[Terraphantm]

Originally Posted by at21

Hi thanks for the quick response. Thanks for offering the 130i tune. I'm not sure if I have the Option Code 1CB (CO2 package) or not.
As Im not even close to computer savvy, I tried understanding all that was said on this thread. May I ask what is done to make the 125i back to 130i power levels?

Put the last 7 digits of your VIN in a decoder (like http://bimmer.work) and it'll tell you every option code your car has.

In this particular case, didn't have to do much to make 130i power. Just grabbed the E87 (hatchback) 130i tune and changed the powerclass to match the 125i.

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

must be 130i_EU_PowClass00.0da & 130i_EU_PowClass00_1CB.0da?

Yeah it should be those. Unless Australia got different tunes than the EU 125/130s, but I don't think that's the case.

[CobraMarty]

Can the ecu do flex-fuel? ethanol? Would just need a sensor?

[hassmaschine]

It shoudn't need anything really. Thats the advantage to using lambda - stoich is simply stoich. These cars have a really sophisticated O2 feedback system.

The old flex fuel GM cars needed an extra sensor because they were still basically running clones of 1980's Bosch hardware/software.

That said, who knows if the fuel system can keep up. And it remains to be seen if any gains are worth the hit in fuel economy

[Seattlesquash]

Originally Posted by atmosphericM

They've offered it for a while. The general consensus around here was that it probably isn't on par with BPC/AA. That said, I don't believe anyone around here has actually tested it..

Perhaps Turner could sponsor a member's car so that we can have some dyno results? Probably not, though. They have enough name recognition to sell products without worrying about forum presence.

On the Turner coding, pretty sure it is the AA program they are adding/including with their kit, at-least it used to.

[The-Traveler]

Have you guys published a 330i tune yet? Haas was saying he would cook one up, at some point. Would love to get a few ponies or loose a couple 1/10ths of L/100km.

[Pinscher]

Holy. It has been 2 weeks of reading this thread and I'm caught up and this thread is still going!

You guys are my official car heros, you know who I'm talking about. You're like the Jesus of BMW. Selfless and self sacrificing for generally neglected cars for all our community's benefit.

If I can read, which is sometimes questionable, the 328xi tunes are still in the works or are simply not required as the i tunes will suffice for?

[bryanjb]

since i'm still on deck for the 3IM install, i'll be content to continue learning as you all get the 328Xi working on the 330 tune. that said, thanks are due you V for the willingness to take a risk at this point with a slightly offspec tune.

just a thought on the oil level question, seems like doing an oil change and fill one quart at a time, checking the on-dash level, could go a ways to relieving the uncertainty about how much the oil level calibration inaccuracy *might* hurt if there is oil loss - at least until hass gets those tables correlated. i'll be changing mine shortly, so i'll report back on the stock tune and the correlation between quarts in and gauge level.

one additional thing i'll be considering is how the 330 tune might or might not play with my GM/AT. The 6MT is probably a safer increment to test, since interaction with the transmission is a non-issue.

again thanks V for getting this rolling, and hass, rjahl, freedomfries, and terraphantm for all the work toward making MS*80 tunable.

(another wagon guy with modest aspirations for improvement)

ETA - MS*80 ECU have the additional burden of the Infineon Tricore architecture, which makes all manner of tuning problems harder. I have not read of a single advantage for drivers over the MSV70 using the older chips - anybody got anything on this?

Originally Posted by vilord

My experience so far, with only about 25 miles on the 330i code, is that it works well.

It still is not clear what effect the changes to the oil level sensor will mean.
It could be that it will give me a low oil alert when i'm not actually low.
It could be that the gauge will read incorrectly. On mine, it reads in the same position as before the change, but that doesn't mean it will stay accurate through the entire range.
It could initiate limp-home when it isn't actually out of oil.
It could keep right on going *despite being out of oil*.

So, you have to decide for yourself whether you're willing to take those risks, or wait for hassmaschine or others to have time to go through more of the code blocks to find the oil level sensor values to bring the over from the xi.
It was much easier for the MSV70 conversion because there were 325i, 330i, 325xi, and 330xi released around the world, so differences were relatively easy to identify.

330 MSV80 code was only released to a small handful of vehicles.

[bryanjb]

some of the N54 guys are using E85 with tuning packages that allow substantially more ignition advance. i don't think that is possible *yet* with MS*70/80 since .xdfs needed for tunerpro aren't available - correct?

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

It shoudn't need anything really. Thats the advantage to using lambda - stoich is simply stoich. These cars have a really sophisticated O2 feedback system.

The old flex fuel GM cars needed an extra sensor because they were still basically running clones of 1980's Bosch hardware/software.

That said, who knows if the fuel system can keep up. And it remains to be seen if any gains are worth the hit in fuel economy

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by The-Traveler

Have you guys published a 330i tune yet? Haas was saying he would cook one up, at some point. Would love to get a few ponies or loose a couple 1/10ths of L/100km.

