[Sniz]

Originally Posted by techlogik

I think the problem at this point on the subject of timing control is entirely with Terry/Mike. They have themselves deep into this position that the DME can and does handle all timing related issues and enough logic built-in to the system, that is doesn't need external/altered timing to run higher boost safely. "As proven by the millions of miles and most tunes sold of any vendor on planet Earth."

Once you have yourself so deep on a position, you can't go back without completely losing all credibility. Right now, the don't seem to have any credibility with anybody who knows anything about FI tuning fundamentals, and the N54 is no different in regards to these principles.

But, I would like to pose the question to Mike/Terry. Why does every tuner out there who performs flashing, piggyback, or custom tuning of the N54, want to control timing directly? That is their position based on their experience. Controlling timing is fundamental as part of FI. Yet, Terry/Mike are the only ones that think it isn't necessary and the stock DME is more than sufficient to do it on the N54?

Do you guys have more insight and knowledge about the N54, DME and FI that is so far above and beyond the cumulative decades of FI experiences of other tuners?

you wont get an answer on that question, but the again you dont need one either

Originally Posted by TakeOne

CLAP,
Speaking of this, how is the CP-E standback coming along?

I dont think he's involved in that anymore.

speaking of CP-E, I was over there this week and spoke with one of their engineers who is no longer involved in BMW tuning. I told him about this monster of a thread and he said 'why is everyone angry w Terry....he's a good guy'.....then I told him they still insist that bouncing off the knock sensors is the best way to tune this car.

he laughed out loud and shook his head and said....'holy crap'

enough said

[InCityPhoto]

Originally Posted by Sniz

you wont get an answer on that question, but the again you dont need one either



I dont think he's involved in that anymore.

speaking of CP-E, I was over there this week and spoke with one of their engineers who is no longer involved in BMW tuning. I told him about this monster of a thread and he said 'why is everyone angry w Terry....he's a good guy'.....then I told him they still insist that bouncing off the knock sensors is the best way to tune this car.

he laughed out loud and shook his head and said....'holy crap'

enough said

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by TakeOne

CLAP,
Speaking of this, how is the CP-E standback coming along?

How do you think, I have not used it in probably over a year. The development and changes are lacking on their end due to heavy work load from whatever else they do currently. My contract is up, I am free to do what I want as long as it doesn't give away trade secrets.

[Jake@MOTIV]

Originally Posted by InCityPhoto

i dont understand what you are sighing about...i've read your posts so i know you don't understand tuning logic but do you understand that every professional tuner in the world that tunes cars follow the same tuning theory as it doesnt EVER change? Do you understand that a major goal of every tuner is to have the vehicle not ping once tuned?

[Sniz]

Originally Posted by InCityPhoto

Originally Posted by FlyLow335i

i dont understand what you are sighing about...i've read your posts so i know you don't understand tuning logic but do you understand that every professional tuner in the world that tunes cars follow the same tuning theory as it doesnt EVER change? Do you understand that a major goal of every tuner is to have the vehicle not ping once tuned?

InCityPhoto, what are you sighing about?

[Alpina_B3_Lux]

Originally Posted by FlyLow335i

Yep - there are a few that are compatible with the PIDs the OBDII on the bmw puts out. The only issue is that with all the tunes that have CAN integratoin (piggys) they OBDII style gauges won't be able to connect as the piggyback is taking priority.

Shouldn't the next boost gauge by Rixster solve this issue? As far as I know their new version should be compatible even with piggies (or a BT cable, for that matter) using the CANbus. See here: P3 Vent Gauge V2 - sales thread.

Alpina_B3_Lux

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Sniz

InCityPhoto, what are you sighing about?

He's on the bandwagon of riding the knock sensor is the most ideal way to tune a vehicle....

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

He's on the bandwagon of riding the knock sensor is the most ideal way to tune a vehicle....

Meanwhile he is wondering when cobb will have support for his car.....

[Sniz]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

He's on the bandwagon of riding the knock sensor is the most ideal way to tune a vehicle....

oh yeah thats right

[Forcefed3]

Originally Posted by Clap135

Meanwhile he is wondering when cobb will have support for his car.....

:facepalm:

[Sniz]

Originally Posted by Clap135

Meanwhile he is wondering when cobb will have support for his car.....

perhaps he will choose to raise the max timing set points with the ATR if he wants to emulate the JB style of tuning w a flash tuning platform.

I cant wait.

[InCityPhoto]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

He's on the bandwagon of riding the knock sensor is the most ideal way to tune a vehicle....

