph so here it is for people that dont feel like reading:

For those with a tuning background and want to see what works best for your car right now, you need to try all 3 tunes.... Cp-E BMS and Vishnu.

I'm keeping GIAC out of this cause its not really a plug and play or piggy back system, its simpl reflash and I think thats a good solution too.

Anyway, after you try all of them it will be obvious once you try them which is going to work for you. I think CP-e and BMS have some improvements that will come in the future, so im not sure how they will stack up then.

For those who are content with run of the mill stuff, that gets the job done, stick with what you have, but if you havnt tried both or all 3, you really shouldnt be talking, you are in the dark.

There are a few different people on this forum and others that follow the same role. I'm going to name the people that should sit back on the sidelines and let the big people talk....

If you 1) Have only tried one tune, Get Lost
2) If you have no tuning background, Get Lost
3) If you just "read" forums and think you know enough, Get Lost

To anyone else, who doesnt fit in there, congrats, you might know something worth while talking about.

To anyone else using their gut instict, or stuck on marketing tactics, or just fell into a bandwagon, or like a tuner because of their actions or marketing practices, or whatever, I feel bad for you.

Seriously, good luck to everyone, i'm sure nobody is losing sleep over this, just remember, pull your heads out of your ass and think long and hard, do you want a good tune for your car, or do you want to suck at the teet of some tuner because you joined a bandwagon.

as many well thought out points as there are here. Sad to see that most will go to wast, because there're far to many as you call them nut huggers.

Originally Posted by alpinedevil335

bikering.....riiiight.

ok

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by yandyr

as many well thought out points as there are here. Sad to see that most will go to wast, because there're far to many as you call them nut huggers.



ok

I dont want people to get confused, neither shiv nor Terry Pays me or whoever the hell owns CP-E.

They all need work. Lots of work. Some of those companies might want to push for more of what I like to call Control. Other companies will leave them "good enough" for most of the public. As it is I told Terry months ago several things that needed to be changed with his tune to appease me, from what it sounds like he's trying to integrate them in the future. I'm not saying its my "idea". Im sure it wasnt 100%, but its people like me who tell a tuner what needs to change for the better of the community.

I can post some things about all 3 tuners that can make peoples head spin. Like I said, neither of them are paying me so i'll just leave it like that.

Whatever... as of June 23rd I dont know of a tune that works better for my car and what I like to have in it.

[Belarus]

Good read...

[rmdvrs]

Originally Posted by cn555ic

Thats the part that irritates me the most...I can understand changes with a tune, but it always after its being called pointless and useless, and then next thing you know its the next best thing!!! I can handle if it was outright stated that its a good feature that we will implement in the future, then to bash it outright in the onset of something new....So far I have not heard anything bad spoken about autotuning of the Procede from JB camp....I guess they have learned their lesson and realize that everything Shiv has come out with is GOLD!

Jeez, alot of you guys sound like apple, steve jobs, jesus phone loving fan boys. Like the one and only great iphone created everything and nothing else comes close and everything else is just imitated.

Things get created, then things get altered, repackaged or advanced. Its how technology has worked and will always work.

What I love the most is whenever there is a procede thread about the next upcoming thing its all great news, awesome and can't wait threads and when its something about JB every procede fan boy comes out of the woodwork that probably has never even met shiv acting like they spend all weekend with him stroking his d... and licking his n... talking about the shortcomings or reasons why JB is an imitator rather than an innovator.

BMS nor Terry has ever bashed any feature of procede on here and if you have been around long enough you would know that cause Terry does not post on the forum. Now Mike has made comments but none have been bashing. They have only been factual opinions on why CAN integration may or may not be useful or beneficial.

Mike does not represent Terry or his beliefs. He is just a person with his own opinions and a BMS retailer. Just cause he knows more than others doesn't mean he speaks for Terry.