No not yet. Eventually but there are some things I want to build first.

Originally Posted by Pinscher

If I can read, which is sometimes questionable, the 328xi tubes are still in the works or are simply not required as the I tubes will suffice for?

I think realistically the 328i tune will work fine. I might just put it up with a disclaimer. And once you have a tune installed, when i do make a 328xi specific version, you can easily switch to it.

As far as coming down here - maybe, it just depends on when/where. Weekends are pretty much no-go, but I'm usually home Fridays. I'd think you wouldn't want to cross the border the next couple weeks, since it's a long weekend in both countries..

Originally Posted by bryanjb

since i'm still on deck for the 3IM install, i'll be content to continue learning as you all get the 328Xi working on the 330 tune. that said, thanks are due you V for the willingness to take a risk at this point with a slightly offspec tune.

just a thought on the oil level question, seems like doing an oil change and fill one quart at a time, checking the on-dash level, could go a ways to relieving the uncertainty about how much the oil level calibration inaccuracy *might* hurt if there is oil loss - at least until hass gets those tables correlated. i'll be changing mine shortly, so i'll report back on the stock tune and the correlation between quarts in and gauge level.

one additional thing i'll be considering is how the 330 tune might or might not play with my GM/AT. The 6MT is probably a safer increment to test, since interaction with the transmission is a non-issue.

again thanks V for getting this rolling, and hass, rjahl, freedomfries, and terraphantm for all the work toward making MS*80 tunable.

(another wagon guy with modest aspirations for improvement)

ETA - MS*80 ECU have the additional burden of the Infineon Tricore architecture, which makes all manner of tuning problems harder. I have not read of a single advantage for drivers over the MSV70 using the older chips - anybody got anything on this?

It's not going to make the oil level sensor stop working completely. It's hard to explain, but the thresholds are just a little different because the oil pan is shaped differently (but they hold the same amount of oil). I think it will be fine, but I wanted people to know who are trying it that it might not work perfectly.

I wouldn't worry about it not working with the AT. It's not like you're doubling the power - AT and MT engine tunes are the same anyway.

as far as Tri-Core, no real benefit - BMW just switched CPU architecture. In fact most of the program is identical. They just ported everything over from MSV70. There are a few more DTCs, and flashing via CAN is slightly faster, but it's not going to make more power or anything. The flip side is, I have 99% of the maps defined for MSV70 (all 9,000+ of them), while I only have about 50% in MSV80 (good thing is, most of them are useless).

Originally Posted by bryanjb

some of the N54 guys are using E85 with tuning packages that allow substantially more ignition advance. i don't think that is possible *yet* with MS*70/80 since .xdfs needed for tunerpro aren't available - correct?

I have my own XDFs, but Tunerpro is a waste of my time (bugs, lacking features), so I only use it as required - I'd rather work on my own tools.

[Terraphantm]

Originally Posted by bryanjb

ETA - MS*80 ECU have the additional burden of the Infineon Tricore architecture, which makes all manner of tuning problems harder. I have not read of a single advantage for drivers over the MSV70 using the older chips - anybody got anything on this?

The advantage is more for BMW I think. Tricore offers somewhat more robust security (password protection for boot mode, ability to protect sectors, and such), and BMW seemed to want to make their EWS4 implementations more secure. We've thoroughly broken security so now it's a moot point. I wouldn't say MSV70 is any easier or harder than the MSV80, except that we have more of the tune defined on the MSV70. In some respects the tricore is actually easier - The memory map is more rigid, so disassemblers handle it better. MSV70 seems to change the base address every now and then, which makes following code a little bit of a pain.

[Pinscher]

Originally Posted by bryanjb

I think realistically the 328i tune will work fine. I might just put it up with a disclaimer. And once you have a tune installed, when i do make a 328xi specific version, you can easily switch to it.

Pardon me, Is the 328i a "tune" meaning a stock 330i map or were you able to complete your parameter conversion over to the 328i as well?

[hassmaschine]

the '330i' spec tune has been available for the 328i for a long time now. It will work on the 328xi, with the disclaimer that the oil level sensor will function but may not be as accurate.

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by Terraphantm

The advantage is more for BMW I think. Tricore offers somewhat more robust security (password protection for boot mode, ability to protect sectors, and such), and BMW seemed to want to make their EWS4 implementations more secure. We've thoroughly broken security so now it's a moot point. I wouldn't say MSV70 is any easier or harder than the MSV80, except that we have more of the tune defined on the MSV70. In some respects the tricore is actually easier - The memory map is more rigid, so disassemblers handle it better. MSV70 seems to change the base address every now and then, which makes following code a little bit of a pain.

yeah, the only other thing is it's all little endian which messes with my head. Also, MS45 is far worse for the base address changing all the time. Ugh.