Originally Posted by Sniz

oh yeah thats right

What are you talking about?

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by InCityPhoto

What are you talking about?

[InCityPhoto]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

[dc5_champ88]

you all have WAY too much time to sit here and argue and argue with replies minutes and sometimes seconds after the other...do people not work anymore?

[RambleJ]

Originally Posted by JPSlick

He's on the bandwagon of riding the knock sensor is the most ideal way to tune a vehicle....

As am I and many other people. The N54 ECU seems to be able to handle it quite well.. Any proof otherwise? Aside from one person's stock logs? I would like to see other stock logs with proper fueling and temp info.
And when I refer to stock logs I am talking about no tune in place, not a tune that is bypassed either.

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Originally Posted by techlogik

I think the problem at this point on the subject of timing control is entirely with Terry/Mike. They have themselves deep into this position that the DME can and does handle all timing related issues and enough logic built-in to the system, that is doesn't need external/altered timing to run higher boost safely. "As proven by the millions of miles and most tunes sold of any vendor on planet Earth."

Once you have yourself so deep on a position, you can't go back without completely losing all credibility. Right now, the don't seem to have any credibility with anybody who knows anything about FI tuning fundamentals, and the N54 is no different in regards to these principles.

But, I would like to pose the question to Mike/Terry. Why does every tuner out there who performs flashing, piggyback, or custom tuning of the N54, want to control timing directly? That is their position based on their experience. Controlling timing is fundamental as part of FI. Yet, Terry/Mike are the only ones that think it isn't necessary and the stock DME is more than sufficient to do it on the N54?

Do you guys have more insight and knowledge about the N54, DME and FI that is so far above and beyond the cumulative decades of FI experiences of other tuners?

These threads have turned in to bash fests from the usual suspects with few technical arguments being made. A waste of time to participate at this point. But I'll offer you this. In addition to the JB line of products, SSTT, Helix Attache, Active Processor 2, PEZ, and VAC piggybacks rely primarily on the DME's adaptive system. There are more N54 tunes in use today that don't alter CPS for advance limiters than ones that do.

Sniz: You've been unable to follow even the most basic technical arguments here and simply are trying to bash me. Don't take this the wrong way but maybe its time to focus on your why your custom tuned large turbo car is only putting down 300hp.

Mike

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

These threads have turned in to bash fests from the usual suspects with few technical arguments being made. A waste of time to participate at this point. But I'll offer you this. In addition to the JB line of products, SSTT, Helix Attache, Active Processor 2, PEZ, and VAC piggybacks rely primarily on the DME's adaptive system. There are more N54 tunes in use today that don't alter CPS for advance limiters than ones that do.

Sniz: You've been unable to follow even the most basic technical arguments here and simply are trying to bash me. Don't take this the wrong way but maybe its time to focus on your why your custom tuned large turbo car is only putting down 300hp.

Mike

Notice that no1 in the right mind runs those tunes? They're all a joke.

[Forcefed3]

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

These threads have turned in to bash fests from the usual suspects with few technical arguments being made. A waste of time to participate at this point. But I'll offer you this. In addition to the JB line of products, SSTT, Helix Attache, Active Processor 2, PEZ, and VAC piggybacks rely primarily on the DME's adaptive system. There are more N54 tunes in use today that don't alter CPS for advance limiters than ones that do.

Sniz: You've been unable to follow even the most basic technical arguments here and simply are trying to bash me. Don't take this the wrong way but maybe its time to focus on your why your custom tuned large turbo car is only putting down 300hp.

Mike

I support BMS, but honestly, who uses those tunes? There are reasons they are not popular.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

So If I make a Mickey mouse tune that doesnt follow common tuning practices....Then its OK because its available and out there.

So it must be the best thing since sliced bread cause someone made an inferior product.

OR maybe the product was made for a certain price point knowing that forum communities as well as other noobs to the tuning world wouldnt know the difference and they just buy a product cause its cheaper.

Anyone know how the Terry tuner came about?

He was tired of all the high priced tunes available IIRC.

[Forcefed3]

To everyone personally insulting certain tuners, you might as well just have a civil conversation. Whose opinion would you value more, someone screaming at you or someone calmly explaining what they have to say? It amazes me that you all have not realized this yet.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

I'm waiting for someone without a JB to come in here and defend that it follows ideal common tuning practices...

I'm waiting.

Then I want to meet them and have them tell me with a straight face it is the most Ideal way of tuning a vehicle.

Waiting...