One thing I do like about PPC is the fixed width instructions. If you don't know what it is, assume it's a long word and move on with your life..

[bryanjb]

i guess from BMWs POV, a tuner is a hacker is a potential car thief, so if i were them, that's the rational i'd use to stuff enthusiasts too... /rant off

i was looking over the "crack the ECU" direct interface tools a while ago, and it didn't look like anyone had a way to plug into a JTAG / DME / whatever port on the tricore yet. that left me a little leery, since the implication is that the MSV80 can be bricked and unrecoverable. in any case, i bought an MSV80 ECU before i realized that, so if any of you guys could use it, drop me a PM. small offering i know, but it may be a useful item for experiments.

thanks for the insight on the freescale / MSV70 memory management. wasn't aware of the simplification in the tricore. i also recall that there are areas in the tricore that are write once, but that is bypassed with the RSA delete, IIRC.

i work with this stuff peripherally (not automotive - consumer products), so i have an inkling of just how much work it is to rev eng this stuff to functional assembly code, even with a disassembler. little endian... ever try a mirror in front of your screen?

Originally Posted by Terraphantm

The advantage is more for BMW I think. Tricore offers somewhat more robust security (password protection for boot mode, ability to protect sectors, and such), and BMW seemed to want to make their EWS4 implementations more secure. We've thoroughly broken security so now it's a moot point. I wouldn't say MSV70 is any easier or harder than the MSV80, except that we have more of the tune defined on the MSV70. In some respects the tricore is actually easier - The memory map is more rigid, so disassemblers handle it better. MSV70 seems to change the base address every now and then, which makes following code a little bit of a pain.

[hassmaschine]

We can recover a bricked tri-core in most circumstances. I had one where the checksum range got messed up - but Terra made a "force erase" tool that fixed it so I could flash again.

We can also boot into the Tricore if we have the password - but the DME has to be working to read the password, so if its completely dead, yeah theres nothing you can do.

Nice thing about disassembly is it knows it's little endian, so as long as you know its long/short it rearranges the bytes so you can read it easier. But if you're just using a hex editor, it sucks.

Memory management is easier because its all one file - while the PPC DMEs are 2 - 3 (4 in the case of mss6x, ugh). Now i have the memory mappings memorized which I'm not sure is a good thing...

[bryanjb]

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

I think realistically the 328i tune will work fine. I might just put it up with a disclaimer. And once you have a tune installed, when i do make a 328xi specific version, you can easily switch to it.

...

It's not going to make the oil level sensor stop working completely. It's hard to explain, but the thresholds are just a little different because the oil pan is shaped differently (but they hold the same amount of oil). I think it will be fine, but I wanted people to know who are trying it that it might not work perfectly.

I wouldn't worry about it not working with the AT. It's not like you're doubling the power - AT and MT engine tunes are the same anyway.

cool, didn't know the AT and MT tunes are the same...

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

...

I have my own XDFs, but Tunerpro is a waste of my time (bugs, lacking features), so I only use it as required - I'd rather work on my own tools.

if you're heading for offering a tool that exceeds tunerpro, count me interested. IIRC, your approach will use .xml rather than .xdfs?

[hassmaschine]

No - all in your browser. No files at all.

XDFs are sorta XML but they dont follow the standard. Thats just one problem..

I just made some changes to the server to support this - I think it could happen this year (and I've been working on it for 3).

[Terraphantm]

Originally Posted by bryanjb

i was looking over the "crack the ECU" direct interface tools a while ago, and it didn't look like anyone had a way to plug into a JTAG / DME / whatever port on the tricore yet. that left me a little leery, since the implication is that the MSV80 can be bricked and unrecoverable. in any case, i bought an MSV80 ECU before i realized that, so if any of you guys could use it, drop me a PM. small offering i know, but it may be a useful item for experiments.

About that...

[bryanjb]

durn... really glad you guys are on our side.
simply hats fracking off.

Originally Posted by Terraphantm

About that...

[R.Thillman]

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

the '330i' spec tune has been available for the 328i for a long time now. It will work on the 328xi, with the disclaimer that the oil level sensor will function but may not be as accurate.

Can you '330i' spec tune a n51 328i or is that not possible? I got AA headers and 3im looking for anything while i save up for a tune. thanks in advanced i know you guys are busy!

[Terraphantm]

Originally Posted by R.Thillman

Can you '330i' spec tune a n51 328i or is that not possible? I got AA headers and 3im looking for anything while i save up for a tune. thanks in advanced i know you guys are busy!

We can flash a "stock" 330i tune to it, but since the N51 has a different compression ratio, I'm not 100% sure it will drive well.

[Pinscher]

Well, I for one am quite excited for the 328xi tune. I just picked my 3SM on Saturday. vroom vroom!